I'm really serious. There just doesn't seem to be a lab that can satisfy me. I've gone round and round with (what I thought were) the best of them and I still don't see anything but average work. I find it difficult to believe that there isn't one lab out there that can meet my patients needs the way we want our own needs met.
Does anyone know of any one wholesale spectacle lab that really puts quality at the top of their priority list?
Thanks in advance for your replies.
Last edited by icare; 10-21-2005 at 03:54 PM.
Who did you try?
I'd rather not get into my personal experiences just yet. I don't want the topic to degenerate into the specifics of my individual case. I'm sure that will come out in the wash.
I will say that I know what products I like. I just want to know who out there can finish spex the way we know they were intended to be finished. The personnel changes in the wholesale industry must be a nightmare. The good guys deserve to be rewarded and I'd like to give them my business.
If anyone would like to chime in, I think I'd get a more objective view.
I find Cumberland Optical in Nasville to be very, very good.
But I do know many in this business who feel the key to success is to change labs at regular intervals or use a couple and hold the threat of changing to the other entirely over both of thems head.
Chip
Uncuts or Finished?
I have yet to find a lab that can do EVERTHING...I have one for surface and several for AR , stock, etc.......
A little more info would be helpful.
Mikol
:cheers: :cheers:
Blame the retails for this....
Well the trouble with that statement is that retail end wants the product as cheap as they can get it to maxamise their profit. So in order to give the crazy prices wholesale is working on quanity rather than quality at present. It was a sad day when the wholesale labs started under-cutting each others prices just to get a couple of extra jobs. You could be better looking for a small lab rather than a big one.icare said:
Does anyone know of any one wholesale spectacle lab that really puts quality at the top of their priority list?
Where i work we were always known for charging more but having very good quality and next to no returns. But sadly thats all changed now its "Ah send it out, let the customer decide"....
Precision Optical Company
We have been extemely happy with Precision Optical Company in West Hartford, CT. If you that something will require extra care, all you have to do is call them up and ask the customer service reps what the best way to process the job is. They will tell you what info they need to do it your way or ask you for the frame if they will require the old lenses to match if it is an odd one.
They are a privately owned lab and even the reps who answer the phones have a ton of experience. Here is their website:
Icare,
I was at a conference this weekend and toured Schroeder Optical, an independent optical lab in Roanoke, VA. I was impressed by the equipment and the people that ran the lab. It is a family owned lab and has been around for years. One of the ladies I spoke with had been at that lab working for the grandfather, the father and now the son for 30 years! That has to say something for the people running it! If there are happy employees, than the work must be quality as well as they go hand in hand! Some of the people attending the tour do business with the lab and spoke in glowing terms about them!
It is run now by Tom Schroeder and they can be reached at 800-628-4146.
http://www.schroederoptical.com/
Last edited by Cindy Hamlin; 09-23-2002 at 10:58 AM.
~Cindy
"If you can't be a good example, then you'll just have to be a horrible warning." -Catherine Aird-
I know, Chip. It seems to work. But, don't you feel like such a heel to have to hold a hatchet over their heads? I've done it a hundred times. It's so tiring and costly to have to push and pull your way through red tape and inconsiderate personel to get it right the first time, every time.chip anderson said:
But I do know many in this business who feel the key to success is to change labs at regular intervals or use a couple and hold the threat of changing to the other entirely over both of thems head.
Chip
When I pay a premium for work to be done well, I don't want to waste my personal time chattering with the principals to get it done right the second time plus watch my patients run because my lab can't keep their act together.
I'm happy to learn that there may be a few opticals out there that (today, at least) actually deliver the quality that patients prefer. They deserve everyone's business.
Hey, how about a website devoted specifically to polls and feedback on specific opticals? Maybe that would keep them in gear. Like Neilson ratings for TV - the better your optical rating, the more you can charge for your work.
Icare, to me , surface work and finish work are completely different animals. And I gather your frustration is with the finish side of the labs(?), and that's understanable. It's a lot easier to automate surface work, up to and including robotics. still takes live folks to pull the right semi-finished blanks from inventory, block, run them on the finer/polishers, de-block, and inspect, etc. ahhh, then they go to "finish". even with some of the new hi-tech edgers, etc. it is a higher skill level, to finish block, set up the edger run, deblock etc. each finish job is unique, one is beverled for metal, one for plastic, one gets grooved, next one drilled, actual frame sizes don't necessarily match marked sizes.
We' have done our own "finish" work, including "facets", for 25 years. today, I think it's sort of normal to talk to customer service reps who are clueless; though when you do get one that's sharp, it's a noticeable pleasure! So, I get everything surfaced uncut. if my clients aren't happy, it's my fault! it's my fault if I use a lab who can't handle my needs too. one of the problems in finish is that the process from styling to dispensing is "creative license", you've painted this "visual" for the client, given them some expectations, and it's harder to translate over the phone/fax etc to the lab! most labs try to do everything humanly possible to accomplish our desires; in the time desired, at the price desired, etc. bless their hearts, what would we do without them? I am so thankful for our vendors! We have more control over quality and time and price than we feel we do, now don't we? so, don't oversell, over promise, or over charge (or undercharge). if you can do your own finish work, do it; if you can't, don't, but dearly appreciate those who can do it for you; if you're not getting what you desire, talk to the boss, tell him what you have to have, maybe he has a problem you can help him fix, instead of just going away and trying to find someone else...way 'nuff said!
