Read This
You may have to say you are from the UK......
Nuff Said...:finger:
Blue on Blue....
Read This
You may have to say you are from the UK......
Nuff Said...:finger:
Are your press reporting these mistakes by your forces. We are getting loads of these, seems you are even attacking your own as well.....Maybe someone owt to tell them ask first shoot later, if in doubt dont bother..
And a wise pilot comes back, soon our guys will start shooting them down...Friendly or not.....
US Coverage of the war is different from everyone else's coverage. I understand even UK coverage has a bit of a different spin on it from coverage elsewhere as well.
The US media is focusing more on our troops then what is going on inside Iraq and with the coalition forces. As far as friendly fire goes, we get the numbers and usually news from the command center briefings but that is about it.
Although they didn't go in-depth into the friendly fire incident, one of the cable news networks did take the time to state that the A-10 aircraft doesn't have as "advanced technology" as other aircraft. It is basically a plane built around a gun - armour in the air made to take a beating and keep on ticking.
Unfortunately, with the suicide bombing attacks on checkpoints and soldiers dressing up as surrendering civilians only to turn and attack the troops, I think we may have a few more of these types of reactions before eveything is done.
I noticed on my way to visit a friend on the Connecticut/Rhode Island border on Sunday that a number of homes and business were flying British flags along with US and POW flags. Admittedly, the route passes along various national guard stations and the sub base but these seemed to be civilian and residential homes. Not worth much after your post about the friendly fire, but Americans do care about the UK troops that chose to fight beside us.
John, surely that episode is a real tragedy, so very soory for your chaps; it does seem like there has been a lot of friendly fire injuries, including the army guy who fragged his officer's tents, killing 2 and injuring 15. he'll likely ne'er see light 'o day...
Hello John R,
Yes, it is a tragedy that these things occur, as to the reasons why I have no answers for you or anyone else but I'm sure it will be investigated. I'm not sure that any American apologizing for it will have any effect but I too am sorry that it happened and do not make light of the incident. BUT because I do keep up with news too and notice that more coverage is given when allies are hit by US military than anything else I must share this little story (and little is the operative word because very little was said about it at all) with you.
http://www.redding.com/news/apwar/pa...aptop017.shtml
The two in the tank that died were British and the two in the tank that did the firing were also British. They mistook their own tank as an enemy so it happens with all and not just "Yanks". A tragedy? Yes. A reason to get upset? Yes. A reason to cast blame on an intire nation? Not unless you're willing to do the same for your own country. In war bad things happen and no one is immune from it...not even the British.
Why the A-10 attacked? I don't know and no one will until it's been investigated. Why the British Challenger attacked the other Challenger? I don't know and again, no one will until it's been investigated but something happened in each case to cause it.
I'm deeply distressed that Americans could inadvertantly kill our allies or our own accidently or not, I'm just as distressed that British tank crews could inadvertantly kill our allies or their own accidently or not. But I'm even more distressed that Iraqis are shooting at and killing coalition forces regardless of who they are.
Like I said I'm not trying to make light of the situation it is truly tragic, but before this becomes one sided lets level the playing field a little. We're all up in arms about the war, tensions are high and any death is a terrible thing. I can't imagine being the loved ones of those that have fallen (regardless of nationality) but I don't particularly care to trivialize any situation.
It's a war "Nuff Said..."
Darris "An American that wishes it didn't and wouldn't ever happen." C.
Doesn't the number of friendly fire incidents seem disproportionately high, given the small number of "regular" casualties? (I base this on absolutely no hard data, just my own perception.)
Well, at least we're distributing the friendly shoot downs evenly (I believe we've shot down two planes with Patriots- one Brit and one American)...
Pete
Darris et al...
Yes it is sad.
Just think that maybe we should spend a bit more time training the troops to recognise targets.
Think more deaths have been caused by these incedents than by the iraq's.
I guess now with press swarming round like flys over a corpse we get to here of such things where as in ww2 etc they never got reported or were hushed up.
The difference between this war and Gulf War I and 'Nam is that you didn't have as many reporters on the sceen. Friendly Fire is a problem in all wars, but when you begin to depend on technology too much, well, as Forrest would say 'It Happens".chm2023 said:
Doesn't the number of friendly fire incidents seem disproportionately high, given the small number of "regular" casualties? (I base this on absolutely no hard data, just my own perception.)
