Your hypocrisy kills me

[UtahOD]

There are a few of you that just love to go after an OD, huh? Some of you are very nice, but I have taken my share of lumps for some posting what would otherwise be accepted if it were posted by one of your little clique.

Before I even began posting here, I lurked and saw many of your reactions about how many of you were displeased with what chain opticians were doing to your profession. You took swings at cut-rate dispensing, etc.

So now, here comes an OD and several of you decide to gang up on the OD. You were quick to contradict me about prims and ended up with a whole lot of egg on your face. I am certain that I could do a little search and find posts by those very members of this forum that echo some of my sentiment, but of course, it cannot be true now, because an OD is typing it, right?

Tell you what - you all can go on living in your little cyber-world and pretend that you are kings of the world. Enjoy. I have tired of your petty little attacks and motives. I have a lot to offer in terms of knowledge and perspective (being on the Dr. side), but if you wish to close your mind to that fine. You are the king. You win. You are so cool.

I have better things to do with my time than spend it responding to your banter.

I hope that those that have been civil and even kind to me do not take this message to mean them. To those that this is directed at, I hope you read this twice and give it some serious thought. Opticians will never progress if they think they can talk down OD's and MD's behind closed doors.

[hcjilson]

Well said!

The Latin Students may wish to correct the grammar but " non illegitimus carborundum"!In defence of the majority of us, most of us visit the Board to learn and help one another, not to critique any profession.Firesign Theater used to have a routine called "We're all Bozo's on the Same Bus" which about sums up the way it is!
Don't let the small minds scare you away from this Board!I think the best revenge is to be able to hand them a napkin to wipe the egg off! :) Please continue to keep posting-exciting things are going to be happening here and you definitely want to be here for that!
Best wishes from Cape Cod

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Harry J

[This message has been edited by hcjilson (edited 04-27-2001).]

[Bob Rihl]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by hcjilson:
[I]Well said!

The Latin Students may wish to correct the grammar but " non illegitimus carborundum"!
HarryJ:
The grammar looks pretty good as long as the subject is singular. Illegitmi may refer to this group.
And that's what it is, UtahOD, a group, as in group therapy, so don't let us get you down. We cajole, we critcize, we rip each apart, we console. So please don't go away. That's how we all learn.
Bob
It's really an honor to have an OD participate. It's just a lot of fun for an Optician to try to catch a doctor in a mistake, sort of like a student catching his teacher misquoting Shakespeare.

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There IS life after optical business!!!

[John R]

Just what is an OD anyway being from the right side of the pond its a strange turm to us brits.
The best i can come up with is "Optical Doctor"
Which field do you work in ?
Over here we have
Optician :- Test eyes
Dispensing Optician :- Measures to ensure correct fitting of frames, lenses etc.

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Every day a grind
Every week a bind
www.iooi.co.uk

[Texas Ranger]

utahod, first of all, I don't see where we "all jumped on the OD" and "got egg on our faces" about your prism response...you erred, folks pointed that out to you, OD or not, sometimes these postings can be humbling, they are to me, I used to think I knew everything, ha ha, but please get over it. go back, look at your answer to Di's prism question, then reread the responses. I can tell you this, most of us older opticians really don't have an appreciation for 1. optical retail chains, 2. third party vision care plans, 3. MD dispensing, and green nose pad scum. that doesn't mean that we don't have an appreciation for honest, hard working folks that make every possible atempt to serve eyewear consumers. An an "independent", I have a lot of "competition", including OD's that dispense! BTW, John, an OD is a "Doctor of Optometry", very well educated in applied optical sciences, refracting, and fitting contact lenses. many are also trained in therapeudics, and can treat minor eye problems. Utah, keep posted, the "board is designed to be entertaining and informative, provides a nice relief of some workplace stresses enjoyed by us all. there are some very fine, knowledgeable and skilled folks represented in these posts...we can all learn to appreciate each others paradigm. it goes a lot better if we realize that our only competitor is ourselves, so be the best OD, MD or Optician you can be, and that'll be enough. When you learn to be better, you'll be better. yada yada.

[Di822]

DITTO, AL!

