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Thread: Accuracy of online glasses

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    Accuracy of online glasses

    Most of us are familiar with the report in 2010-11 about the poor accuracy of on line glasses. I thought I read an article about a month or so ago that the study was redone and that accuracy had improved but still was not great. I have searched but could not find it. Does anyone else remember this? It may have been in Vision Monday or something like that .

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    They should do a report on the accuracy of B&M glasses why they are at it. I would be far more interested in that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kwill212 View Post
    They should do a report on the accuracy of B&M glasses why they are at it. I would be far more interested in that.
    +1

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    What's up? drk's Avatar
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    And that's the thing. No glasses are guaranteed to be made accurately. That's why you have a quality control process. That involves trusting someone.

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    I would also want to know how accuracy is determined, closest to the Rx as possible or just within tolerance?

    Kind of a rant, I'm sorry:

    My doctor was talking to one of their patients after a Rx recheck saying anyone could make a mistake even the doctor or the optician... And I later reassured the customer that there is very little subjectivity on the glasses side. Either they are within tolerance of how the Rx was written or they aren't. They go through multiple check points to make sure that they are within tolerance, including at the lab and when I final inspect them here in the office. I also said that nothing I do as an optician is as subjective or as difficult as refraction (not that refraction is difficult but it is more so than measuring PD's and a seg and PoW). We measure where the glasses sit on your face and I have done those measurements literally thousands of times. We also help you choose options for helping you see your best, again we have done that for a long time too! There's a reason it's called subjective refraction.

    End rant

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    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter Barry Santini's Avatar
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    knowledge of tolerance does not equal knowledge of 20/Happy

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    I never would say tolerance equals 20/happy... so I guess I agree

    Not sure what you are driving at with that.

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    Just getting the power and PD correct is the easy part - no report of that sort can grade fit and adjustment, proper choice of lens type, instruction and expectation management, and the thousand-and-one things that real Opticians do that transcend getting the power within ANSI.

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    Quote Originally Posted by finefocus View Post
    Just getting the power and PD correct is the easy part - no report of that sort can grade fit and adjustment, proper choice of lens type, instruction and expectation management, and the thousand-and-one things that real Opticians do that transcend getting the power within ANSI.
    100% agree, there is a lot more about making sure glasses work than just the power and the measurements. I was just more annoyed that my doc was trying to say that one of the opticians could be equally as liable for the mistake. In this case it wasn't even a question who was at fault LOL. Same frame but different color, same material and lens design and AR and measurements that was working for the customer before. Checked panto and wrap was the same in both frames. They were just over plus-ed a little bit. I put a -0.50 flipper over their glasses and they immediately said that looked better which is why I had them come back in for a recheck to begin with.

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    So I guess no one else was an updated study. Perhaps it was a dream.

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    OptiBoardaholic KrystleClear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NAICITPO View Post
    100% agree, there is a lot more about making sure glasses work than just the power and the measurements. I was just more annoyed that my doc was trying to say that one of the opticians could be equally as liable for the mistake. In this case it wasn't even a question who was at fault LOL. Same frame but different color, same material and lens design and AR and measurements that was working for the customer before. Checked panto and wrap was the same in both frames. They were just over plus-ed a little bit. I put a -0.50 flipper over their glasses and they immediately said that looked better which is why I had them come back in for a recheck to begin with.
    I have worked with quite a few doctors who like to shift the blame when an RX recheck is needed, or with any mistake or error, for that matter. I guess it's more important that they maintain that trust and authority with the patients, even when they were the ones that fudged up.
    Krystle

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    OptiBoard Professional IIxIPariahIxII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KrystleClear View Post
    I have worked with quite a few doctors who like to shift the blame when an RX recheck is needed, or with any mistake or error, for that matter. I guess it's more important that they maintain that trust and authority with the patients, even when they were the ones that fudged up.
    It also comes down to communication in the exam room. I feel like 8/10 times it's something with the glasses, not the RX. But I've generally had doctors who'll own needing to change the RX when it is just that. So many factors that can cause an issue. We're IT for brains basically.