I'm Drinking to Tx Ranger!!!!
I have worked for many chains, super opticals and the like as well as the pickiest and most knoledgeable of independents.
I have firmly come to belive that with todays modern equipment we at the lab are for the most part the "framers" of the house....
If you dont like it when its done... don't scream at me.. your (the optician) the one who wrote the blue prints!!!
How many times do you hear about the pharmicist getting sued for filling a quack M.D.'s script for pills exactly as written......
Doesent happen.
Thank you Texas Ranger!
Maybe you can open your own lab and do your own work as well as you like. Kev
We purchase uncuts and have our drilled rimless done by the lab. Over all we are very satisfied with our choice and not looking. Been there, done that. We built a relationship with our labs ( We use two of four that they own).
We do use remote tracing to order all lenses and if a job needs to edged and my lab tech is out. The glitches that occur are not always the lab's fault but done through staff not heeding base curves or comments on order forms.
Myodisk,
thanks for the toast, buy ya another round? In the old days, I grew up in my uncle's lab, and my brother had a wholesale lab for about 10 years, and we've always done our own finish work, but for a stretch of 14 months in 88-89, we surfaced also! I was duly warned about in-house surfacing...It cost me about $60K, at least for that lesson. that pittance of a margin from the semi-finished blank cost to the surfaced uncut, wasn't worth all the aggravation, waste of time and product. not even to mention the cost of inventoring lenses! my brothers lab was big from 80-89, had a big "facets" market, he hand-cut an average of 30 facets a day, fashion tints, bevels, drilled and mounted, variluxes, had an in-house AR unit(way before his time). but his 'doctor' accounts would order say a V2 in a tura faceted 3-piece, 56mm pd, 60-19 frame, +300;2.50 add, 30mm seg ht., pd/ht, missed cut out by 5 in,5 down, and they'd just say "make it fit". he couldn;'t do that, but would say haow much smaller the lens needed to be. it was always, "but, mrs jones, wants it the sample size!" well then, sell mrs. jones something that CAN be made!" and the opt. techs would always be upset with the finished thickness, they actually thought it was going to be the "demo" lens thickness" i would think it wouyld so embarrasing to have to call mrs jones back and tell her that what we just "sold" her and charged her a few hundred dollars for, now can't be done!!! wouldn't it be better to understand "cut-in thickness, how to find ED, and appreciate that labs can't do some things, just because the mrs jones' of the world WANT them; kind of like fitting a PAL into a 25mm B frame, you don't have to, JUST SAY NO!
Man, this thread is cookin' now! Thanks for your replies, everyone. I hope we can keep this going without degenerating into a flame session. If this topic hasn't rolled around here a few times before, I'd be suprised.
Maybe the point of my thread is fragmenting a bit. Hopefully, no one is taking my gripes too personally. Let's face it, there probably aren't any fly-by-night or short-cutting professionals that would spend much time in a forum like this, right? I'm pleased to learn from the pros what is and what isn't possible in the industry.
There are probably a zillion ODs out there that don't have the slightest idea what constitues a good frame/lens combination. Please don't lump me into that group. I'm not an optician, but I've been doing my own finishing lab work for about seven years and you know - I really like it, alot. By choice, I won't finish everything. I don't do glass. I don't do +10.00's, -12.00's, and prism beyond 6D or so. I don't do drilled jobs. I prefer to send my safety work out, too, because I can't save that much on it. I really don't do the wild stuff, basically, because I don't do enough of it to finish it to the highest standards of the industry. I doubt we'll ever surface in my office.
I do finish to the very best of my ability. When I start a job, I expect it to turn out perfectly. The eyewire closes just right, the bevel is positioned for the best look and best vision. The safety bevel is uniform and equal in both eyes. That kind of stuff. It's the kind of person I am. In most cases, if I want the job done right, I trust myself more than anyone else and I have only myself to blame if it doesn't come out ideally. My spoilage and redo rates are pretty low. My turnaround times are much lower and my patients are much happier.
So, when I do send the work out, I'm looking for the guys that are out there that appreciate their work as much as I do. They get up in the morning and say, "I'm going to make some really nice spex for some people today." They deserve my business.
It doesn't make sense to me that I should get frames back that are stripped or misshapened. Lenses shouldn't be a millimeter oversize, or under. There shouldn't be poly waste all over the finished job. There shouldn't be obvious surface defects. There shouldn't be erratic finish bevels and rolled out or chipped out grooves. I'm not talking about fitting an 8 base -9.00 in a sport goggle, just regular work that should get the attention it deserves.
