I just ordered some lenses with Crizal AR. My coworker has an AR coating (type unknown) and seems to have trouble getting them clean. Am I going to have the same problem?
What's the best way to clean glasses at the start of the day? Right now I use dial foaming hand soap, rinse, and wipe with a soft cloth.
During the day, I'm nervous about wiping them with the 3M cloth I got because it seems like I would just be grinding the dirt right into the lens.
You need to clean them wet. The wetter they are the easier to clean. I find that the best thing to wipe them with, when their wet, is a bounty type paper towel. Now I know some will say that it has wood fibres or other things like that, but is what I use in the office, this is what I use on my glasses, and this is what many of my consumers use and with the Crizal coating they don't scratch by doing that. Crizal is one of the top coatings on the market, so I wouldn't be as concerned about you friends glasses.
Yep I like the BOUNTY too!
:cheers:
The use of a mild soap is OK.
Just make sure that you don use a lens cleaner that contain any type of solvent like ISOPROPYL of which 90% of all lens cleaners are made. If you want to use a lens cleaner ask for one that is made purely from surfactants (soap family)
I should have looked on your web-page prior to asking that question. New question: do you have any data that supports those claims, and why have we not heard the coating companies advise us of this? The AR council web page makes no reference to alcohol damaging lenses they actually encourage an "AR cleaning solution"
http://www.arcouncil.org/Careclean.htm
Jarratt
Rinse with very warm water to remove particulate matter, clean with dishwashing liquid, Ivory soap, or any plain non-facial soap. Rinse and rub under very warm water until all the soap is gone (the lens surface will feel somewhat tacky at this point). Dry with a good quality microfiber cloth like "Luminex". If you can't get to soap and water, or if the soap is the wrong kind, (like the type you'll find in a motel, laden with lanolin, you might as well rub vaseline on the lens!) rinse under running water if available, then use an optical spray cleaner and the microfiber cloth to clean and dry.
Although cellulose will not scratch the lens, I believe that some paper towels have synthetic fibers added, and may scratch the lens over a period of time. Most paper products (except for Kimwipes) have lanolin added to soften the surface. This will leave smears and streaks on coated lenses. Even non-coated lenses will smear if you use a tissue with enough cream added (like Puffs). 100% cotton is ok if fabric softener is not used (including the dryer strips). However, if you use a microfiber cloth to dry the lens there will be no streaking. The use of other materials may leave streaks from oil that was missed when cleaned, requiring another soap and water cycle, and who has time to do this twice when your late for work? Think of the microfiber cloth as a time saver, and is esential for hyperopes/presbyopes where the near vision is poor with the glasses off.
Robert
Isopropyl, Methanol, Acetone and many other solvents will undermine AR coatings and eat away at the base in simple language and delamination or crazing can occur. This has been an old hat and has been discussed many times on the Optiboard. It seems that everybody developes their own theory on this subject.
On poly it is even worse,
CHEMICAL COMPATIBILITY WITH POLYCARBONATE
A. Chemicals
Safe
Not Recommended
Prohibited
Acetic acid, up to 10%
Allyl alcohol
Acetaldehyde
Acetylene
Cyclohexanal
Acetone
Alumen
Cyclohexane
Acrylonitrile
Aluminum chloride anhydrous, saturated solution in water
Dinonyl phtalate (softener)
Ammonia
Aluminum alumen potash, saturated solution in water
Dioctyl phtalate (softener)
Ammonia water
Aluminium oxalate
Diphyl 5.3
Ammonium sulphide, saturated solution in water
Aluminium sulfate, saturated solution in water
Formic acid
Amyl acetate
Ammonium fluoride, saturated solution in water
Isopropyl alcohol
Benzaldehyde
You know, I have a theory about why people find it so difficult to clean AR lenses, and I'd like to throw it out for opinions:
"AR lenses don't really get dirtier and are not harder to clean, really. It just looks that way, since the lens is so clear, and there is no reflected glare to block people's view of smudges."
Is this correct?
DRK, I believe you are totally correct. I've told a lot of people the same thing when selling AR coats. You might even be able to convince them that AR lenses are actually easier to clean because you can tell they are dirty more readily than non-coated lenses.
It's correct. I have been saying that to consumers for years. Anyways, we should all be dispensing the new coatings like Ice, Alize, and Sola Teflon.Originally Posted by drk
You know, I have a theory about why people find it so difficult to clean AR lenses, and I'd like to throw it out for opinions:
"AR lenses don't really get dirtier and are not harder to clean, really. It just looks that way, since the lens is so clear, and there is no reflected glare to block people's view of smudges."
Is this correct?
:) I wrote a post about this in my tips on dispensing thread, back a few months ago, but i,m not sure to many read it. First, in the otc spray cleaners that are available, i doubt that any of them have enough isopropyl to do any long term damage, especially considering the short time it is on the lens.
.....Now let me tell you the easist way to clean an ar lens, first after your hands are clean, take the lenses and rinse them off with hot water. Second, take the lenses and give them a generous amount of spray cleaner. Third, take your thumb and first finger and rub this around the lens, rubbing the spray cleaner all over the lens. Fourth and this is the kicker, instead of now drying it, rinse it of with hot water again and presto you will notice there is practically nothing left to dry. Take your micro cloth or cotton cloth and just blot dry any excess water. Try this it really works, be interested to have some of you try this and report back your experience.
why? does alchol break down the AR?
