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Thread: I must really be a simpleton...

  1. #26
    One eye sees, the other feels OptiBoard Silver Supporter
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    On Monday the French government released a declassified report summarizing the evidence that it has gathered about three separate chemical weapons attacks on civilian populations in Syria. The report concluded that the two earlier attacks were basically practice runs as the Syrian regime’s adjusted its tactics and objectives away from battlefield objectives and towards raining terror on civilian populations.
    http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/...-attack-syria/

    I don't believe we should be "punishing" Assad. Our goal should be to make it easier for the opposition to kill him, reducing the chance that the civil war will spill into Lebanon, Turkey, Jordan, Iraq, and Israel, into a war between nations.
    Science is a way of trying not to fool yourself. - Richard P. Feynman

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  2. #27
    ABOM Wes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Fester View Post
    A letter to the editor had a good idea.

    Instead of millions of dollars of missiles and bombs we parachute in millions of gas masks.
    http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...er-a-year.html

    http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/p...masks/2726299/
    The comments are priceless.
    Last edited by Wes; 09-07-2013 at 10:25 AM. Reason: comments
    Wesley S. Scott, MBA, MIS, ABOM, NCLE-AC, LDO - SC & GA

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  3. #28
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Gold Supporter Judy Canty's Avatar
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    I wonder who the real source is? These two are quoting each other.

  4. #29
    ABOM Wes's Avatar
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    Wesley S. Scott, MBA, MIS, ABOM, NCLE-AC, LDO - SC & GA

    “As our circle of knowledge expands, so does the circumference of darkness surrounding it.” -Albert Einstein

  5. #30
    Ophthalmic Optician
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    From an AP News report:



    "The U.S. administration says its evidence is classified and is only sharing details in closed-door briefings with members of Congress and key allies.

    The assessment, also based on accounts by Syrian activists and hundreds of YouTube videos of the attack's aftermath, has confounded many experts who cannot fathom what might have motivated Assad to unleash weapons of mass destruction on his own people — especially while U.N. experts were nearby and at a time when his troops had the upper hand on the ground.

    Rebels who accuse Assad of the attack have suggested he had learned of fighters' plans to advance on Damascus, his seat of power, and ordered the gassing to prevent that.
    "We can't get our heads around this — why would any commander agree to rocketing a suburb of Damascus with chemical weapons for only a very short-term tactical gain for what is a long-term disaster," said Charles Heyman, a former British military officer who edits The Armed Forces of the U.K., an authoritative bi-annual review of British forces.
    Inconsistencies over the death toll and other details related to the attack also have fueled doubts among skeptics."



    This has been the source of my confusion. Why would a guy that is obviously winning the war, turn on his own people, in the town where he had his strongest support?

  6. #31
    Master OptiBoarder optical24/7's Avatar
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    I'm torn on all of this. Maybe it was a rouge general who chemed his own people. But whom is ultimately responsible? Similar to the nurse who recently threw away a donor kidney mistaking it for medical waste, her employer, the hospital is held accountable. If the chemicals were from Syrian stockpiles Assad is ultimately responsible for failing to adequately secure them.

    But I'm tired of the U.S. taking the role of world police. Without support from (many) other countries, I wouldn't want to see us go it alone once again. And at the same time, where do we, as a world community *draw* that line? Use of hideous weapons banned from use years ago. What kind of signal does inaction send to other rouge leaders? Just exactly how far will one have to go till the civilized world says "enough"?

    Syria is truly a loose, loose situation for the west. Many rebel fighters there are aligned with al qaeda whom with the fall of Assad could take control of the country. Leaving Assad in power endangers the region and the good people of Syria with the possibility of more chem attacks. I for one am at a loss as to how to proceed today...
    Last edited by optical24/7; 09-08-2013 at 08:32 AM.

  7. #32
    Master OptiBoarder rbaker's Avatar
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    Thar be snakes and scorpions there. Be vewwy vewwy careful sayeth Elmer Fudd, particularly when following a fool.

  8. #33
    Doh! braheem24's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by optical24/7 View Post
    I'm torn on all of this. Maybe it was a rouge general who chemed his own people. But whom is ultimately responsible? Similar to the nurse who recently threw away a donor kidney mistaking it for medical waste, her employer, the hospital is held accountable. If the chemicals were from Syrian stockpiles Assad is ultimately responsible for failing to adequately secure them.

