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Thread: Questions on digitaly surfaced progressives and blank sizes

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    OptiWizard OptiBoard Bronze Supporter pezfaerie's Avatar
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    Questions on digitaly surfaced progressives and blank sizes

    I was under the impression that with the newer technology of digitially surfaced lenses that the labs had more control over decentering the lens for better cut out. What I am hearing from my lab (who is going through the big E take over) is that they have NO control, that the computer choses everything. They can't change base curves if a different one is requested and the blank sizes are much more limited and small than a traditionally surfaced progressive.
    Was I wrong in thinking that the operators have more control over the placement of the design on the lens? I think I'll just stick to traditionally surfaced progressives if that's the case.

    Thoughts?
    Pez:D

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    This depends on a variety of factors. It is hard to say without more specifics. Digital technology can allow for more control, if the vendor lets us have it. Some designs are rather strict in their requirements, while others are very flexible.

    James

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    Master OptiBoarder DanLiv's Avatar
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    Essilor is very strict on their software specs and doesn't gives labs a ton of flexibility. Plus most of their progressive designs are front-side molded so that constrains decentering. When I run into a wall with an E design I switch to Shamir. Those are all full backside so you can almost always get cutout, and they seem happy to let you futz with thicknesses and base curves willy-nilly.

    The reasons for the control are twofold: protect the company's proprietary design software from lab inspection and reverse engineering, and protect their brand from labs making decisions that exceed the best performance parameters. This is the same reason any lenses have Rx limits at all. Freeform generators can cut -10.00 cyl, but designers know the lenses won't perform optimally at that power so they artificially limit the license for the technology to -4.00, -6.00, etc. The more brand power the company has, the more they will protect it by limiting what they put into the world. E has the biggest brand, so they will constrain their designs the most. IOT (and Shamir to some extent) has no consumer brand power and therefore puts most of the control in the hands of labs. If the lab wants to make poor decisions that fail to impress, they may, but at least the option is available.

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    This has been said already but, it does depend on the designer, IOT provides a wide range of centration options. We do that because we want our customers to be able to consistently provide what the ECP needs based on their day to day needs. Dont give up on digital lenses there are some great benefits, just look for a design that satisfies your customers visual needs and your proper fitting needs. There are plenty of people who are members of this board who can point you in the right direction.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DanLiv View Post
    Essilor is very strict on their software specs and doesn't gives labs a ton of flexibility. Plus most of their progressive designs are front-side molded so that constrains decentering.
    We occasionally use Big E's GR8 proprietary digital lens and I have complained of the lack of decentration on these lenses. Your comment makes sense as to why I'm not getting decentrated lenses. I'll have to check out the next one we order to see if it does indeed have a front-side mold.
    The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.

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    On the true digital designs, where you start with a single vision lens, Essilor only likes to decenter when necessary.

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    Master OptiBoarder AngeHamm's Avatar
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    It is incredibly frustrating that many Essilor progressives are restricted to their size-limited digital designs for polarized lenses. I can't tell you how many times I've gotten phone calls from the lab telling me that DRx lens won't cut out for a perfectly reasonably-sized sunglass.
    I'm Andrew Hamm and I approve this message.

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    Shamir is my go-to for cut-out on large frame and somewhat significant amount of decentration jobs. Love the Auto II Attitude for suns.
    Clinton Tower

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    Master OptiBoarder DanLiv's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AngeHamm View Post
    It is incredibly frustrating that many Essilor progressives are restricted to their size-limited digital designs for polarized lenses. I can't tell you how many times I've gotten phone calls from the lab telling me that DRx lens won't cut out for a perfectly reasonably-sized sunglass.
    Same here, and it's strange to me because the DRx is a "true" freeform with 100% backside design and should in theory be easily decentered. However even for these designs they do still mandate an Essilor digitally molded spherical lens blank, and certainly the software allows only nominal decentration to avaoid whatever catastrophe they think might occur. Sucks.

    I too use Auto 2/3 and attitude for many suns, as well as the very well-priced Essilor Ideal Advanced Wrap (with the also well-priced Xperio AR). Not the best design but a good price in polarized and fit and wrap compensated, which the DRx will never handle even if you get cutout. Despite it being a simpler progressive I have had 100% success with it in suns for 2 years now. Still do occasionally get cutout issues on big sun frames, and then the Auto 2/3 always takes care of it.

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