Silly Reps

[bta89]

Big E rep stopped by today just because he "happened to be in town". It seems he only is in town about once a year if that. We starting talking and then he starts giving me a lecture about how Essilor is a friend of the ECP. I chuckled and he wanted to know what was so funny. I told him that selling their products to big corporate companies is not friendly towards ECP. He then tries to cover himself up and say, "Well we don't sell all our products to them. Plus all other companies would leave the ECP for a corporate company if they had the chance." Then he tells me how people aren't concerned about money and that they would be willing to pay out of pocket for lots of stuff. When I told him that lots of time people didn't like paying out of pocket for things like SRC and AR, he told me that it was only a few people. I guess I need to find where all these people who just love spending lots of money are. Maybe I'll find a parent who will pay for me to put their kid in Individual II, 1.74 index even if they have a low prescription (sarcasm).

[Hayde]

bta, You'll find a ton of high-fives from a lot of folks here. But I do have some sympathy for your devil.

Big E is, well...big. But he didn't lie to you about the potential market of success for ECPs.

Big E is so big that it competes with itself. Yes it has a foot in the opposing square, but its other foot is still firmly planted here, too.

The last industry survey I saw (not E-sponsored, by the way,) indicated that across the eyewear market, "cost" was only ranked number 3 in their priorities. The people who prioritize their time and quality of vision are around. V&C are still very good performing brands by any objective standard....and so far they're targeted for that exact market.

So are other competitors, and several of them would never "leave the ECP for a corporate Co. if they had a chance." If I fault your rep for needlessly trash-talking the competition, that bad habit is hardly unique to E reps. I'm pretty sick of the snide, conspiratorial appeal of some sales folks. Why do we give this unprofessional behavior such a pass when it's not the Windows/Google/Big E monoliths doing it? Because we're enthusiastic consumers of the Alt-Kool-Aid.

Could big E pull its foot out of our square and go all-in on the other square? If it thought it was more profitable and not abdicating market share doing it, I'm sure they'd do it faster than a flash of lightening. Maybe that's their ultimate ambition in a few years or few decades.

But that parent who'll put a kid in a digital 1.74 just because you say they should? Dime a dozen. Your market is safe so long as they are. Varilux/Crizal preserving the sanctity of their brand by keeping their foot in your door instead of making the brand menial by putting it 'online' is a sure thing so long as those patients are around.

I just hope you're the guy who talk them out of a digital 1.74 when you meet one...saving them money & putting them in safer lenses at the same time without compromising quality of vision for a low power. You'll be the guy who turned out to be competent and honest when they do some digging around to discover the difference between different ubiquitous E products.

Your E rep hopes you win. He'd prefer to keep his job selling his line than lose the ECP market to online sales. He'd rather E keep its foot in your corner. So long is V is most successful in your hands, E will keep both of you floating.

Now, let's see here...where's my football helmet?

Gimme just three seconds to find it before unloading on me, y'all....

.

..

...

Ok, I'm ready! Let me have it.

[Johns]

bta, You'll find a ton of high-fives from a lot of folks here. But I do have some sympathy for your devil.

Big E is, well...big. But he didn't lie to you about the potential market of success for ECPs.

Big E is so big that it competes with itself. Yes it has a foot in the opposing square, but its other foot is still firmly planted here, too.

.

Sorry...I stopped reading after that.

Next!

[pknsbeans]

I wish more things could run on Linux.

[Quantrill]

I love Linux!

[Chris Ryser]

Varilux/Crizal preserving the sanctity of their brand by keeping their foot in your door instead of making the brand menial by putting it 'online' is a sure thing so long as those patients are around.


Ok, I'm ready! Let me have it.

.................it is not such a sure thing as optical corporations have proven over the last 60 some years.

It is a lot cheaper to produce one batch of good brand products only than make different qualities in different manufacturing runs.

However you can rename any amount of that batch as you want, without the retail customer knowing about it.

American Optical in the old days pushed their first class "Tyllier" lenses at the highest price, and sold a second quality lens called "Amoptic" for a lot cheaper.

During a visit at their Southampton factory in the 70's I learned that both brands were actually manufactured in the same batch and just repacked into different envelopes and sold for 40% less under another name.

So switching brand names without actually having different products is cheaper and easier to produce, than actually making them differently. That is being done in every field of manufacturing.

[Plausible]

bta, You'll find a ton of high-fives from a lot of folks here. But I do have some sympathy for your devil.

Big E is, well...big. But he didn't lie to you about the potential market of success for ECPs.

Big E is so big that it competes with itself. Yes it has a foot in the opposing square, but its other foot is still firmly planted here, too.

The last industry survey I saw (not E-sponsored, by the way,) indicated that across the eyewear market, "cost" was only ranked number 3 in their priorities. The people who prioritize their time and quality of vision are around. V&C are still very good performing brands by any objective standard....and so far they're targeted for that exact market.

