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Thread: Would you refill an Rx for "PLANO" that had expired?

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by chaoticneutral View Post
    By its very definition an eye in a state of emmetropia requires no correction. Safety frames can be purchased with a plano lens to safety thickness without an RX as can sports glasses. I just asked another OD friend of mine friend of mine if he would ever write a prescription for a plano lens. He said for reading sheet music he might have a +1 as a midrange. I said but that would be written as a +1 on the RX for mid range. He said OH! I didn't have my glasses on I thought you said PIANO!
    Rim shot!

  2. #52
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter Barry Santini's Avatar
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    You'd think I said the world was round.

    EVERYONE knows it's flat!

    Sheesh!

    B

  3. #53
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    to answer your original question Barry...YES I would!

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    [QUOTE=Barry Santini;492495]You'd think I said the world was round.

    EVERYONE knows it's flat!

    Sheesh!


    Spheric, aspheric, or atoric
    I didn't attend the funeral, but I sent a nice letter saying I approved of it. Mark Twain

  5. #55
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    I cannot fill expired RXs.
    With that said, some "independent Drs next door" will write a Plano rx for "photophobic" patients so they can use their vision ins.
    Win, win!
    The only ins I can pull a sunglasses frame of the board for is CEC. --in this case I am filling a RX, and are able waive sales tax.
    EM, Spectera, Davis, Avesis, etc....I go by their plan! I don't bill ins sunglasses off the board, but I can order Plano lenses.
    Win, win!!

  6. #56
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter rdcoach5's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Santini View Post
    That's telling statement on the lack of logic in our industry.

    B
    Barry your whole point is to point out to the patient that he's overdo for an eye exam. That doesn't mean he can't legally buy any number of over-the-counter readers or plano suns. If you mean to say that an Rx actually written as plano o.u. with no add is strange enough to call the Dr to ask whether there was supposed to be an add , you have a small point. In many years of dispensing, I can't remember any semi-lucid patient who is totally unaware that he/she needs a bifocal. Further a plano Rx is strange enough to call the Dr to see if he forgot to include the prism. Other than that, you have too much time on your hands and are starting an argument when none exists.

  7. #57
    Compulsive Truthteller OptiBoard Gold Supporter Uncle Fester's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Santini View Post
    You'd think I said the world was round.

    EVERYONE knows it's flat!

    Sheesh!

    B
    It's really an oblate spheroid. I thought all opticians knew that.

    http://www.scientificamerican.com/ar...-is-not-round/

  8. #58
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter Barry Santini's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rdcoach5 View Post
    Barry your whole point is to point out to the patient that he's overdo for an eye exam. That doesn't mean he can't legally buy any number of over-the-counter readers or plano suns. If you mean to say that an Rx actually written as plano o.u. with no add is strange enough to call the Dr to ask whether there was supposed to be an add , you have a small point. In many years of dispensing, I can't remember any semi-lucid patient who is totally unaware that he/she needs a bifocal. Further a plano Rx is strange enough to call the Dr to see if he forgot to include the prism. Other than that, you have too much time on your hands and are starting an argument when none exists.
    I'm afraid my whole point may have been missed.

    B

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    Compulsive Truthteller OptiBoard Gold Supporter Uncle Fester's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Santini View Post
    Here: The logical extension of gatekeeping eye health to a refractive finding expiration date is that ALL Rxs (and PLANO IS AN Rx!) should be gate kept.

    That means that plano sun purchases, done in an oprical shop environment, should be vetted for PROOF of their last eye health exam.

    Discussion.

    B
    Define obligations under "gate keeping".

  10. #60
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter Barry Santini's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Fester View Post
    Define obligations under "gate keeping".
    "Prove you were examined within (...X..) years, and we wont make you get an exam."

    B

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    Why do they have to prove it? Who made "you" gate keeper? "Make you get an exam" Really? Forcing someone to take an exam???? Is that what this is about?

    Plano lenses (regardless of a written prescription or not) are not regulated. There are voluntary standards to most of them, please note the word "voluntary".

    If patient x wants a pair of plano's, for god's sake give it to him. Enough with the "I'm the Gatekeeper" stuff. Unless you are the Keyholder as well, we might as well be talking about Ghostbusters.

    You cannot force people to get an exam. You can suggest it, you can recommend it.

    Come on, man. Enough already.

  12. #62
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    And your point is?
    Quote Originally Posted by barry santini View Post
    i'm afraid my whole point may have been missed.

    B

  13. #63
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter Barry Santini's Avatar
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    I think you are all still missing the forest for the trees.

    Why should there be Rx expiration dates at all tied to just *ammetropia*?
    In the name of eye health gatekeeping???
    I guess emmetropes are second class citizens in the eyes of Many ECPs.