    But I'm tired of the U.S. taking the role of world police. Without support from (many) other countries, I wouldn't want to see us go it alone once again. And at the same time, where do we, as a world community *draw* that line? Use of hideous weapons banned from use years ago. What kind of signal does inaction send to other rouge leaders? Just exactly how far will one have to go till the civilized world says "enough"?

    Syria is truly a loose, loose situation for the west. Many rebel fighters there are aligned with al qaeda whom with the fall of Assad could take control of the country. Leaving Assad in power endangers the region and the good people of Syria with the possibility of more chem attacks. I for one am at a loss as to how to proceed today...
    Well said.

  9. #34
    ABOM Wes's Avatar
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    I don't see how leaving Assad in power endangers anyone if he wasn't responsible for the chemical attacks (I don't believe he is).
    If you believe he should be removed because Syrian "rebels" (who most likely aren't Syrians, or rebels, but mercenaries) launched the gas attacks, then you've confused the heck out of me.
    I believe Assad should be supported as the legitimate head of state until unbiased and incontrovertible evidence against him is demonstrated to the world.
    Wesley S. Scott, MBA, MIS, ABOM, NCLE-AC, LDO - SC & GA

    “As our circle of knowledge expands, so does the circumference of darkness surrounding it.” -Albert Einstein

  10. #35
    One eye sees, the other feels OptiBoard Silver Supporter
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johns View Post
    This has been the source of my confusion. Why would a guy that is obviously winning the war, turn on his own people, in the town where he had his strongest support?
    Urban warfare can be a ***** (room by room fighting with snipers- see Stalingrad). A little sarin can go a long way towards clearing out a ten block area filled with the opposition. After all, Syria has one of the world's largest supply of chemical weapons, and Assad has been known to kill civilians by the tens of thousands at a time (see Hama 1982).

    I think stalemate better describes the present status of the civil war.

    http://www.economist.com/blogs/pomeg...rias-civil-war
    Science is a way of trying not to fool yourself. - Richard P. Feynman

    Experience is the hardest teacher. She gives the test before the lesson.



  11. #36
    ABOM Wes's Avatar
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    Bashar al-Assad was 16 years old when that happened, Robert. That was Hafez al-Assad.
    Wesley S. Scott, MBA, MIS, ABOM, NCLE-AC, LDO - SC & GA

    “As our circle of knowledge expands, so does the circumference of darkness surrounding it.” -Albert Einstein

  12. #37
    ABOM Wes's Avatar
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    Wesley S. Scott, MBA, MIS, ABOM, NCLE-AC, LDO - SC & GA

    “As our circle of knowledge expands, so does the circumference of darkness surrounding it.” -Albert Einstein

  13. #38
    One eye sees, the other feels OptiBoard Silver Supporter
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    The Syrians only know Hama, and Assad. He should get his family out of Syria before it's too late.
    Science is a way of trying not to fool yourself. - Richard P. Feynman

    Experience is the hardest teacher. She gives the test before the lesson.



  14. #39
    ABOM Wes's Avatar
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    Are you suggesting the Syrians can't tell one Assad from another? That's akin to suggesting Americans can't tell one Bush from another. Hmmm, wait; nevermind. Bad analogy.
    Wesley S. Scott, MBA, MIS, ABOM, NCLE-AC, LDO - SC & GA

    “As our circle of knowledge expands, so does the circumference of darkness surrounding it.” -Albert Einstein

  15. #40
    Forever Liz's Dad Steve Machol's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes View Post
    Are you suggesting the Syrians can't tell one Assad from another? That's akin to suggesting Americans can't tell one Bush from another. Hmmm, wait; nevermind. Bad analogy.


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  16. #41
    One eye sees, the other feels OptiBoard Silver Supporter
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes View Post
    Are you suggesting the Syrians can't tell one Assad from another?
    No, but if they could reanimate the father, the majority of Syrians would kill him again, along with his son.

    That's akin to suggesting Americans can't tell one Bush from another. Hmmm, wait; nevermind. Bad analogy.
    A better analogy would be the Kim's of North Korea.
    Science is a way of trying not to fool yourself. - Richard P. Feynman

    Experience is the hardest teacher. She gives the test before the lesson.



  17. #42
    Ophthalmic Optician
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    Lately, I've been going straight to the comment section of the news, rather than reading the entire articles.

    Regarding the Russians giving our president an exit strategy out of the mess he created, one poster wrote:

    "Putin plays chess, Obama plays golf"

    (Insert any recent president)

  18. #43
    Compulsive Truthteller OptiBoard Gold Supporter Uncle Fester's Avatar
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    So Kerrys' off the cuff remark may give Washington wiggle room to get out of this.