They gotta shoot at somthin and the Iroc's don't seem to have an air force.
Funny you should mention their air-force.chip anderson said:
They gotta shoot at somthin and the Iroc's don't seem to have an air force.
Seems they do have one but dont want to use it....Maybe they cant find it....
Wonder why :o
Yep they will get their buts kicked big style.
Given the number of sorties that have been flown, and the number of missles sent/bombs dropped, the number is actually quite low.
The sad thing is that we're not talking about numbers, we're talking about people.
When my 5 year old boy is playing with his little plastic green soldiers, he usually gives me a rundown such as, "This one shot the guy under the couch, and this guy on top of the coffee table shot the guy thta fell off my bookbag...etc". I've always made it a point to tell him that they're not just "guys"; they're somebody's daddy, or mommy, or big brother, or uncle.
I supported the decision to go, to fight, and to do what it takes to be victorious, and I still do.
The coverage of this war esp by the news networks just keeps getting more and more maudlin and amateur, it's actually embarrassing to watch some of these reporters. Read an article over the weekend that made an excellent point: instead of filling the air time with various inanities (my favorite to date: reporter asking wife of mia soldier "describe your husband's relationship with your son." Son is 1.), why don't Fox, CNN etc. try to provide some real background info: history of Iraq, how Saddam came to power, the various factions--Shiites, Kurds etc. This would of course require actual work. I've decided to limit myself to print coverage, less aggravating.
Why don't Fox, CNN etc. try to provide some real background info: history of Iraq, how Saddam came to power, the various factions--Shiites, Kurds etc.?
Actually, I believe one of the Discovery channels (or maybe it was the History Channel) did just such a piece. It was extremely interesting and informative. Although I was already "on board" with the Admin on our current military actions, I came to a whole new realization of just what a wretched regime Saddam represents.
I don't wish to patronize the Iraqi people, but whether they realize it or not (and some don't seem to have a grasp on the reality of their situation), they are MUCH better off without Saddam. After seeing the documentary, I'm only sorry we didn't do this job during the first Gulf War. We could have prevented the murder of well over 100,000 Iraqis who were executed after the first war.
The coverage of this war esp by the news networks just keeps getting more and more maudlin and amateur, it's actually embarrassing to watch some of these reporters.
The worst example of what you are describing that I have seen actually came from my news channel of choice (Fox, of course). They are now running little "Hi, I'm Sgt. John Doe with the 119th Infantry... and I love Fox News" blurbs going into their commercial breaks. Yeah, I'm sure a soldier who hasn't seen his/her family in months really wanted to use their 10 second opportunity on camera to say how much s/he loves Fox News!
We got a program tonite about the early days and how we should have heeded the warning sings.....
but its on at around midnight.....:hammer:
I wonder what the rationale is for putting that program on so late............could it be that the British Media has gone liberal on us when we weren't looking??:D
If you study the background of Saddam and how he came to power you will become a little more sympathetic to the move to war. I think thats the reason its on so late!
Friendly fire accidents have been occuring since humankind decided to make war. I imagine the first incident could well have been someone on the same side getting their head bashed in when an enemy quickly ducked. I can remember reading an account of long bowmen hitting men at arms from behind because they advanced to quickly. When you consider the amount of allied combatants and sorties flown, you come away surprised at the fact there weren't more incidents.
In a perfect world there would be no friendly fire accidents........but in a perfect world, there would be no war!
hj
"Always laugh when you can. It is a cheap medicine"
Lord Byron
Take a photo tour of Cape Cod and the Islands!
www.capecodphotoalbum.com
Yes, I agree, in the ideal world there would be no war, but there is, and mistaken identity, false identity, and just plain old bad accidents do happen, unfortunately. :(
I have only just joined this Board, and find it very interesting, esp. as it includes the Brits, as I was born and bred English, altho' I now live in the US, and have, after many years here, taken citizenship. So, Hello to all, both sides of the Pond!
Hopefully this story won't end in just the fall of a tyrannical government but in the rebirth of an honorable nation.
Hi Lynne and Welcome to OptiBoard!!!! :D
Wailuku, Hawaii???? I bet it is warm over there; want to trade states?
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