Remember, if this doesn't sound like your work, it isn't. Don't take it personally. I just wonder who are the opticals/opticians out there that still realize who they're making the spex for. Some labs think they're making the spex for the OD's. They should start making them for the patients again.
Thank you again for your replies. Please chime in with the best wholesale labs you can think of.
I'm working at Northeast Lens In Newtom Falls,Ma. 1-800-403-8997. Most of the work their is done opticians. The edging is done by an expirenced optician on the best equipment available. It isn't one of those places that does pay a living wage so tha staff there sticks around and cares about the work they do. I do all the drilled jobs and take pride in my work. Thier are places that are cheeper but you get what you pay for on some things.
That's what I'm getting at, gebe33. Thanks for the reply.gebe33 said: you get what you pay for on some things.
MH optical, Barry and Hirsh were always greate labs but a litle on the expensive side!
I work for Index 53 which is a small family owned lab in St. Cloud, Mn. They have been in business for 30 years. We do work for many areas all around the country although our major business comes from the midwest. We do a lot of specialty work along with the easy stuff. Our prices are very competitive and we ship overnight if needed. We strive to supply only the highest quality workmanship and service. Give us a call at 1-800-328-7035 and ask for Larry who is a very hands on owner and is almost always in the lab to take your call and answer your questions.
Does anyone know of any one wholesale spectacle lab that really puts quality at the top of their priority list?
Naturally, I'd love to say that any ELoA (Essilor Labs of America) lab that you go to will have excellent quality, but to be honest, I only have experience with one of them from the viewpoint of a customer (as a Dispensing Optician I used Milroy Optical in Tampa, FL- they did good work).
In the past, I have had experience with several Walman Optical labs and ALWAYS found them to have very high quality (they were never the cheapest, but they did very good work and were always open to my observations). The Walman location I dealt with the most was in York, PA- but the others were A to A+ as well.
Since we're on the topic of quality labs (and I was initially worried this would turn into a flame session, but I guess we've all become old and wisened, mature OptiBoarders now), I would like to know y'all's impression on any ELoA labs you deal with. How is the quality, turn around time, etc.?
Pete Hanlin, ABOM
Vice President Professional Services
Essilor of America
http://linkedin.com/in/pete-hanlin-72a3a74
Pete,
A couple of factors, here; I have fit Varilux lenses since '78, as our pal of choice, and 90% of our clients wear Variluxs. I wasn't using Omega/Dallas prior to the introduction of Crizal process AR in '98. But since they can process Crizal in-house, it seems bad logistics to not use them. We do all but glass finish work. 95% of our jobs are Crizal, we submit orders on Trace and Transmit, and are on direct in town delivery, so service time is remarkable! in the past we had used DBL in Minn., prior to their aquisition by Eloa. I would say that there are several excellant labs marketing our area that are quite good; Pech Opt. (Iowa), Southwest Lens(Dallas), Dietz(Fort Worth). Lab pricing? Well, all of the "new" tech lenses are costly, period. I think there are economic issues with doing the majority of you work with one lab, mainly perchase discounts for volumn and prompt payment. if you're not getting max discounts for prompt payment, you are likely paying too much...and that's not the labs fault...
Hurray St Cloud! Is it the air out there?
Last edited by Dot the Eye; 10-03-2002 at 09:45 PM.
I hear all of your concerns and honestly, I felt the same way as far as being frustrated with the quality, or lack of with the larger labs. So I just recently started a Private Lab and would love to talk to you. We are base our selfs on Quality, Honesty, and True Craftmanship. Drill mounts are one of our specialties. From the regular screw to the screwless hingless mounts. You wont find Poly jumbled up on the edge of a finished product from us, after all that is why I started my own lab with people that had my same beliefs in Quality as I. Being an opticianand lab manager for 10 years gave me plenty of time to step back and figure out how I could get my patients glasses to look the best, in a timely manner, and not have to speak with disrespectful customer service reps on the other end of a telephone. So I decided I will do it myself and help my fellow eyecare practicioners get the quality work they deserve by doing outside work as well, and here we are. Please give me a call 1-888-707-2219 Christopher Anderson, A.B.O.C.
Or you can e-mail us anytime apvoptical@hotmail.com Thank you for reading my reply and please feel free to call or e-mail with any questions.
Christopher Anderson
APV Optical Inc.
Homer Optical does a great job for us.
I work for an independent lab up in Rochester, NY. It is called Advance Optical. You may have heard of us. We've been in business since 1922 and I feel that our Quality is unsurpassed both on uncut and finished work.
We pride ourselves in being the best that we can be and constantly upgrading our technology to stay that way. We listen to you and educate ourselves to your needs.
Whereabouts in PA are you located? You can e-mail me at optidan@aol.com if you like.
I look forward to hearing from you. If you wish to call us, our number is 800-462-6723. Thanks
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