    When early on Congress said it wanted a say in what I'm sure they felt would by now be a fait accompli it has become to them a case of "Be careful what you wish for"!

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    Looks like there will be a UN hearing on Russia's attempts to have Syria turn over its chemical weapons.

    That's a good thing, I hope.

    <SARC>
    Of course, he can still drop napalm on his citizens, but what the heck, right? They aren't CHEMICAL weapons!
    </SARC>
    Last edited by MikeAurelius; 09-10-2013 at 10:23 AM. Reason: Added sarcasm tags

  20. #45
    One eye sees, the other feels OptiBoard Silver Supporter
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johns View Post
    Lately, I've been going straight to the comment section of the news, rather than reading the entire articles.

    Regarding the Russians giving our president an exit strategy out of the mess he created, one poster wrote:

    "Putin plays chess, Obama plays golf"

    (Insert any recent president)
    It's the carrot and the stick. I don't don't see Assad giving it up, so watch for the stick. In chess terms, Assad will lose a pawn or two.

    Here are the likely primary targets.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_airports_in_Syria

    Hopefully we can get it done before he lines the runways with kindergarteners.
    Science is a way of trying not to fool yourself. - Richard P. Feynman

    Experience is the hardest teacher. She gives the test before the lesson.



  21. #46
    Compulsive Truthteller OptiBoard Gold Supporter Uncle Fester's Avatar
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    This just in...

    Assad will surrender all his chemical weapons to the UN...


    On an unrelated note- Monsanto Corp. has just received one of the largest orders ever from the agriculture department of the Assad regime for a shipment of all purpose insecticide...

  22. #47
    One eye sees, the other feels OptiBoard Silver Supporter
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Fester View Post
    This just in...

    Assad will surrender all his chemical weapons to the UN...


    On an unrelated note- Monsanto Corp. has just received one of the largest orders ever from the agriculture department of the Assad regime for a shipment of all purpose insecticide...
    A chance to take a deep breath, drink a few, and refresh the target list.

    DAMASCUS—Citing the ongoing international debate over his alleged use of chemical weapons, Syrian president Bashar al-Assad reportedly subjected himself to a small dosage of sarin gas Sunday “just to see what it feels like.” “I figured it wouldn’t hurt to try a tiny little bit—but holy ****, was I wrong,” said Assad, who gingerly inhaled from a tube containing the lethal nerve agent and then proceeded to vomit into a nearby sink; experience severe eye pain, confusion, and partial paralysis; and then briefly lose consciousness. “I must’ve sniffed that stuff for, like, three seconds tops, but any more and I probably would have lost control of my entire central nervous system. I mean, can you imagine what a high dose of sarin would do to someone? Especially a child? Jesus.” Assad then abruptly told reporters he needed to end the interview before collapsing to the ground and convulsing uncontrollably.

    http://www.theonion.com/articles/bas...on-self,33800/
    Science is a way of trying not to fool yourself. - Richard P. Feynman

    Experience is the hardest teacher. She gives the test before the lesson.



  23. #48
    MasterCrafter OptiBoarder MasterCrafter's Avatar
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    It's George W. Bush's fault !!



  24. #49
    Compulsive Truthteller OptiBoard Gold Supporter Uncle Fester's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MasterCrafter View Post
    It's George W. Bush's fault !!
    True that!

  25. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Martellaro View Post
    A chance to take a deep breath, drink a few, and refresh the target list.

    DAMASCUS—Citing the ongoing international debate over his alleged use of chemical weapons, Syrian president Bashar al-Assad reportedly subjected himself to a small dosage of sarin gas Sunday “just to see what it feels like.” “I figured it wouldn’t hurt to try a tiny little bit—but holy ****, was I wrong,” said Assad, who gingerly inhaled from a tube containing the lethal nerve agent and then proceeded to vomit into a nearby sink; experience severe eye pain, confusion, and partial paralysis; and then briefly lose consciousness. “I must’ve sniffed that stuff for, like, three seconds tops, but any more and I probably would have lost control of my entire central nervous system. I mean, can you imagine what a high dose of sarin would do to someone? Especially a child? Jesus.” Assad then abruptly told reporters he needed to end the interview before collapsing to the ground and convulsing uncontrollably.

    http://www.theonion.com/articles/bas...on-self,33800/
    the inital flavor is harsh, with a hint of almond. After that, the taste buds go numb.

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