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Thread: PD responsibilities

  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fezz View Post
    I look at it as more like the IQ of those buying eyewear online!
    HaHaHaHa, That is a really good one Fezz.
    Lots of good information coming out of this post. I really appreciate Craig's views. I as well have only had about 3 people ask for their pd's, which I charge for the measurement, and ask them to return to verify measurement was produced correctly. One of these patients came back about a month after ordering online, and ordered a pair of Zeiss Individual Progressives after experiencing the Online eyewear. Think I won them back in the end with the service. My patients tend to understand what it is that they are buying and receiving, the product as well as the service.

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by finefocus View Post
    I'd like to stock some of the 62's, and a few 30/29's please.
    Those must be popular, as they are all backordered! We've got a bunch of 75's that not many have used, and there's not much difference if you want to try those.
    Ophthalmic Optician, Society to Advance Opticianry

  3. #28
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    I just wanted to post #1000.

    I still feel the same and no bells went off!

  4. #29
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    We don't do 75's, as the pertinent customer tends to be primitive and hard to manage; we give them a coupon for the local SFSE.

  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by craig View Post
    i just wanted to post #1000.

    I still feel the same and no bells went off!

    ***bells***bells***bells***bells***

  6. #31
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    Anything other than "future vision" to inform that opinion, Mr. Santini? :)

  7. #32
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    If people want to do-it-themselves, by all means. It's a pretty free country in that regard right now, even though it's mostly illegal.

    If people want legal, professional care, even better.

    Don't mess around with Mr. Inbetween.

  8. #33
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter Barry Santini's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by drk View Post
    Anything other than "future vision" to inform that opinion, Mr. Santini? :)
    I tend to think, in keeping consistent with the FCLCA, that eyeglass Rxs will no doubt be required to Include a PD to allow free and unencumbered redemption by consumers...particularly when EMR/EHR become the norm for transmitting eyewear "health" info.

  9. #34
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    Back in the day.I did some wholesale work for an OD and everything was 4 in,4 below.Of course all the work was Flat tops.Never had a remake from him.

  10. #35
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    Yesterday I did a job in a 42-24 frame, followed by a 62-15. Patient PD's were within 2mm of each other.
    One size certainly does not fit all.

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Santini View Post
    I tend to think, in keeping consistent with the FCLCA, that eyeglass Rxs will no doubt be required to Include a PD to allow free and unencumbered redemption by consumers...particularly when EMR/EHR become the norm for transmitting eyewear "health" info.
    Noone's encumbering anyone. As long as they have a valid Rx, they can get glasses...from anywhere.

    Does Home Depot come out and dig the holes for the people that buy shovels?

    You wanna buy online? Take your own damned PD.

  12. #37
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter Barry Santini's Avatar
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    Look, I'll be amongst the first to admit if i should change my view, but I think our industry is not well served by defending territoriality on matters if PD. it's not about logic- it's about recognizing the negative emotional response that consumers, consumer advicates and the press will fan and leverage to make us look like we are unfairly denying the public free choice for eyewear, lower-cost or not. A simple binocular pd is really not so much trouble to include is ir?
    I'd hate to see the press squewer us on such a minor point, and get us mired in minutiae rather than helping the public to see the real, intrinsic balue of our expertise and services.
    B

  13. #38
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    Its not about territory. Its about common sense. The pd us used to build the glasses. The pd is not used for contacts. It is not used for anything, unless someone wants glasses. And the pd is just 1/10 of what should be provided to build proper glasses. Its about educating the press that the pd is worthless and has nothing to do with an Rx until all other parameters are selected, the lens, the frame, ect..... Should the pt decide they want glasses, then an expert optician can provide accurate measurements at that time. I don't see a reason to clog up exam rooms so people can get pds, nor do I see a reason to mislead the public that if they have a Rx and a PD they are good to go. Its just simply not true.

  14. #39
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    I am going to have to agree with Barry on this one. I think acting so territorial over the PD just proves how concerned we are about losing business to the online retailers. I vote to let them have it. I look forward to inspecting and failing work done by online retailers. Although in the office I work for it hasn't affected us.

  15. #40
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter Barry Santini's Avatar
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    Austin eyewear: I think the public is good to go with an Rx and a PD for eyewear...adequate eyewear of varying total quality abd satisfaction. In keeping with a free market, if the public trys and discards online Rx eyewear, the free market has made that decision. If not, or in between, again, let the narket decide.
    I personally won't listen to a 128kps mp3. Should I rightfully insist that others shouldn't either, because I see it as inferior?
    It is about degree. The implication jas benn unspoken that 'glasses r glasses'. The buying public who've been treated to better gets yet another venue to find out...on their own, by themselves.
    I for one, welcome it.
    Btw: i meant no distespect to you in a previous post about Rx control. It's just that stories are legion about grey areas of abuse and outright ignoring of the FTC Rx release rule. The Rx handoff to staff, rather than patients, is but one.
    B

  16. #41
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Gold Supporter Judy Canty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by APBOD View Post
    Noone's encumbering anyone. As long as they have a valid Rx, they can get glasses...from anywhere.

    Does Home Depot come out and dig the holes for the people that buy shovels?