These new coatings have been around for 15 years to be exact, I know because I introduced them at the time.. They can very easily be applied to non treated AR coated lenses by the coating companies or the optical practitioner in his store or office.
They fill microscopic the gaps or pores in the coating, seal it, and and prevent grease, dirt, as anything else from penetrating and therefore the lenses are easy to clean. It makes the micro-cloth cleaning obsolete.
The newest versions provide also anti-fog and anti-stat protection. This newest version is only available on some SOLA products and some China made lenses.
Isn't the use of dish washing liquids bad because they are designed to strip grease, therefore they will strip coatings from the lense.clean with dishwashing liquid
UFRICH:cheers:
But Chris when I look at a lens coating I look at several factors.
1. Consumer will not complain about how hard they are to clean.
2. Scratch Resistance.
3. This is the most important - After two years the coating will still be perfectly intact. There will be no crazing, no breakage, no discolouration. There are not a lot of coatings that can do that out there. Stability is key.
Flames
For Life,
I love your flames, but I don't think you addressed the issue..........................."which is cleaning AR coated lenses"
Chris, is that listing of chemicals not recommended w/ poly for the raw stuff or lenses w/ SRC? Most labs in fact use IPA to clean the surfaced poly before backside coating.
The folks at NanoFilm, who make hydrophobic coatings and AR cleaners like Chris, have tested the effect of a number of dish-soaps on AR coatings. I don't recall the specific names but a couple will break down just about any ARC over time.
Best to stay w/ lots of HOH and a mild detergent.
I’ll try to throw in some comments without sounding like a commercial. ;)
“i doubt that any of them have enough isopropyl to do any long term damage”
You might be surprised at the amount of alcohol in some cleaners. Almost all cleaners have alcohol levels in the double digits, and some of them are more than 50% alcohol. For the record, the alcohol level in Ultra Clarity is in the single digits. In fact, while I don’t think that it is just the alcohol causing the problem, I can tell you that a certain retail store brand of pre-moistened towelettes has damaged an awful lot of lenses in the last few months. There is a difference between cleaners!
Why use alcohol at all?
It has been proven that alcohol will dissolve coatings over time. Many practices use it to remove ink, and this is fine since you need something strong enough to remove the ink. On an everyday basis, you need something more “soap based” as recommended earlier. If you do not add some alcohol, however, the lenses don’t dry quickly enough and you can end up with spots. This is also why we don’t recommend rinsing lenses after using a cleaner.
What other methods will clean the lenses?
It is absolutely true that a mild soap that contains no moisturizers, fragrances, or harsh “grease cutters” can be partnered with clean water and a clean, soft cloth to take good care of lenses. The problem is that this kind of soap really doesn’t have many other uses, so most people don’t even keep that kind of soap around the house anymore. Plus, you have to explain that you can’t use cheap paper towels, and you can’t use tissues that have lotions in them. And if you use a microfiber cloth, you have to make sure they know that you cannot use fabric softener on the cloth, otherwise the openings in the fibers that trap the dirt are clogged, and the special properties of the microfiber are removed. The benefit of a quality lens care products is that you are taking away the need for your patient to have special soap and a faucet nearby in order to clean their lenses. If you don’t provide them with something, don’t be surprised when they end up using their shirt tails!
I hope this helps!!
Tammy
Has anyone patented a Microfibre T-shirt yet? :)If you don’t provide them with something, don’t be surprised when they end up using their shirt tails!
Safe? Not recommended? Prohibitied?
Chris:
Your post is unclear to me. Is the list you have:
Safe? Not recommended? or Prohibited?
Chip
And if you use a microfiber cloth, you have to make sure they know that you cannot use fabric softener on the cloth, otherwise the openings in the fibers that trap the dirt are clogged, and the special properties of the microfiber are removed.
Chip, I got to find that list again because on the old system optiboard the coloums did not copy right. Since the new version is like the word program they should copy right.Chris:
Your post is unclear to me. Is the list you have:Safe? Not recommended? or Prohibited?Chip
I am glad that some other manufacturer is finally backing up my statyements I have made for the last two years on this subject.
Isopropyl, Methanol, Acetone and many other solvents will undermine AR coatings and eat away at the base in simple language and delamination or crazing can occur. This has been an old hat and has been discussed many times on the Optiboard. It seems that everybody developes their own theory on this subject.
On poly it is even worse,
CHEMICAL COMPATIBILITY WITH POLYCARBONATE
A. Chemicals
Safe
Not Recommended
Prohibited
Acetic acid, up to 10%
Allyl alcohol
Acetaldehyde
Acetylene
Cyclohexanal
Acetone
Alumen
Cyclohexane
Acrylonitrile
Aluminum chloride anhydrous, saturated solution in water
Dinonyl phtalate (softener)
Ammonia
Aluminum alumen potash, saturated solution in water
Dioctyl phtalate (softener)
Ammonia water
Aluminium oxalate
Diphyl 5.3
Ammonium sulphide, saturated solution in water
Aluminium sulfate, saturated solution in water
Formic acid
Amyl acetate
Ammonium fluoride, saturated solution in water
Isopropyl alcohol
Benzaldehyde
__________________
Chris Ryser
______________
DLO. NA.IC.I.T.PO
Chip, I knew which list, but I am always working at home early in the morning. The list must be on my computer at the office. Long weekend here, will look on Tuesday.
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