Why do Independants still support Essilor?

[sharpstick777]

the greatest trajedy of Essilor is how poor their progressive really are. They are just now adding features to their lenses that Rodenstock had in 2002, and Zeiss, Shamir and Seiko all had by 2004. Sadly most of their technical effort has been to get around the Zeiss and Seiko patents on Free-form. Essilor still does not make a fully compensated spherical free-form with advance ray-tracing. They just added frame adjustments into 1 design. Yea!

I sadly see a huge rush by Essilor when the Ziess patent expires in 2019 to full embrace free-form, but spin it in way the entire idea is their invention.

Sadly millions of Essilor customers are wearing way over priced, pathetically under optimized progressives and don't even know it, all because Essilor doesn't want to pay a $2.60 patent fee per pair, yet still charges exorbitant prices for very old technology.

[Craig]

the greatest trajedy of Essilor is how poor their progressive really are. They are just now adding features to their lenses that Rodenstock had in 2002, and Zeiss, Shamir and Seiko all had by 2004. Sadly most of their technical effort has been to get around the Zeiss and Seiko patents on Free-form. Essilor still does not make a fully compensated spherical free-form with advance ray-tracing. They just added frame adjustments into 1 design. Yea!

I sadly see a huge rush by Essilor when the Ziess patent expires in 2019 to full embrace free-form, but spin it in way the entire idea is their invention.

Sadly millions of Essilor customers are wearing way over priced, pathetically under optimized progressives and don't even know it, all because Essilor doesn't want to pay a $2.60 patent fee per pair, yet still charges exorbitant prices for very old technology.

That is sadly very true; there is no reason to use any Essilor progressive if you have a choice. They do have a decent coating process but the price paid is crazy vs what you get.

[Golfnorth]

That is sadly very true; there is no reason to use any Essilor progressive if you have a choice. They do have a decent coating process but the price paid is crazy vs what you get.

Amen to that!

[djal]

Essilor is today the most aggressive optical corporation. Already 50 years ago they would not take one step without calculating to the point if they could take the step and at what risk. They only employ top rated people in important positions.

Their advertising department is a scientific operation where every impact is studied and calculated before going public.

They have realized that if they can sell directly to the public they can multiply their profits, which is better than act just as a distributor and wholesaler to the optical retail trade. So far they have proven this point by now having over 14 on-line websites in the optical retail business.

The public is now asking to get Essilor products due to its public advertising and your colleagues find it easier to just supply it, than to convince customers of something similar made by somebody else.

What retailers do not realize is that on-line glasses are not a finished,
checked and adjusted product. More than often the optometrist or optician is asked to do that job for the the consumer at little or no charge.

Opticians and Optometrists will have to change their retailing habits from their gross profit included in their selling price to a competitive one and charge separately for the services they provide.

So true!

[djal]

That is sadly very true; there is no reason to use any Essilor progressive if you have a choice. They do have a decent coating process but the price paid is crazy vs what you get.

IMO Crizal is a terrible AR coating. Look at the coating with a fluorescent lights behind... after 2 years of wear 80 to 90% of the times you see this generalized "glazing" on the lenses. We have been using Hoya EX3 for over 2 years now... nothing like this occurs with the EX3. What I find sad with Hoya USA/ Canada though is the fact they do not have half of the innovative products Hoya Japan offers... If they would ever bring all these products in North America, I'm sure Essilor would begin to get very nervous! I've tried to get an answer from Hoya why the selection of products offered here is so limited compared to Japan... nobody could (or perhaps nobody wants) give me a clear answer! I even suggested to them to outsource some lenses and get them done in Hoya's factories in Asia/Japan... I was told shipping would be too expensive... BS obviously as Nikon, Essilor and Shamir do it on a large scale...

[Chris Ryser]

I've tried to get an answer from Hoya why the selection of products offered here is so limited compared to Japan... nobody could (or perhaps nobody wants) give me a clear answer! I even suggested to them to outsource some lenses and get them done in Hoya's factories in Asia/Japan... I was told shipping would be too expensive... BS obviously as Nikon, Essilor and Shamir do it on a large scale...

Hoya has finally woken up and did join the takeover race a few month ago. They have been forced to join the race or become the looser in the field. So just keep watching and see what they are up to this year.

[Lab Insight]

IMO Crizal is a terrible AR coating. Look at the coating with a fluorescent lights behind... after 2 years of wear 80 to 90% of the times you see this generalized "glazing" on the lenses. We have been using Hoya EX3 for over 2 years now... nothing like this occurs with the EX3. What I find sad with Hoya USA/ Canada though is the fact they do not have half of the innovative products Hoya Japan offers... If they would ever bring all these products in North America, I'm sure Essilor would begin to get very nervous! I've tried to get an answer from Hoya why the selection of products offered here is so limited compared to Japan... nobody could (or perhaps nobody wants) give me a clear answer! I even suggested to them to outsource some lenses and get them done in Hoya's factories in Asia/Japan... I was told shipping would be too expensive... BS obviously as Nikon, Essilor and Shamir do it on a large scale...

It has nothing to do with shipping costs; correct they're giving you BS, and here's why...

