Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 35

Thread: AR sales

  1. #1
    OptiBoard Professional
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Location
    Idaho
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    132

    AR sales

    I recently noticed that our AR sales are pretty pitiful. I'm trying to figure out where we are falling short, doctors talking to patients, opticians talking about it at dispensing. For those that have high AR rates, what works best for you? Do you have parameters where people "have" to get it.

  2. #2
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter lensmanmd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Location
    Maryland
    Occupation
    Optical Wholesale Lab (other positions)
    Posts
    880
    There are no magical elixirs to increase AR sales.
    However, there are some basic tenets.
    1. Know what the benefits of AR are (inside and out), not just the cosmetics BS.
    1b. Know the various properties of reflex and substrates. Your AR lab will be more than happy to provide education.
    2. Believe in the product
    3. Wear the product on the floor
    4. Package Back Side AR with all Sun products. This is the most overlooked part of turning good suns into WOW suns.
    5. Never, ever overcharge for AR.
    5b. Big Optical ARs are no better than those produced by independents. Don’t fall for the slick BO marketing.

    1, 2 and 3 have shown proven results in my decades of optical experiences.

  3. #3
    Manuf. Lens Surface Treatments
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    in Naples FL for the Winter months
    Occupation
    Other Optical Manufacturer or Vendor
    Posts
    23,240

    I recently noticed that our AR sales are pretty pitiful..............................

    Quote Originally Posted by bta89 View Post

    I recently noticed that our AR sales are pretty pitiful. I'm trying to figure out where we are falling short, doctors talking to patients, opticians talking about it at dispensing. For those that have high AR rates, what works best for you? Do you have parameters where people "have" to get it.

    AR coatings, as for the product itself, for eyeglasses was introduced in the late 1960s and early 1970s as a luxury addition for eyeglasses, while it had been applied on camera lenses already in the mid 1930's.

    While the cosmetic appearance is pleasing the AR effective qualities are very important on camera lenses and have been translated to use with the human eye which is never as sensitive as the film in a camera.

    However it is a valuable additional sale in the optical retail field as these coatings are usually very pricy, but not absolutely needed.
    Chris Ryser
    ________________________________________
    DLO. NA.IC.I.T.PO

    http://optochemicals.com............................. http://arcoatings.com

  4. #4
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter lensmanmd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Location
    Maryland
    Occupation
    Optical Wholesale Lab (other positions)
    Posts
    880
    Chris
    I beg to differ. AR is is a highly beneficial part of spectacles and vision. In this day and age of higher index materials, a far cry from the CR39 and Glass days, light transmission is critical. It is a needed product. All you need to do is study each material for its reflective properties.
    Europe and Asia are close to 100% AR. Those regions have always been ahead of the Americas for a reason.
    Every high end sunglasses have BSAR included. There is a real optical reason for this.
    Please, come forward to the 21st century, Chris. You built your business on this!

  5. #5
    Rising Star
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    Location
    Edmonton, AB, Canada
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    78
    Quote Originally Posted by lensmanmd View Post
    Chris
    I beg to differ. AR is is a highly beneficial part of spectacles and vision. In this day and age of higher index materials, a far cry from the CR39 and Glass days, light transmission is critical. It is a needed product. All you need to do is study each material for its reflective properties.
    Europe and Asia are close to 100% AR. Those regions have always been ahead of the Americas for a reason.
    Every high end sunglasses have BSAR included. There is a real optical reason for this.
    Love this! I live in Canada and have worked in 3 different opticals. Our AR sales are nearly 100%. What I usually do is quote the lenses with AR included and then explain what is included in the price (usually something along the lines of, "these lenses have a scratch coating and they are also anti-reflective, oleophobic, hydrophobic, etc". 99 times out of 100, the patient is agreeable.) Once in awhile, I'll have a patient who wants to forego the AR to save money, but they're very few and far between. It's non-negotiable for high RXs.

    I agree also with packaging suns with a backside AR. It's such a valuable add-on!

  6. #6
    Manuf. Lens Surface Treatments
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    in Naples FL for the Winter months
    Occupation
    Other Optical Manufacturer or Vendor
    Posts
    23,240

    Redhot Jumper you just made a up superb post in favour of Ar coatings..............................