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    Compulsive Truthteller OptiBoard Gold Supporter Uncle Fester's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Davis View Post
    So I guess no one else was an updated study. Perhaps it was a dream.
    How about these?

    Or are you looking for a specific article?

    https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=How+accurate+are+on+line+eyeglass+prescriptions


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    And - If I order a pair of shoes online and I get them and they don't fit - I don't wear them - I send them back.
    And - If I order a pair of pants online and I get them and they don't fit - I don't wear them - I send them back.
    And - If I order a pair of glasses online and I get them and they don't work - I don't wear them - I send them back.
    Or maybe even toss them in the trash since they cost $8.99?

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    Quote Originally Posted by KrystleClear View Post
    I have worked with quite a few doctors who like to shift the blame when an RX recheck is needed, or with any mistake or error, for that matter. I guess it's more important that they maintain that trust and authority with the patients, even when they were the ones that fudged up.

    But, while the patient is there they might as well change the power and axis!

    You know…..since the optical shop screwed up and are remaking them anyway!

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    What's up? drk's Avatar
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    Guys, you are vision care professionals, not glasses vending machines.

    You don't have coin slots and an "A6" button where some crappy snack slides out.

    Let the foul onliners be the vending machines (I would prefer not to "let" but it's not up to me).

    You take care of patients. You take care of your patients' vision.

    That's what society needs (and will reward). Not a stale cinnamon bun.
    Last edited by drk; 03-24-2022 at 10:32 AM.

  17. #17
    What's up? drk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John@OWDC View Post
    And - If I order a pair of shoes online and I get them and they don't fit - I don't wear them - I send them back.
    And - If I order a pair of pants online and I get them and they don't fit - I don't wear them - I send them back.
    And - If I order a pair of glasses online and I get them and they don't work - I don't wear them - I send them back.
    Or maybe even toss them in the trash since they cost $8.99?
    Don't come around here if you toss your pants in the trash, bruh.

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    Quote Originally Posted by IIxIPariahIxII View Post
    It also comes down to communication in the exam room. I feel like 8/10 times it's something with the glasses, not the RX. But I've generally had doctors who'll own needing to change the RX when it is just that. So many factors that can cause an issue. We're IT for brains basically.
    I work with another optician who has been doing this for a very long time and I have been doing this for 15 years. We are very consistent in our measurements and we generally keep customers in the same material that has been working for them. When we try a new lens design we note it so we can ask them their experience and follow up with them. We don't have a ton of remakes but when we do have one I find it is more often an Rx issue than an issue with the glasses.

    That would be an interesting poll though. I would guess more opticians would blame the rx and more Dr's would blame the glasses, but I would be interested to see OD's on FB response to that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by drk View Post
    Don't come around here if you toss your pants in the trash, bruh.
    Laramy K needs to make pants then too... MAKE SURE YOU GET ALL OF YOUR LENSES YOU FIT AND ALL OF YOUR PANTS AT LARAMY K!

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    [QUOTE=IIxIPariahIxII; I feel like 8/10 times it's something with the glasses, not the RX.

    It's almost never the refraction. I worked my last couple of years for an MD/OD practice. Their patients would go to the cheap place, get glasses, have trouble, and complain. The cheap place would stick the specs in the lensometer, confirm power, and tell the patient that the doctor must have screwed up the refraction. I would get them before another visit to the exam room, almost aways solve the problem through fitting and a chat, and the patient would leave happy. All this because I'm God's Gift to the optical world? Clearly not. I'm pretty good, but they were really bad. Blaming the doctor, or the lab, is a crutch used by the incompetent.

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    OptiBoardaholic KrystleClear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fezz View Post
    But, while the patient is there they might as well change the power and axis!

    You know…..since the optical shop screwed up and are remaking them anyway!
    YUP.

