Independant Labs? Who and where are your favorites? And why?

**sharpstick777** · 01-06-2014, 12:13 PM

We all know that the truly independent lab is a dying breed, but some still thrive! Who are your nearby independant labs, and why or why not do you choose them?

Please post the names of independent labs in your area, and why they are special! (if you have one nearby you don't use, you are welcome to share why too.)

(Definition: a truly independent lab is not owned by a lens manufacturer or insurance company, so they have no inherent product bias, their interest is in offering both brands and advice that is best for your patient, not what is best for their bottom line, and they don't steer you toward their own products)

**EyeCare Rich** · 01-06-2014, 07:08 PM

Central Optical Lab in Clarkston WA!! Fantastic A/R Coat, and Fantastic Customer Service!

**LENNY** · 01-07-2014, 12:12 AM

Are you saying that independent lab should not push the lenses on which they make more profit!?
Bottom line is important for every business!
Maybe that's why there are so little of larger independent labs left!!!?

**Jason H** · 01-07-2014, 09:35 AM

I work for one of those independant labs - and I agree with Sharpstick... until. I have an inherent product bias towards product that works. You can be cynical towards opinion, but the recommendations I am paid to provide had better do more good than harm or I won't be employed long. The only "steering " I do is towards problem-solving. Towards this end there are a lot of reasons to recommend in-house product. Not as the first and best, but rather as a legitimate alternative for cost-conscious or other situations where a need exists. No commercial here and I won't mention companies or product - but my recommendations include house brand products (among many others) and are geared first and foremost to helping my accounts.

**AngeHamm** · 01-07-2014, 09:58 AM

We are just deliriously pleased with the service, quality, pricing, and turnaround time at WOS Optical in Green Bay, Wisconsin.

**JC1111** · 01-07-2014, 12:47 PM

I work for Acculab in Illinois. 90% of our business comes from the fact that we are Independent and ECPs are sick and tired of playing the games with the corporations. We do mainly Seiko, Zeiss, And Shamir but they do not have any ownership in us, meaning I don't have to push a product that may or may not work to satisfy a contract.
From talking to different ECPs I have noticed that independent labs tend to have far better customer service ( you can call and get someone who knows about the products).. Our turn around time tends to be far faster then corporate ( at least that is what they tell me) and of course there is always logic to consider- do you support china or do you support USA? Do you fund the guys who are robbing your business? (Cough* Cough* essilor) or do you help out the guys who are like you? If and when I open up a practice- Independent is the only way Ill ever go.. I live by the principle what goes around comes around- If you help those who are in need like you the favor gets returned.

Joe Colton
www.acculab.net

**sharpstick777** · 01-07-2014, 02:22 PM

Originally Posted by JC1111

I work for Acculab in Illinois.

Joe, I was hoping more to hear from dispensers and clients. I too am an independent lab, but I didn't want to promote "my stuff".

**sharpstick777** · 01-07-2014, 02:25 PM

Originally Posted by LENNY

Are you saying that independent lab should not push the lenses on which they make more profit!?
Bottom line is important for every business! Maybe that's why there are so little of larger independent labs left!!!?

Although the bottom line is important, it doesn't affect my recommendations. I advise to do what is best for the patient... Everytime.

**LENNY** · 01-07-2014, 07:08 PM

Originally Posted by sharpstick777

Although the bottom line is important, it doesn't affect my recommendations. I advise to do what is best for the patient... Everytime.

So the lab should suggest to optician or sales person who orders the lens what is the best for the person that optician might not even saw!?!? Unless of course its a one man/women operation...
I am an optician and I would never ask what lens would be better from a person who takes my orders in the lab! We live in an internet world!

**Tallboy** · 01-08-2014, 12:47 AM

I've been happy with three rivers who are still, to my knowledge,indy

**HindSight2020** · 01-08-2014, 07:49 AM

Originally Posted by sharpstick777

We all know that the truly independent lab is a dying breed, but some still thrive! Who are your nearby independant labs, and why or why not do you choose them?

Please post the names of independent labs in your area, and why they are special! (if you have one nearby you don't use, you are welcome to share why too.)

(Definition: a truly independent lab is not owned by a lens manufacturer or insurance company, so they have no inherent product bias, their interest is in offering both brands and advice that is best for your patient, not what is best for their bottom line, and they don't steer you toward their own products)

You are definitely correct in stating independent labs are on borrowed time because they truly are. Any 'true' independent lab as you define that is not aligned with any insurance companies or lens manufacturers has a clock ticking twice as fast and a bottom line bleeding red ink.

Besides your COGS, once you factor in all of your expenses associated with operating a lab, there isn't enough margin left to thrive.

The times have changed and continue to do so - one must align to survive the long haul, and if one doesn't, your name will be changed to T. Rex Ophthalmics.

**other_bill_fea** · 01-08-2014, 09:48 AM

I think that free-form has really made it easier for 'independent' labs to thrive. Without being constrained by lens vendors, the ready availability of house brands lets every lab become their own lens provider. This lets labs not only control their costs of goods, but also makes it easier for them to offer a wide range of lens products.

While the bottom line is important, it's also important to be able to offer lenses that Eyecare Professionals want, and that patients will be happy with.

