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Thread: Essilor/Clearly Injunction Update

  1. #26
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    Optometrists and Opticians should read the judges decision and reasoning for yourself. It’s on each of your Colleges websites. Your license renewal fees are being spent on this and other expensive cases , therefore you should read what the trial judges have to say and why. Reading the transcript is the only way to understand the actual issue. It also tells a story as to how many glasses were sold. Reading the transcript is not about protectionism, it’s about understanding the true legal issues, how they are interpreted and how the laws are changed.

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by idispense View Post
    Optometrists and Opticians should read the judges decision and reasoning for yourself. It’s on each of your Colleges websites. Your license renewal fees are being spent on this and other expensive cases , therefore you should read what the trial judges have to say and why. Reading the transcript is the only way to understand the actual issue. It also tells a story as to how many glasses were sold. Reading the transcript is not about protectionism, it’s about understanding the true legal issues, how they are interpreted and how the laws are changed.
    I believe that is what is happening here. Although everyone sits silent and lurks from the sidelines these days.

  3. #28
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    The latest...

    Optik has obtained a statement from Essilor Canada responding to the ruling of the Ontario Superior Court in favour of the joint application by the College of Optometrists of Ontario and the College of Opticians of Ontario against Clearly, an online division of Essilor Canada Group Inc., to comply with Ontario’s dispensing regulations.
    The full statement from Essilor Canada:
    “Essilor Canada is aware of the Ontario Court’s ruling. Clearly has filed a motion to appeal that decision and has filed an application to stay the Court’s decision as part of the appeal process.Essilor and its entire group of companies, are fully committed to complying with laws, regulations and requirements in all the countries and jurisdictions where we operate.Our corporate mission is to improve lives by improving sight. To achieve that, at Essilor Canada we firmly believe in the importance of adopting and embracing advancements in technology to not only better diagnose and prevent eye health issues but to also provide better access to vision correction and protection solutions.The reality is that in our industry and in many others, the needs of consumers are evolving and alternate channels are here and ever evolving. It is of key importance for Essilor to continue to work hand-in-hand with Opticians, Optometrists and all eye care professionals while also addressing consumers’ new buying preferences, in order to provide access to the best quality of eye care for all Canadians.In the meantime, we continue to promote that good vision is part of good health and that regular eye exams should be performed by licensed eye care professionals.”

    Well said trying to balance opportunity while preserving relationships?

  4. #29
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    I personally liked this one.

    "The optician said that the address provided on the order was close to a store operated by the respondent and he suggested that the "customer" go there to get his frames adjusted once he received them."

  5. #30
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    So. Here is a novel idea. Website owners make extra revenue by placing click through ads on their page. Though small, every time a visitor clicks on the ad/banner, the owner receives a few pennies.
    For B&Ms to cash in on web sales, partner with on line providers by having them post your ads, and/or provide adjustments for them based on click throughs. The buyer will click a coupon, then present that coupon for adjustments. No coupon, no freebies. Every click brings you additional revenue, whether or not the consumer shows up.

  6. #31
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    Redhot Jumper shipped over 700,000 pairs of glasses into Ontario over the last 10 years............

    Quote Originally Posted by Lab Insight View Post

    https://infoclip.ca/wp-content/uploa...ce_Lederer.pdf

    Essilor will win or settle the appeal guaranteed. A different judge will not have the same opinion as Lederer.

    Coastal and Clearly have shipped over 700,000 pairs of glasses into Ontario over the last 10 years.....................

    ..................which makes them the largest single optical retailer into Ontario


    ......................the judgement says it all, and they are located in Vancouver.
    Chris Ryser
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  7. #32
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    What's the penalty for dispensing 700,000 pairs deemed illegal by a judge? What would these Colleges do to a member dispensing 7 pairs illegally, never mind 700,000 pairs ? What should members do with their own college boards allowing 700,000 pairs to be dispensed this way?

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by optio View Post
    I personally liked this one.

    "The optician said that the address provided on the order was close to a store operated by the respondent and he suggested that the "customer" go there to get his frames adjusted once he received them."
    We all pass the buck from time to time...

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Ryser View Post
    ......................the judgement says it all, and they are located in Vancouver.
    Wonder if they've yet made a single dollar profit? Roger Hardy never did and sold it for over $400M.

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by idispense View Post
    What's the penalty for dispensing 700,000 pairs deemed illegal by a judge? What would these Colleges do to a member dispensing 7 pairs illegally, never mind 700,000 pairs ? What should members do with their own college boards allowing 700,000 pairs to be dispensed this way?
    What penalty? Perhaps the colleges need to be penalized. This was 15 years in the making and both colleges if you recall sat doing diddly while they traveled the world, padded their CV's and challenged each other legally on what an optician's scope should be.

    What we have today is the fallout. Can't really blame Essilor on this one; they saw opportunity and bought huge market share volume.

  11. #36
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    Redhot Jumper After the merger they will control the biggest block of online opticals..............

    Quote Originally Posted by Lab Insight View Post

    What we have today is the fallout. Can't really blame Essilor on this one; they saw opportunity and bought huge market share volume.

    They did see the opportunity, whatever they do is studied in depth before they do it. So it is not accidental.