    You wanna buy online? Take your own damned PD.
    +1 =)

  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Santini View Post
    Austin eyewear: I think the public is good to go with an Rx and a PD for eyewear...adequate eyewear of varying total quality abd satisfaction. In keeping with a free market, if the public trys and discards online Rx eyewear, the free market has made that decision. If not, or in between, again, let the narket decide.
    I personally won't listen to a 128kps mp3. Should I rightfully insist that others shouldn't either, because I see it as inferior?
    It is about degree. The implication jas benn unspoken that 'glasses r glasses'. The buying public who've been treated to better gets yet another venue to find out...on their own, by themselves.
    B

    Who knows what the percentage is, but for example sake lets say that 40% of pts that go thru the exam room in a day are SV only (ages 12-43), a 31 year spread, and remainder are going to need something else. 43-85, a 42 year spread. That means your distribution is roughly 40% that are SV and lets say 50% want glasses. That is 20% of the pts who come thru an exam room that can use the PD as an approximation for getting glasses that get them somewhat in the area of decent acuity, or 75% of potential acuity, OC height and other things will likely be off. You are catering to 20% of the population by offering the PD at this time, and they still will not get the best vision possible. It does no good for the remainder, not does it educate them as they move forward in time and become presbyopes. Its a disservice to them all the way around, at every age.

    Listening to poor digital sampling is one thing, putting up with a fraction of your potential visual acuity is another.

    BTW - I know you didn't mean anyone in particular. I was just "messin with ya." I know your passionate about the subject. You're a respected person in the community, so people are going to listen to you, so my mission is to provide perspective when ever you bring up the subject, because I'd hate to see legions of opticians who look up to you end up distrusting every O on the planet. Yes, there are probably a few bad ones, but most I know are pretty good. Even drk!

  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Santini View Post
    Look, I'll be amongst the first to admit if i should change my view, but I think our industry is not well served by defending territoriality on matters if PD. it's not about logic- it's about recognizing the negative emotional response that consumers, consumer advicates and the press will fan and leverage to make us look like we are unfairly denying the public free choice for eyewear, lower-cost or not. A simple binocular pd is really not so much trouble to include is ir?
    I'd hate to see the press squewer us on such a minor point, and get us mired in minutiae rather than helping the public to see the real, intrinsic balue of our expertise and services.
    B
    Big deal...Who cares about the negative emotional response?....It will have zero effect on our business....Unless made law,PD release is not the industry standard....It is currently,and always has been the responsibility of the eyeglass provider to determine it....


    If people wish to be their own "optician"...they can either try to do the measurement on their own,or find someone who will measure and release it.....I charge $40 for it......


    Perhaps you dont mind providing measurements and after sales service to people for free,so they can buy online......But I wont.....


    Why should I do the competition's work for them?

  19. #44
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter Barry Santini's Avatar
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    I'm very glad that you, drk and others are here/there, keeping me in *check*.
    Drk knows I'm inherently attracted to "shiny" things.
    Austineyewear: you make very good points. But I think it's incumbent on us to recognize power of media and social media to fan the flames of emotinsl responses. My measure is that, even after exposure ro our points and arguements, the public remains emotionally skeptical. I'd rather concede and get padt the emontional point, and open up the dialogue for rhe real, intrinsic value of what we do.
    B

  20. #45
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter Barry Santini's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sledzinator View Post
    I am going to have to agree with Barry on this one. I think acting so territorial over the PD just proves how concerned we are about losing business to the online retailers. I vote to let them have it. I look forward to inspecting and failing work done by online retailers. Although in the office I work feor it hasn't affected us.
    I don't know about 'failing' but I think lack of satisfaction is a far better net with which to catch the unhappy fish.

  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Santini View Post
    But I think it's incumbent on us to recognize power of media and social media to fan the flames of emotinsl responses. My measure is that, even after exposure ro our points and arguements, the public remains emotionally skeptical.
    B
    I don't really hear anyone being skeptical. I would be skeptical of the "media". Any stories you read could easily be a hidden advertisement funded by online retailers. Its done all the time.

    We should always strive for perfection, and only give in when all else fails!!

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sledzinator View Post
    I am going to have to agree with Barry on this one. I think acting so territorial over the PD just proves how concerned we are about losing business to the online retailers. I vote to let them have it. I look forward to inspecting and failing work done by online retailers. Although in the office I work for it hasn't affected us.
    The concern isn't about losing business to online retailers. The reality is that I don't work for online retailers, nor do I pay my staff to work for online retailers. So, for online retailers to suggest/require that I or my staff do THEIR work for them is insulting. If they want to sell glasses, then let them do the work that is necessary to provide the "commodity" they are selling.

  23. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by APBOD View Post
    The concern isn't about losing business to online retailers. The reality is that I don't work for online retailers, nor do I pay my staff to work for online retailers. So, for online retailers to suggest/require that I or my staff do THEIR work for them is insulting. If they want to sell glasses, then let them do the work that is necessary to provide the "commodity" they are selling.
    Very true, which is what we all do for 1-800-CONCRAP now. They burn up fax machine, ink, paper, tie up phone lines, staff, interrupt flow, ect.....

  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by APBOD View Post
    The concern isn't about losing business to online retailers. The reality is that I don't work for online retailers, nor do I pay my staff to work for online retailers. So, for online retailers to suggest/require that I or my staff do THEIR work for them is insulting. If they want to sell glasses, then let them do the work that is necessary to provide the "commodity" they are selling.
    I can definitely see your point on that and I agree. I just think we should make the best of a poor situation. As we all know the online retailers are here to stay. I want to be the one with the net when they aren't satisfied with their glasses.

  25. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by APBOD View Post
    The concern isn't about losing business to online retailers. The reality is that I don't work for online retailers, nor do I pay my staff to work for online retailers. So, for online retailers to suggest/require that I or my staff do THEIR work for them is insulting. If they want to sell glasses, then let them do the work that is necessary to provide the "commodity" they are selling.
    Absolutely.....Ive been lurking for a long time on these forums.....I have a hard time comprehending how so many people posting ,place no value on their skills....And are so afraid to offend anybody who walks in the door....


    I dont know of any other field where service providers will provide their expertise for free,so someone can make the purchase elsewhere...

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