The clock may be ticking for a number of labs, but I think as long as a lab is able to keep pace with the latest technology, they can continue to stay independent.

**LENNY** · 01-08-2014, 10:30 AM

I agree with Bill about FF lenses, but personally I am not 100% convinced that they are same or better for people who were wearing Adaptars, Navigators and XLs for years. I don't have much success switching them to FF.

**Plausible** · 01-08-2014, 10:32 AM

Originally Posted by JC1111

I work for Acculab in Illinois. 90% of our business comes from the fact that we are Independent and ECPs are sick and tired of playing the games with the corporations. We do mainly Seiko, Zeiss, And Shamir but they do not have any ownership in us, meaning I don't have to push a product that may or may not work to satisfy a contract.
From talking to different ECPs I have noticed that independent labs tend to have far better customer service ( you can call and get someone who knows about the products).. Our turn around time tends to be far faster then corporate ( at least that is what they tell me) and of course there is always logic to consider- do you support china or do you support USA? Do you fund the guys who are robbing your business? (Cough* Cough* essilor) or do you help out the guys who are like you? If and when I open up a practice- Independent is the only way Ill ever go.. I live by the principle what goes around comes around- If you help those who are in need like you the favor gets returned.

Joe Colton
www.acculab.net

So you don't sell any Essilor products?

**other_bill_fea** · 01-08-2014, 10:34 AM

I think there's always going to be patients that are happy with what they have. Once they've gotten used to a specific lens design, even if it's not "the best", that's it. They aren't going to change. That's actually a good case for putting a free form single vision on the back of a standard progressive lens. You get the benefit of the design they like, but you can still get wrap compensation and clean it up a little bit.

**MikeAurelius** · 01-08-2014, 11:20 AM

Originally Posted by AngeHamm

We are just deliriously pleased with the service, quality, pricing, and turnaround time at WOS Optical in Green Bay, Wisconsin.

Except that WOS is part of Big E., and has been for quite some time.

**SharonB** · 01-08-2014, 01:00 PM

U.S. Optical in East Syracuse NY
Luzerne Optical in PA

**NCspecs** · 01-08-2014, 02:18 PM

Originally Posted by SharonB

U.S. Optical in East Syracuse NY
Luzerne Optical in PA

Big, fat +1.

I also want to give a big shoutout to Sharpstick and Jason H for being an awesome indie lab guys who have done some amazingly comprehensive research on several different PAL designs. My fitting success has shot through the roof since making their aquaintance because they are patient and helpful when I am working through some sticky situations. I know if I hit a wall they can usually help me break through. You guys are great- keep fighting the good fight!

**Jason H** · 01-08-2014, 04:08 PM

Very kind, thank-you.

**sharpstick777** · 01-08-2014, 04:17 PM

Originally Posted by HindSight2020

You are definitely correct in stating independent labs are on borrowed time because they truly are. Any 'true' independent lab as you define that is not aligned with any insurance companies or lens manufacturers has a clock ticking twice as fast and a bottom line bleeding red ink.

Besides your COGS, once you factor in all of your expenses associated with operating a lab, there isn't enough margin left to thrive.

The times have changed and continue to do so - one must align to survive the long haul, and if one doesn't, your name will be changed to T. Rex Ophthalmics.

It tough market, but sales are up 30% over LY. We will never align. We are well in the black. It is a tough world, but as lab quality drops elsewhere there is a new market for quality lab services and who put the patient first.

**sharpstick777** · 01-08-2014, 04:19 PM

Originally Posted by Tallboy

I've been happy with three rivers who are still, to my knowledge,indy

yes they are, but can you share the... "why" ? Thanks.

**sharpstick777** · 01-08-2014, 04:19 PM

Originally Posted by SharonB

U.S. Optical in East Syracuse NY
Luzerne Optical in PA

2 great mentions, but what do you like about them?

**sharpstick777** · 01-08-2014, 04:28 PM

Originally Posted by NCspecs

Big, fat +1.

I also want to give a big shoutout to Sharpstick and Jason H for being an awesome indie lab guys who have done some amazingly comprehensive research on several different PAL designs. My fitting success has shot through the roof since making their aquaintance because they are patient and helpful when I am working through some sticky situations. I know if I hit a wall they can usually help me break through. You guys are great- keep fighting the good fight!

Thanks NCspecs! I appreciate the kind words. Has any of that knowledge translated into any of these: improved sales or capture, better patient satisfaction, reduced optician stress, referrals, or lower remakes?

**opticaldiva** · 01-08-2014, 04:31 PM

We like the Eyeworks lab in Rochester, NY. They are a small digital lab, independent, rock their own private label digital and AR at a reasonable price. If you have a question or need something, you call the owner or the lab manager...that's it, it's taken care of. No red tape, no big rule book. Awesome redo policy that really helps the ecp and customer.

**HindSight2020** · 01-08-2014, 07:09 PM

Originally Posted by sharpstick777

It tough market, but sales are up 30% over LY. We will never align. We are well in the black. It is a tough world, but as lab quality drops elsewhere there is a new market for quality lab services and who put the patient first.

If that is truly the case, enjoy the freedom as long as you can ride it out.