    Quote Originally Posted by lensmanmd View Post

    Chris
    I beg to differ. AR is is a highly beneficial part of spectacles and vision. In this day and age of higher index materials, a far cry from the CR39 and Glass days, light transmission is critical. It is a needed product. All you need to do is study each material for its reflective properties.

    Europe and Asia are close to 100% AR. Those regions have always been ahead of the Americas for a reason.
    Every high end sunglasses have BSAR included. There is a real optical reason for this.
    Please, come forward to the 21st century, Chris. You built your business on this!


    Lensmanmd, ..............you just made a up superb post in favour of Ar coatings.

    I have neglected to think about all the new lens materials that are in use these days and can benefit from the AR coatings, and stand corrected.

    ...............and yes it is fact, that Europe and Asia have used these coatings at a very high percentage, for many years.
    Chris Ryser
    ________________________________________
    DLO. NA.IC.I.T.PO

    http://optochemicals.com............................. http://arcoatings.com

  7. #7
    Manuf. Lens Surface Treatments
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    in Naples FL for the Winter months
    Occupation
    Other Optical Manufacturer or Vendor
    Posts
    23,240

    Redhot Jumper You must have had a good teacher, ..........................................

    Quote Originally Posted by Trina View Post

    Our AR sales are nearly 100%.

    What I usually do is quote the lenses with AR included and then explain what is included in the price (usually something along the lines of, "these lenses have a scratch coating and they are also anti-reflective, oleophobic, hydrophobic, etc". 99 times out of 100, the patient is agreeable.)

    Once in awhile, I'll have a patient who wants to forego the AR to save money, but they're very few and far between.

    It's non-negotiable for high RXs.

    I agree also with packaging suns with a backside AR. It's such a valuable add-on!

    You must have had a good teacher, as this is just about the perfect way of making good sales.

    What is the result of being non-negotiable ? Do you let the patient walk out of the office, if he/she insists on it ?
    Chris Ryser
    ________________________________________
    DLO. NA.IC.I.T.PO

    http://optochemicals.com............................. http://arcoatings.com

  8. #8
    Optician Extraordinaire
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Somewhere warm
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    3,126
    I don't ask people if they want AR, I assume they will get it. If someone asks if they need it, I tell them I highly recommend it and it will help them see better and look better. My AR rate is about 95%.

  9. #9
    Rising Star
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    Location
    Edmonton, AB, Canada
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    78
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Ryser View Post
    You must have had a good teacher, as this is just about the perfect way of making good sales.

    What is the result of being non-negotiable ? Do you let the patient walk out of the office, if he/she insists on it ?
    It's more of a case by case thing. 9 times out of 10, an individual with a high RX already understands the importance of AR so it's usually a non-issue. The couple of times I've come across it and the patient insisted on SRC only, I have done it, making sure the patient understands the ramifications. One came back later and paid the extra to have her lenses redone with AR. If it's a lower RX and the patient doesn't want AR, so be it. Just as long as they're informed, I feel like I've done my job.

  10. #10
    Eyes eastward... Uilleann's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Utah
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    2,780
    Can you ask for any camera lens without it - even the cheapest of the cheap? NOPE. So why would anyone think it was an option here then? Education is a key aspect as well, but it really shouldn't be an optional aspect of ANY good lens design.

  11. #11
    Manuf. Lens Surface Treatments
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    in Naples FL for the Winter months
    Occupation
    Other Optical Manufacturer or Vendor
    Posts
    23,240

    Redhot Jumper Anti-reflective AR coating does cost an additional ..............................

    Quote Originally Posted by Uilleann View Post

    Can you ask for any camera lens without it - even the cheapest of the cheap? NOPE. So why would anyone think it was an option here then? Education is a key aspect as well, but it really shouldn't be an optional aspect of ANY good lens design.

    ...................................you are totally right

    However the retail pricing is a totally different setup, as lenses are coated in the lab that does the final job of finishing the glasses for the optician selling the glasses.