So are other competitors, and several of them would never "leave the ECP for a corporate Co. if they had a chance." If I fault your rep for needlessly trash-talking the competition, that bad habit is hardly unique to E reps. I'm pretty sick of the snide, conspiratorial appeal of some sales folks. Why do we give this unprofessional behavior such a pass when it's not the Windows/Google/Big E monoliths doing it? Because we're enthusiastic consumers of the Alt-Kool-Aid.

Could big E pull its foot out of our square and go all-in on the other square? If it thought it was more profitable and not abdicating market share doing it, I'm sure they'd do it faster than a flash of lightening. Maybe that's their ultimate ambition in a few years or few decades.

But that parent who'll put a kid in a digital 1.74 just because you say they should? Dime a dozen. Your market is safe so long as they are. Varilux/Crizal preserving the sanctity of their brand by keeping their foot in your door instead of making the brand menial by putting it 'online' is a sure thing so long as those patients are around.

I just hope you're the guy who talk them out of a digital 1.74 when you meet one...saving them money & putting them in safer lenses at the same time without compromising quality of vision for a low power. You'll be the guy who turned out to be competent and honest when they do some digging around to discover the difference between different ubiquitous E products.

Your E rep hopes you win. He'd prefer to keep his job selling his line than lose the ECP market to online sales. He'd rather E keep its foot in your corner. So long is V is most successful in your hands, E will keep both of you floating.

Now, let's see here...where's my football helmet?

Gimme just three seconds to find it before unloading on me, y'all....

.

..

...

Ok, I'm ready! Let me have it.

Spot on!!!!!

[Quince]

.................it is not such a sure thing as optical corporations have proven over the last 60 some years.

It is a lot cheaper to produce one batch of good brand products only than make different qualities in different manufacturing runs.

However you can rename any amount of that batch as you want, without the retail customer knowing about it.

American Optical in the old days pushed their first class "Tyllier" lenses at the highest price, and sold a second quality lens called "Amoptic" for a lot cheaper.

During a visit at their Southampton factory in the 70's I learned that both brands were actually manufactured in the same batch and just repacked into different envelopes and sold for 40% less under another name.

So switching brand names without actually having different products is cheaper and easier to produce, than actually making them differently. That is being done in every field of manufacturing.

Smallfit poly and poly Transition vs. Shoreview Mini poly and poly Transition.

...weird how they are the SAME THING.

[obxeyeguy]

Cool aid for sale! Free cool aid mug included, $2.00. Open mind aid, 5 cents. Oh, almost forgot, that "foot" in the square, it's there for sure, your just looking up at it while it decides if your benefit of eating really low flying bugs is worth letting you stay in the garage corner. The foot is coming down when they are done with you, keep looking up.

Drink up lemmings.... Big squish.

[Vizualize]

Anybody who buys from E and thinks they are being taken care of is getting the wool pulled over their eyes. This is a multibillion international corporation who's only motivation is to drive profitability for its shareholders (and it doesn't help that their stock is down $10 from its highest point). Believe me, the management is in a tailspin at E. It also doesn't help they're under federal investigation by US government for shady business practices. All this E innovation we hear about is total nonsense. All they are doing is creating lenses that require proprietary blanks so they can continue to sell E blanks. E is a blank, chemical, digital click fee company, nothing else. All their other divisions and "goodwill" are just a guise to sell more blanks, chemicals, and click fees.

[Chris Ryser]

Could big E pull its foot out of our square and go all-in on the other square? If it thought it was more profitable and not abdicating market share doing it, I'm sure they'd do it faster than a flash of lightening. Maybe that's their ultimate ambition in a few years or few decades.

Obviously their ambition is to fully dominate the optical retail and manufacturing market, with no interest in the middle man, who will not survive if there are no more customers left.

They are the big Boa constrictor that strangles everything in their way. So far it has gone a lot faster than anybody would have thought of 5 to 10 years ago, and progressing at an ever increasing speed.

They are playing the 2 retail sides and will never loose, the conventional and the online business.

[Lab Insight]

Obviously their ambition is to fully dominate the optical retail and manufacturing market, with no interest in the middle man, who will not survive if there are no more customers left.

They are the big Boa constrictor that strangles everything in their way. So far it has gone a lot faster than anybody would have thought of 5 to 10 years ago, and progressing at an ever increasing speed.

They are playing the 2 retail sides and will never loose, the conventional and the online business.

Hoya is also implementing the same business model of domination minus the web (so far). They say they are friends of the ECP, yet they own a string of retail optical stores in Japan and are looking to expand and grab market share wherever they can on any platform.

I would be concerned about both beasts.

[Chris Ryser]

Hoya is also implementing the same business model of domination minus the web (so far). They say they are friends of the ECP, yet they own a string of retail optical stores in Japan and are looking to expand and grab market share wherever they can on any platform.

I would be concerned about both beasts.

They were probably laughing at Essilor for a few years and suddenly woke up, and here they go................... helping to change the way it was.

[Lab Insight]

They were probably laughing at Essilor for a few years and suddenly woke up, and here they go................... helping to change the way it was.

The only ones that won't be laughing are the ECP's that keep supporting them.