Vision Insurance?

**Ryan** · 01-25-2001, 07:43 PM

Just curious on what insurance plans everyone is taking and which ones are good, and not so good. ECPA, VSP, etc.

**chip anderson** · 01-25-2001, 10:20 PM

Near as I can tell none of them are good for us or the customer. Just the doctor with a struggling practice who wants to bring in customers no matter how cheap he has to work and good for the insurance company. Usually the premiums amount to several time the benefits. We have to work so cheap it isn't worth it.

Chip

**karen** · 01-26-2001, 10:09 PM

I have an account that is currently arguing with one of those 3rd party plans (NOT one you mentioned, by the way) that will only pay the doctor $35 for a contact lens exam. The knucklehead on the phone that she spoke to actually said he didn't see that there was any difference between that and a regular refraction so why should they pay more??? So be careful who you hook up with. Make sure their fees for services make it worthwhile or don't even get started or you will end up being a practice that is 85% managed care like the one mentioned above. Can I just tell you what they would do for 3-4 cash paying patients a day????

**stephanie** · 01-29-2001, 01:16 AM

I personally have ECPA myself. It paid me back finally. Of course the doc I work with doesn't take it so she already was paid thank GOD!! My exam was paid for right away but they denied my husband's claim. When I called to ask them why they said he didn't have an eye exam!! I was there and I work there, yes I am positive that he did have an exam. She said no he didn't I am not really sure what the doctor did for him but he didn't have an exam. DUH!! I said well I can prove it how about I have the doctor herself call and you can tell her she didn't give my husband an exam?? They paid!! LOL!! It only took 3 weeks to get my money but they paid!
Steph

**chip anderson** · 01-29-2001, 10:09 PM

Other than an addittional fee, what is the difference in a "contact lens exam"?

**PAkev** · 01-30-2001, 11:44 AM

For the most part these are not what I would consider to be insurance programs but SCAMS orchestrated by some of the most powerful retail chains. The plans are designed to work for these retailers only. This double dipping business practice is not only unethical but should be illegal. Since these retailers "Manage" the plans they recognize profits paid by the premiums of its members. Then they recognize the profits as members walk through their doors to purchase eyewear. Their fees are so rediculously low it is almost foolish for a small guy to participate which then means more for the big retail sharks.

In addition, these plans don't stay in employers benefit packages very long once the big sales pitch is over and they find out how little is actually allowed for their employees eyewear. I found that chances are very likely that many people do not have the same vision plan which they had 2-3 years ago which indicates to me there is high dis satisfaction with the services recognized through these plans. If you are in an area with several businesses it may be more profitable for you to visit these places to offer your own customized eyewear benefits program. This can result in a win-win situation for everyone involved.

Your participation provides valuable information to the administrators (your competition) of these plans which one day could result in them opening a place across the street. My advice would be not to participate but inform the client you will be of assistance to complete any paperwork for their reimbursement.

**stephanie** · 01-30-2001, 08:57 PM

I don't have insurance through my job. ECPA is from my husband's job. Both employers were going to charge us too much money to carry both insurances so we went with my husbands since it covers more.
Steph

**chip anderson** · 01-30-2001, 10:36 PM

Stephanie:

Don't know about where you work. But Most eye doctors give exams to opticians (espcially those who refer patients) free. Most optical concerns furnish glasses to the help free. Most of us furnish eyeglasses to practiceing opthalmologist, thier families and help (espcially if they are the blessed, don't dispense themselves kind free). What do you need vision insureance for?

Chip

**Jackie L** · 01-30-2001, 10:54 PM

Chip..........Up here in New England, we always offer eyewear for free or at the most, cost, to Ophthalmologists who do not dispense. They, in turn, examine my eyes for no cost. We even give them the free lens coupons offered by most spectacle lens manufacturers. This way, they can experience the new lens technology and refer their patients to us (independents) for eyeglasses. It pays to be up on the most current technology and pays even more to offer generosity to the MD.

Jackie O

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Still a Maina for now

**karen** · 01-31-2001, 01:46 PM

Originally posted by chip anderson:
Other than an addittional fee, what is the difference in a "contact lens exam"?

ummmm..... K readings and other necessary fitting measurements which results in a larger amount of chair time. If they are new to CL, or are toric or RGP wearers that involves a little more than what a spectacle refraction involves, doesn't it?? If all the doctor really has to sell outside of the dispensary is his chair time and it takes more of it to fit CL, shouldn't he/she be compensated fairly?? Can you tell my dad is an OD????

**chip anderson** · 01-31-2001, 11:20 PM

Karen: Any technician who considers himself a contact lens fitter would never trust K readings, etc. done by anyone else. And believe it or not, you don't have to be an O.D. or an M.D. to do all the measurement, etc required to fit lenses. I have taught even ophthalmology residents to do this in less than 15 minutes, after a few months they were good enough to tell me how. Of course, I am just a lowly little high school graduate who started in the optical business in 1958. Didn't have the benefits of legislative control.

I can even remember when a lot ophthalmologist's considered contact lens fitting too technical and time consuming, and most optometrist's thought it too dangerous. Us optician types weren't smart enough to recognize either.

To me, a contact lens Rx is a spectacle Rx with the words "O.K. for Contacts" on it. After that, it's the fitter's problem. The doctor is just saying this is the Rx and the eye is healthy enough for contacts.

Chip "maybe the last of a dying breed" Anderson

**karen** · 02-01-2001, 10:08 PM

Originally posted by chip anderson:.

To me, a contact lens Rx is a spectacle Rx with the words "O.K. for Contacts" on it. After that, it's the fitter's problem. The doctor is just saying this is the Rx and the eye is healthy enough for contacts.

Chip "maybe the last of a dying breed" Anderson[/I]

Chip, not to beat a dead horse, but what if the doctor IS the fitter? Now, in all fairness his CL tech is more of a insertion, removal, and delivery of lenses tech-which is not true in every office. My dad likes to be the guy that does all the fitting stuff and since that is where I was trained I forget that there are lots of people out there who aren't doctors who do that. I agree with you that the RX is essentially the same but I still feel that the extra time and effort involed in the fitting part is worth a little more cashola from those HMO's who tend to not pay enough for a refraction to start with. I guess we should agree to disagree :)