    Anti-reflective AR coating does cost an additional $20 to $90 depending on the lens it is coating, but there are significant benefits to anti-reflective AR coatings.
    Chris Ryser
    ________________________________________
    DLO. NA.IC.I.T.PO

    http://optochemicals.com............................. http://arcoatings.com

  12. #12
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Cincinnati
    Occupation
    Other Optical Manufacturer or Vendor
    Posts
    545
    AR coating in a lab situation is very costly vs stock lenses. I'm sure everyone is aware of the slight difference in costs of FSV lenses in uncoated and HMC coating regardless of the material.

  13. #13
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter lensmanmd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Location
    Maryland
    Occupation
    Optical Wholesale Lab (other positions)
    Posts
    880
    Quote Originally Posted by Don Gilman View Post
    AR coating in a lab situation is very costly vs stock lenses. I'm sure everyone is aware of the slight difference in costs of FSV lenses in uncoated and HMC coating regardless of the material.
    Yup. Between consumables and labor, I can’t produce standard AR at the cost of FSVAR. There are also thermal cured premium FSVAR that costs less than I can produce.
    These are our go-tos to reduce the amount of work in our coating room. Plus, if they are in stock, I can turn them as edged orders the same day.

  14. #14
    OptiBoard Professional Randle Tibbs, ABOM's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Alabaster, AL
    Occupation
    Other Eyecare-Related Field
    Posts
    198
    I agree, you should quote the price of the lens including A/R. We use package pricing which helps take the sticker shock off. when you package your lens options to include A/R, photochromics etc.., you should also describe to your patients the value and benefits of each package. when you sale options ala carte, dollar bills start ringing in their eyes and they are more likely not to purchase. Our A/R sales are closer to 80%. It doesn't hurt that approximately 70% of our sales are VSP, which make it a no brainer.

  15. #15
    What's up? drk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Ohio
    Occupation
    Optometrist
    Posts
    7,729
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Ryser View Post
    Lensmanmd, ..............you just made a up superb post in favour of Ar coatings.

    I have neglected to think about all the new lens materials that are in use these days and can benefit from the AR coatings, and stand corrected.

    ...............and yes it is fact, that Europe and Asia have used these coatings at a very high percentage, for many years.
    Chris stands corrected! Chris stands corrected!

    This shows he's not too old to learn a good trick.

  16. #16
    What's up? drk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Ohio
    Occupation
    Optometrist
    Posts
    7,729
    Question for the masses:
    1. Should kids get AR? I really don't know the answer.
    2. Is having "tiers" for AR a good idea? Like, cheap and expensive?

  17. #17
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter lensmanmd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Location
    Maryland
    Occupation
    Optical Wholesale Lab (other positions)
    Posts
    880
    Quote Originally Posted by drk View Post
    Question for the masses:
    1. Should kids get AR? I really don't know the answer.
    2. Is having "tiers" for AR a good idea? Like, cheap and expensive?
    Yes on both counts.
    AR will help with internal reflections and light loss in higher index materials like Poly.

    Good, better, best should be a strategy in all of retail. Having an entry level AR will help promote AR sales. Basic ARs have come a long way. Having a higher tier AR will only promote additional revenue, as they come with longer warranties and better hydro/oleo/scratch resistance. No additional cost to the provider, nor consumer to replace damaged coatings.

  18. #18
    Master OptiBoarder
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    PA
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    1,166
    Quote Originally Posted by drk View Post
    Question for the masses:
    Should kids get AR? I really don't know the answer.
    Yes Yes Yes!!! Kids are under lights all day at school, and what kid do you know doesn't watch tv or play electronics? They could use them more than some of our adults! A good quality AR is best.

  19. #19
    Manuf. Lens Surface Treatments
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    in Naples FL for the Winter months
    Occupation
    Other Optical Manufacturer or Vendor
    Posts
    23,240

    Redhot Jumper Good, better, best should be a strategy ....................................

    Quote Originally Posted by lensmanmd View Post

    AR will help with internal reflections and light loss in higher index materials like Poly.

    Good, better, best should be a strategy in all of retail.Having an entry level AR will help promote AR sales. Basic ARs have come a long way. Having a higher tier AR will only promote additional revenue, as they come with longer warranties and better hydro/oleo/scratch resistance. No additional cost to the provider, nor consumer to replace damaged coatings.