SORRY, UTAHOD. Put your bullet-proof vest on and hang around. Many of us appreciate you.

[Steve Machol]

In my view, UtahOD makes a valid point. I've tried to make this forum inclusive to all eyecare professionals. However this isn't the first time that someone has been treated without courtesy and decided it wasn't worth the effort to continue posting.

I'd like to think that it's possible to have a spirited debate over the merits of an individual's arguments without it degenerating into something personal. Is this an unrealistic expectation?

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OptiBoard Administrator

[John R]

Originally posted by Steve Machol:

I'd like to think that it's possible to have a spirited debate over the merits of an individual's arguments without it degenerating into something personal. Is this an unrealistic expectation?

Yes a good spirited debate is fun and no its not an unrealistic expectation , but as in life some folks just won't play ball unless its with their own :D

Just rember this quote "Water off a ducks back"

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Every day a grind
Every week a bind
www.iooi.co.uk

[This message has been edited by john r (edited 04-27-2001).]

[rfish777]

This is the very same thing that happened to
Optiopti. I wrote a reply that Steve chastised me for because I came to the aid of Optiopti. Utahod don't be bitter this group does this all the time especially Al. He is in your face and to hell whether you
like it or not. Steve said he did not see the case that Optiopti was making but she saw it and so did I. You guys keep your little pedestal and thinking your on top with all knowledge and power. Like Al the Lenscrafters wizard who thinks he knows all and see's all. you gugs think you so smug. I think I will ride off into the sunset like optiopti and utahod. I'm outta here. Here's
counting three down your loosing people left
and right keep up the good work.

[This message has been edited by rfish777 (edited 04-27-2001).]

[This message has been edited by rfish777 (edited 04-27-2001).]

[Joann Raytar]

UtahOD:

If you can stand the heat, please try and hang around. Some of us want to hear what you have to say and your input on certain topics would be greatly appreciated.

Almost everytime UtahOD posted, there was someone who came on strong and got up in his face. Yes, I know the Doc has come on strong too. Sorry Doc, you did admit you were venting. I've done that too in the past.

Doc, you will notice that some of the members are very blunt. That is the way they frequently are; eventually they just kind of grow on you. Except for Maria, the OptiBoard social director, she makes any thread she replies to a party.

[This message has been edited by Jo (edited 04-27-2001).]

[Alan W]

UtahOD
Don't go. You are one of the important tiles of the mosaic that forms the optical community. The common area we all seem to pass through on our way to our respective worklife and professional experience is all too often overlayed by different disciplines. And, it can get rough in the heavy traffic. But, notice how most of us shut up on issues of which your education and discipline are specific. What opticians don't see is what goes on in the refracting room and during the conversation between doctor and patient. Somehow, that scenario or scenarios need to be shared. They are not explainable in opticians terms, yet we try to do so. Some of us spent a lot of career time in "board room", others in the "training room", a lot in the "dispensing room", and a bunch in the "lab room" . . . but, not many in the refracting room. It would be nice to add more of your "color" to the mosaic. I have made my comments to you . . . for which I am not particularly proud, but had a need to say, based on my own professional and personal value system. But, that doesn't mean that your contributions are of lesser value. In truth, I'd rather hear what you have to say that the rest of us have no personal exposure to than get into it on the common business level, be it corporate, proprietorship or entrepreneurial, and common "PD and seg height level."

Had an ex boss say once . . .
"Check your egos at the door!" . . . .
Easier said than done!

[rfish777]

Steve's quote:
I'd like to think that it's possible to have a spirited debate over the merits of an individual's arguments without it degenerating into something personal. Is this an unrealistic expectation? Thats my whole point. These debates degenerate into
name calling and some bruised egos. I liked what Optiopti said but can no longer see her writings because she left. Is the same thing going to happen to Utahod and myself? Self expression is one thing but when it gets down to this petty I-I-I then it's gone to far, this my friends is the real problem with forming an alliance for opticians. Ever-body has opinions and opinions are like arm pits everybody has two of them and some of them stink. This is why we will never unite because of the petty bickerings over simple things. Did you ever think Utahod might have been thinking of one thing and wrote another without catching it? Until we unite into a cohesive body and set the petty bickerings and self attitudes aside we will go nowhere.The great Martin Luther King Said "I have a dream" What is our dream going to be? Going into oblivion or going on to put these differnces behind us and move out into a direction where no national optical forum has been before. It's our choice. We better choose wisely.