    After the merger they will control the biggest block of online opticals on a worldwide basis.

    In India they have and are training 3000 young people to refract and are setting them up in small stores to sell and distribute glasses, in outlying small provincial towns, far from the modern world.
    Chris Ryser
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    http://optochemicals.com............................. http://arcoatings.com

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Ryser View Post
    In India they have and are training 3000 young people to refract and are setting them up in small stores to sell and distribute glasses, in outlying small provincial towns, far from the modern world.
    Is that not a good gesture to help improve quality of life to those who need it in India?

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lab Insight View Post
    Is that not a good gesture to help improve quality of life to those who need it in India?
    When those 5000 are trained and doing 30 refraction's +/- 50? go figure how many more lenses and frames Essilux will sell. MIND BOGGLING !!!! Bet'cha they won't give em away.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don Gilman View Post
    When those 5000 are trained and doing 30 refraction's +/- 50? go figure how many more lenses and frames Essilux will sell. MIND BOGGLING !!!! Bet'cha they won't give em away.
    Exactly the point. And why would they give them away? Like it or not, Essilor is the only company operating with a long term game plan for strategic growth. Just look at their accomplishments and stock; it speaks for itself.

    All the other manufacturers like Hoya, Zeiss etc., consistently miss the boat of opportunity; reps even bash what Essilor is doing in the market place during sales calls in the hopes they make new friends and allies.

    Essilor just expanded their technical team across Canada to better support their customers. What have the other companies done for the ECP'S lately? Diddly.

    Who's been the most innovative company and ahead of the curve breaking records every quarter? Look at it in the perspective of being an investor looking for a strong stock performance; globally, up until now, they haven't disappointed.

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lab Insight View Post
    What penalty? Perhaps the colleges need to be penalized. This was 15 years in the making and both colleges if you recall sat doing diddly while they traveled the world, padded their CV's and challenged each other legally on what an optician's scope should be.

    What we have today is the fallout. Can't really blame Essilor on this one; they saw opportunity and bought huge market share volume.
    Exactly - why are the colleges being supported without penalty by the memberships ? If the judge found precedent to rule this way and suggest a legal means to block the web sites, then why have the Colleges and their lawyers allowed this and not enforced their mandates earlier ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by idispense View Post
    Exactly - why are the colleges being supported without penalty by the memberships ? If the judge found precedent to rule this way and suggest a legal means to block the web sites, then why have the Colleges and their lawyers allowed this and not enforced their mandates earlier ?
    The judge should interrogate the Colleges separately and ask what they have done in the past to protect consumers to prevent the fiasco at hand. Would be a pretty quick discussion.

  17. #42
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    Look at the battle that's going on in the U.S.

    https://americansforvisioncareinnovation.org/

  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by optio View Post
    Look at the battle that's going on in the U.S.

    https://americansforvisioncareinnovation.org/
    Seems Lux and now Essilux are still minority owners. Independents should really be paying attention to who they purchase their products from.

    In 2013 Wellpoint sold 1-800 Contacts toThomas H. Lee Partners and glasses.com to Luxottica.[7]AEA Investors acquired a majority interest in 1-800 Contacts in December 2015.[8]

  19. #44
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    Redhot Jumper Independents should really be paying attention ....................................

    Quote Originally Posted by Lab Insight View Post

    Seems Lux and now Essilux are still minority owners. Independents should really be paying attention to who they purchase their products from.
    According to Optiboard posts in general the independents have been singing glory to anybody they admired, not caring about business politics
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Ryser View Post
    According to Optiboard posts in general the independents have been singing glory to anybody they admired, not caring about business politics
    You are exactly right Chris. They also don't pay attention to double D cartoon characters and captain Harvey sticker programs to promote products by another large well known company. What has happened to our industry???

  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trina View Post
    This is terrifying to me - if the seg heights and PD are accurate, then that's a huge percentage of people who will be happy with their online purchase.
    No. It will not.

    Be terrified that people in decision-making positions are so inept as to let this stuff go on.

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Ryser View Post
    To bad you are not located in Ontario were they are now prohibited from selling online.

    However I can not figure how they will enforce that judgement.
    Individual consumers won't be stopped.

    But if anyone wants to go after these companies, now, all it will take is ONE case.

  23. #48
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    Redhot Jumper

    Quote Originally Posted by drk View Post

    But if anyone wants to go after these companies, now, all it will take is ONE case.

    In the place the product is made it is legal .........................

    How do you convict anybody for shipping it to w
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  24. #49
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    Doesn’t the judge tell the Colleges how to stop the sales and web sites? Doesn’t the judge say it’s been done before and the judge quotes legal precedent and invites the Colleges to pursue the same approach?

    It’s up to membership to read the judgement, and understand it.

    Where it’s made doesn’t matter, the judge’s approach would stop that. However, it’s up to the Colleges to enforce the judgement and it’s up to membership to hold the Colleges to that mandate and fund it.

  25. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Ryser View Post
    In the place the product is made it is legal .........................

    How do you convict anybody for shipping it to w
    The issue is legal jurisdiction. These online companies may be challenged, but never stopped legally; its far too complex and would require funds that most could never afford.

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