    ...................................Good, better, best should be a strategy in all of retail.


    .................................this is a perfect statement for normal times, of which we are in the final stages, before the outbreak of the
    Optical Retail World War 1, which will bring changes, supported by the Baby Boomers, becoming the new old age group, and the new technologies introduced and working on the now coming G5 systems.

    The largest optical monopoles have looked at it, seen it becoming a realty, and invested in that future for the last close to 20 years.

    These monopoles have also come up with the ideas and products that make "Good, better, best should be a strategy in all of retail."

    Chris Ryser
    ________________________________________
    DLO. NA.IC.I.T.PO

    http://optochemicals.com............................. http://arcoatings.com

  20. #20
    What's up? drk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Ohio
    Occupation
    Optometrist
    Posts
    7,729
    Does anyone recognize downsides to AR for kids?

    Does anyone recognize downsides to selling mediocre-quality AR coatings, even for a "good" price point?

  21. #21
    Manuf. Lens Surface Treatments
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    in Naples FL for the Winter months
    Occupation
    Other Optical Manufacturer or Vendor
    Posts
    23,240

    Redhot Jumper The price, comparable to give them expensive ..................................

    Quote Originally Posted by drk View Post

    Does anyone recognize downsides to AR for kids?

    Does anyone recognize downsides to selling mediocre-quality AR coatings, even for a "good" price point?

    1. Does anyone recognize downsides to AR for kids?
    The price, comparable to give them expensive silk pants versus Lederhosen



    2. Does anyone recognize downsides to selling mediocre-quality AR coatings, even for a "good" price point?
    same problem for a few bucks less
    Last edited by Chris Ryser; 02-13-2019 at 02:10 PM.
    Chris Ryser
    ________________________________________
    DLO. NA.IC.I.T.PO

    http://optochemicals.com............................. http://arcoatings.com

  22. #22
    Master OptiBoarder AngeHamm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Richmond, VA
    Occupation
    Optical Retail
    Posts
    1,942
    Quote Originally Posted by drk View Post
    Does anyone recognize downsides to AR for kids?

    Does anyone recognize downsides to selling mediocre-quality AR coatings, even for a "good" price point?
    For very young kids I don't do AR. The cleaning issues outweigh the benefits for a four-year-old. As soon as they are old enough to clean their own glasses, and to know when they need to, AR is called for.

    Pretty much the only times we sell "mediocre" AR coatings are in SV stock lens packages in cases when the higher-end coatings price patients out of the product. Medicare patients, second pairs, backup pairs for contact wearers, etc. Even then, I will usually upgrade from standard Somo/Nassau AR to Synergy Crystal at no additional charge for patients I think need the more durable coating.
    I'm Andrew Hamm and I approve this message.

  23. #23
    OptiBoard Professional
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Location
    Idaho
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    132
    How well do lower quality AR's hold up to better ones. For example like a Crizal Easy UV compared to the Alize or Sapphire 360. I just feel like the lower end ones aren't as good quality and don't hold up as well. We don't really offer lower quality AR's

  24. #24
    Master OptiBoarder
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    PA
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    1,166
    Quote Originally Posted by AngeHamm View Post
    For very young kids I don't do AR. The cleaning issues outweigh the benefits for a four-year-old. As soon as they are old enough to clean their own glasses, and to know when they need to, AR is called for.
    Yes...completely agree. Not so much the really little guys

  25. #25
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Cincinnati
    Occupation
    Other Optical Manufacturer or Vendor
    Posts
    545
    Bamboozlement
    Please describe for me the difference in
    L
    o
    w
    end
    Medium end

    H
    i
    g
    h
    end

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 11-04-2015, 10:34 AM
  2. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 02-25-2013, 07:12 PM
  3. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 02-17-2013, 05:16 PM
  4. Quarterly Sales Increased 17% While North American Sales Grew 30%....................
    By Chris Ryser in forum General Optics and Eyecare Discussion Forum
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 06-21-2011, 05:25 AM
  5. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 01-14-2003, 06:16 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
OptiBoard is proudly sponsored by:
Younger Optics and Vision Equipment