    And I am not saying every glasses issue is because of the doctor. I'm just saying when it IS their issue, sometimes the ego speaks first. Not all, but I have worked with a lot of people in this field who let their ego guide them, rather than listening to the patient. And that's not just doctors. Even heard a doctor try to flip it around on the surgical staff when HE put the wrong lens implant in a patient's eye.

    My hat goes off to anyone who refracts, though. Just hearing it down the hall drives me nuts. And I know I am a pain in the butt to refract. Sometimes #1 and #2 look the same. One thing I remind patients is that we can auto-refract them and manually refract them but ultimately the glasses prescription is based on their responses. It's subjective. Only they can see through their eyeballs. Dealing with elderly patients, I know first hand that dry eye, diabetes, etc can skew refractions.
    Krystle

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    OptiBoard Professional IIxIPariahIxII's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=finefocus;566943][QUOTE=IIxIPariahIxII; I feel like 8/10 times it's something with the glasses, not the RX.

    It's almost never the refraction. I worked my last couple of years for an MD/OD practice. Their patients would go to the cheap place, get glasses, have trouble, and complain. The cheap place would stick the specs in the lensometer, confirm power, and tell the patient that the doctor must have screwed up the refraction. I would get them before another visit to the exam room, almost aways solve the problem through fitting and a chat, and the patient would leave happy. All this because I'm God's Gift to the optical world? Clearly not. I'm pretty good, but they were really bad. Blaming the doctor, or the lab, is a crutch used by the incompetent.[/QUOTE]

    Honestly, once we sit down with the patient and listen to the issue. Adjustments generally fix the problem. I do find the rare gem sometimes where there's a flaw in the lens. Example, had a gentleman come in last week saying things looked warped. Checked everything, and sure enough there were waves ground into the lens. Nothing else was wrong. And as long as he looked straight on he was fine. I haven't seen a wave in a few years lol. Had another earlier in the day where the lens wasn't fully fined and polished. Like a ghosting on the lens. Super hard to see but he could see it when he was wearing them. Patience, communication, and thoroughness are our best friend.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KrystleClear View Post
    YUP.

    And I am not saying every glasses issue is because of the doctor. I'm just saying when it IS their issue, sometimes the ego speaks first. Not all, but I have worked with a lot of people in this field who let their ego guide them, rather than listening to the patient. And that's not just doctors. Even heard a doctor try to flip it around on the surgical staff when HE put the wrong lens implant in a patient's eye.

    My hat goes off to anyone who refracts, though. Just hearing it down the hall drives me nuts. And I know I am a pain in the butt to refract. Sometimes #1 and #2 look the same. One thing I remind patients is that we can auto-refract them and manually refract them but ultimately the glasses prescription is based on their responses. It's subjective. Only they can see through their eyeballs. Dealing with elderly patients, I know first hand that dry eye, diabetes, etc can skew refractions.
    Exactly. The doctor could have said hey refraction is a subjective science and there are any number of reasons for why we would need to adjust your Rx. There's a way to talk about it in generalities without pointing the finger at anyone, but if you do point the finger and it's your fault...

    The last two remakes that I've worked with specifically were the doctor. One they were over plused, put a -0.50 over their glasses and they saw noticeably better. The other had to move their head up in their progressive lens and look through the middle of the progressive to see their distance better, needed more plus power. Two different doctors but it didn't take a genius to diagnose the problem. We don't see many remakes in our office, and we have a pretty high capture rate. I am sure if I worked at a medical office and sent out most of our Rx's and got stuff back from other places I would feel differently. But generally my counterpart and I do a pretty good job of doing "all the things" pre and post sale to make sure the glasses will work for a customer. There's almost never a time where I see my counterpart's jobs and am like wtf where they thinking.

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    Master OptiBoarder optical24/7's Avatar
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    To the belligerent patients that disparaged your doc for a remake, I’d just asked them, “who said one or two was clearer?”…Worked like a charm to shush’ em…

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