Hoya North America wants to sell you a very limited portfolio of lenses - the ones that they can make the most profit on. They don't give a hoot about Japan's products. The American president's famous slogan to his reps is to "Sell what you got".

As for Canada, it is even more BS and limited. They currently outsource about 70% of their jobs to Thailand and receive a box from them every day. Last time I checked a map, Thailand is much closer to Japan than North America is.

Global sourcing of products is fine as it's the way of the future as the market continues to change. However, 7-10 day overseas delivery is horrible for them, especially when other smaller companies are to do it in 4 days with the same quality and lower cost and is about to get even better very soon....

[Chris Ryser]

Global sourcing of products is fine as it's the way of the future as the market continues to change. However, 7-10 day overseas delivery is horrible for them, especially when other smaller companies are to do it in 4 days with the same quality and lower cost and is about to get even better very soon....

If you allow me to make a correction .........................

These companies all have special arrangements with UPS/FEDEX/DHL for overnight or 2nd day delivery on a worldwide basis.

[Lab Insight]

If you allow me to make a correction .........................

These companies all have special arrangements with UPS/FEDEX/DHL for overnight or 2nd day delivery on a worldwide basis.

Correct, so one must ask why it takes Hoya so long 7-10 days? It says so right on their price list 'please allow 7-10 days for delivery'.

[optical maven]

I have used Hoya for several years and have found their quality excellent. They had some problems with their lab, but now seem to be corrected. It's true it takes 7-10 days to get a job, but often that can be faster. People don't seem to mind. No matter what, even though I can't fully divest from Essilor, I think it is dumb for any independent to use the Essilor lab directly. I also use Hamilton Lens and Dave is great.

[Quince]

Correct, so one must ask why it takes Hoya so long 7-10 days? It says so right on their price list 'please allow 7-10 days for delivery'.

I could list all the reasons we have delays on our orders but that isn't the point. Nothing we haven't heard or said before. I do know that they will say themselves that their AR takes up to two days alone because of the substrate process. Not sure how accurate this is. They do offer their Sight Overnight from Columbus which is a selection of lenses and coatings that are available to be received next day if ordered by 1pm. It does come in on time- just not always right...

[Lab Insight]

I could list all the reasons we have delays on our orders but that isn't the point. Nothing we haven't heard or said before. I do know that they will say themselves that their AR takes up to two days alone because of the substrate process. Not sure how accurate this is. They do offer their Sight Overnight from Columbus which is a selection of lenses and coatings that are available to be received next day if ordered by 1pm. It does come in on time- just not always right...

The 7-10 delivery window is an average turn around period and does not even factor in breakages or shipping mishaps.

[Chris Ryser]

Here we go:

2 years later the Lux and Essilor are merging to make the largest ever existing optical company on a global level. Amen.

[Chris Ryser]

New York harbour, watching the then largest liner "France" come in and dock.

posted 12-19-2014, 09:30 AM

You would not believe the number of Canada accounts that Big has. Some of the most important companies in Canada do business with them. Many of the Opti Boarders who have accounts with them...read these comments....and still shovel money to them. The big question is why. Is it the old National Optical system of equipment for lab work. Is it guarenteed lab orders for preferential pricing....is it something else.

Why would we deal with M now that they have an agreement with FYI. Face it, the little independents ar being squeezed out by the large chain store powers. The indy 10-15 jobs a week VS a chain store group of hundreds of orders per DAY says it all.

2 1/4 years since above post was published here on this OptiBoard thread by "coupe".

Some day in June 1964, = 53 years ago, I was standing on the dock at the New York harbour, watching the then largest liner "France" come in and dock.

The highest ranking passengers occupying the presidential suite on the "FRANCE" was Mr and Mrs Cottet, the big chief of the then "ESSEL", the largest optical manufacturer in France.
see at: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Essilor

I drove them to Montreal the next day where they stayed a few days to establish new business contacts which became very eventful for next few years after that.

Ever since that day I have had a very large interest in the development of that corporation.

[djal]

It has nothing to do with shipping costs; correct they're giving you BS, and here's why...

Hoya North America wants to sell you a very limited portfolio of lenses - the ones that they can make the most profit on. They don't give a hoot about Japan's products. The American president's famous slogan to his reps is to "Sell what you got".

As for Canada, it is even more BS and limited. They currently outsource about 70% of their jobs to Thailand and receive a box from them every day. Last time I checked a map, Thailand is much closer to Japan than North America is.

Global sourcing of products is fine as it's the way of the future as the market continues to change. However, 7-10 day overseas delivery is horrible for them, especially when other smaller companies are to do it in 4 days with the same quality and lower cost and is about to get even better very soon....

The ultimate solution IMO... get rid of the CEOs at Hoya North America and replace them by Japanese people from Hoya... I agree that EX3 is a FAR BETTER coating than Crizal BUT I want MORE... I want the Venus AR coating in Asia with anti-static+ UV blocking capabilities from the back surface like Crizal... Again these CEOS here should be thought what the word Kaisen means... "If you don't get any better you are getting worst". Imagine if the Japanese car plants in North America would be ran by fat cats hillbillies from this continent; you would end up with the same **** we get when buying a Ford, Chrysler or GM car. And even experts say that a Japanese cars made in North America are not up to par with the same models made in Japan( like the good old days)!