[This message has been edited by rfish777 (edited 04-28-2001).]

[Texas Ranger]

rfish777, don't know which "Al" you were referring to, hope not me, but I would like to say how refreshing this 'board is; a place where we all can express opinions about issues, even vent a bit about some of our frustrations. My own personal experiences have only been with a family business, and as a business owner over a 35 year period; I did work closely with an ophthalmologist in the Navy, and have completed a 100 hr. refracting course, but I have no idea how it would be to work for an eye doctor, or a retail chain. but some here give their insight and have grown in my appreciation for the diverse nature of our profession. I especially appreciate those such a yourself and utahod. have no idea what the issue was with optiopti?? I do know that there would be far fewer "issues" if there were some uniform professional standards in all states for opticians. like with any media, the written word is sometimes open to personal interpretation, and has time lags between responses, so the face to face off the cuff, tounge in cheek jibe that wouldn't be offensive over a glass of tea, becomes some sort of slam, in print! so, please stick around, we're all learning from each other. no matter how much we think we know, we can learn more, sometimes it's just more humbling than we can appreciate. most respectfully, one of the Als.

[Maria]

Originally posted by Jo:
Except for Maria, the OptiBoard social director, she makes any thread she replies to a party.

[/I]

Thankyou :) So, since I have replied, this is now officially a party, so everyone play nice and enjoy yourselves, or I'll turn this thread into a Wizard of Oz one. I've done it before, and I can do it again............

[UtahOD]

I will still be around from time to time. I have taken a lot more than you all can dish out in my past, so I am not hurt. I have just learned that in life, I do not have to take anything that I do not want to. If given the choice between reading others jump over my opinions and surfing my favorite fantasy football message boards, I choose my little hobby every time. It is just a question of priorities. :)

[Joann Raytar]

Football? Oh no; that's it Doc ... you just go.

[Maria]

REAL football, or American football?

[Alan W]

rfish777 and utahod, thanks for your statements.

Moving right along, now . . .

I posted a message three months or more ago looking for a colleague a worked with in 1971. His name is Gerry Lindegger and he is Switzerland. 3 days ago I got a reply. . . .

From Gerry Lindegger's son!

Gerry Lindegger had no son.
He had lots of girl friends here in "the states. Wait just a minute, here.
What's goin on?
What could have happened during the last 30 years?
EEEEEE gadddssssooooks!

[Matthew]

Hello

Regardless of status. OD, MD, Optician I believe all demand dignity and respect. After all, all we are is people. I know that all of us have had some unfortunate experiences with any of the 3 O's in the past, but share the knowledge dont stifle it. If somebody makes a mistake when trying to share knowledge dont stab them, just talk about it. I know all of us have made mistakes and said things that could be dumb, so at times let it go and keep the board at a dignified level.

[chip anderson]

Dear UtahOD.

Your opinions are needed an valued. You must understand that Opticians are used to O.D.'s trying to stick it to them at every turn in legistlature after legislature. From going to being afraid of fitting contact lenses to wanting a monopoly on them. From trying to pass laws that would not allow opticians to take seg. hts., P.D.'s or discuss and decide on lens types.

If you want to get around this, hang in there.

Chip

[hcjilson]

Maria! Pardon the blasphemy coming from an anglophile....but American Football is the ONLY true football! Soccer, ( that some say is a game invented by native Americans) is just soccer!
Best from the colonies.This is where the new split feature will come in handy :)
Fondly from

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Harry J

[Cindy Hamlin]

Originally posted by john r:
Just what is an OD anyway being from the right side of the pond its a strange turm to us brits.
The best i can come up with is "Optical Doctor"

John,
An OD is an "Optometric Doctor" They refract and fit patients for contact lenses which are then filled by opticians.
Cindy :)

[Maria]

Let's look at the semantics. Foot - Ball. Not Carry - Ball, or Shoulder Pads - Ball. But Foot - Ball. :)
The defence rests.