    B

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    I agree "make you get an exam" wasn't an ideal choice of words, but the relish with which y'all jumped on the semantics certainly won't earn any debate points. We know Barry isn't arresting them and escorting them to the doctor's office-nor is that what he's suggested.

    I once had a patient with remakes back and forth to the doctor's office between DS & .25 cyl until the doc prescribed a 0.12 cylinder. Lab nailed it, and he was then happy as a clam with his specs. Goes against the grain of every other experience with docs and patients about accomodation I've ever seen. Half the docs I know almost refuse to even write .25 cyls at all.

    So yeah, fine--if you can sell planos without an Rx, and someone's fool enough to pay you to surface them--knock yourself out. But it's a line we're crossing when we do--and we'd better make it clear to the patient we're taking our 'labcoat' off when we're making this sale. We're no longer a pharmacist. This is not a medical prosthetic, no you can't use your insurance, it will be taxed, and as far as your vision through the thing is concerned, caveat emptor.

    Still...unless that patient signs a waver, I'm still on the hook for whatever the customer ends up not liking about it...especially if he blames it for him falling off his bicycle. Which is exactly what a guy who walks in with that weird, mysterious, expired Rx would do...and whatever story he decides to tell puts the burden of proof on us that we're not the kind of business "that makes glasses without prescriptions."

    It's not the plano that's important...it's that he brought in a Rx at all. He's presumably under the impression he's on the 'doctor--prescription--pharmacist--medicine' track. If he thinks he needs a piece of paper at all, then it's better to let that cycle take its course irrespective of the "PL" on it.

    Perhaps the thought experiment would be better served had we been provided more context about the Rx and patient data available, along with a paragraph or two of the optician's dialogue with the patient. When those facts plug in, there's probably much less disagreement about where the optician would go with it.

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    A written direction for a therapeutic or corrective agent; specifically: one for the preparation and use of a medicine. If the prescribing doctor uses an expiry date; does this not suggest to the ECP presented with said RX, that the individual is under a doctors care and that after it has expired they are required to return the attending doctor. The gate keeper of the RX is the prescribing doctor.
    I didn't attend the funeral, but I sent a nice letter saying I approved of it. Mark Twain

  17. #67
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter Barry Santini's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Smith LDO View Post
    A written direction for a therapeutic or corrective agent; specifically: one for the preparation and use of a medicine. If the prescribing doctor uses an expiry date; does this not suggest to the ECP presented with said RX, that the individual is under a doctors care and that after it has expired they are required to return the attending doctor. The gate keeper of the RX is the prescribing doctor.
    I agree. But is an optician cannot make "another" pair of eyeglasses with an "expired" Rx, then they have, in fact, become the gatekeeper.

    We must answer the question "why" Rxs have expiration dates.

    B

  18. #68
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    Barry..You, I and most the rest of us know *why* there are expiration dates on some* eye glass Rx's. We also know which class of doctors do and which class of doctors don't.

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    There'll be peace in the Middle East first...

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Santini View Post
    I agree. But iF (?) an optician cannot make "another" pair of eyeglasses with an "expired" Rx, then they have, in fact, become the gatekeeper.

    We must answer the question "why" Rxs have expiration dates.

    B
    Since expiration dates started to become common a few years ago you can find dare I say thousands of feet of discussion of "why".

    The doc's and the independent optician will argue it forever to no resolution.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Fester View Post
    Since expiration dates started to become common a few years ago you can find dare I say thousands of feet of discussion of "why".

    The doc's and the independent optician will argue it forever to no resolution.
    Sort of like the PD discussion(s)...*ducks*

  21. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Santini View Post
    I agree. But is an optician cannot make "another" pair of eyeglasses with an "expired" Rx, then they have, in fact, become the gatekeeper.

    We must answer the question "why" Rxs have expiration dates.

    B
    Should I then require a prescription for my heroin-like addiction to OB. OK, so we tell the patient that we can fill the prescription, but that their eye exam has expired and that there may be underlying medical conditions that their lenses will not address.
    I didn't attend the funeral, but I sent a nice letter saying I approved of it. Mark Twain

  22. #72
    Master OptiBoarder ziggy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Santini View Post

    We must answer the question "why" Rxs have expiration dates.

    B
    Optom's almost always write expiration dates, Ophthalmologist seldom if ever write expiration dates on RX for glasses.
    Paul:cheers:

  23. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by ziggy View Post
    Optom's almost always write expiration dates, Ophthalmologist seldom if ever write expiration dates on RX for glasses.
    Yes! And why the discrepancy?

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    A horse! A mule! A horse! A mule! Traditiiiiiiioooooooon!

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    Quote Originally Posted by optical24/7 View Post
    Yes! And why the discrepancy?
    Money, thats the bottom line. Most OD's make their money from refractions and CL fittings, most MD's make there money from surgery/ medical exams. Its almost always about the money.
    Paul:cheers:

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