Give me my PD Petition.....................................

**Chris Ryser** · 02-17-2012, 06:58 AM

A New Website in the UK.................... doing a petition to force opticians to give out OD, when is it starting here ?

Increasing Number of Consumers are Buying Glasses Online with full Confidence.

The impact of the growing trend towards online shopping generally is increasingly being felt in the optical sector. Not only are the anti-competitive practices of the mainstream optical industry failing to stem this growth they are actively bringing the profession into disrepute as evidenced by the increasing number of complaints to consumer bodies.

Online retailers of prescription glasses are providing consumers with help and guidance on how to measure their PD by themselves when it is refused by the optometrist who carried out their eye test.

Measuring your own PD is not difficult!

Unfortunately the effect of an opticians refusal to provide a PD when requested is to create a lasting bad impression of eye-care professionals in the eyes of the general public, for no good reason.

In the interests of everyone who wears glasses (which is most of us at some point in our lives) we urge you to sign our petition today.

Click hereGive Me My PDto sign our online petition.

http://www.pupillary-distance.net/

**Barry Santini** · 02-17-2012, 07:24 AM

This is why I've said we as a profession must reflect upon exactly what we say is the real danger with online eyewear. Trying to falsely tap into the public's emotions with unsubstantiated scare tactics will not work. It will in fact, work against us.

B

**drk** · 02-17-2012, 08:04 AM

Good point, Barry. We have to be honest.

I think buying a frame online is "OK", but not wise.

I think taking the "prescribing" out of prescription lenses, and "filling" it anywhere, is too much. Your visual health is at stake.

**Chris Ryser** · 02-17-2012, 08:06 AM

and what do you say to this ?.....................................

Give Me My Pupillary Distance

We, the undersigned, call on the General Optical Council (GOC) to take one simple step to give us, the consumers, a fairer deal and greater choice when buying our prescription glasses.
Under current GOC regulations, a prescription for glasses is not required to provide one crucial piece of information: the Pupillary Distance or PD, which is the distance between the centres of the patient’s pupils as illustrated above.
This measurement is essential to ensure that the optical centres of the lenses in your new glasses are perfectly aligned with your pupils, so as to provide maximum comfort and effectiveness.

Although consumers can, if necessary, measure their own PD, there is no legitimate reason for eye-care professionals to omit this measurement from the eye test prescription.

This is an unethical and anti-competitive practice and places an unnecessary obstacle in the way of patients who wish to exercise their freedom of choice and shop around for their glasses, especially if they want to take advantage of competitive prices from online suppliers.
In the interests of consumer choice, ethical professional practice and patient welfare, we call on the GOC to add the PD measurement to optical prescription forms without delay.

Read more about this campaign and view the evidence at: www.pupillary-distance.net

**Nikolay Angelov** · 02-17-2012, 08:07 AM

the anti-competitive practices of the mainstream optical industry ... are actively bringing the profession into disrepute

Who would have thought

.

... the passive aggressive tactics in the "online optical" threads around here are backfiring.
I intently await the next "online optical" threads where "slapping the customer with a sock potato" technique is discussed

.

**Barry Santini** · 02-17-2012, 08:14 AM

Give them their PD, fer cris' sake! Its part of their medical record. Let em try online. If u've done your job all along, charged fair prices, then, if that customer is truly right for you, they will be back! Just like real life when they try another B&M!

**scriptfiller** · 02-17-2012, 08:20 AM

Why do people think they have the right to other people's time and equipment? The reason a PD is not part of the RX is it is not a (made-up word here) a diagnosable condition such as presbyopia or PVD. If a consumer is shopping at "DIY Optical" on line then they should DIY their PD.

Not being a carpenter, if I screw-up a DIY project at my home by not having the proper tool, I don't go to the local carpenter and brow-beat him to use his expertise/equipment. Same is true in reverse, I don't go to the carpenter to get his tools and expertise before starting my project.

**Craig** · 02-17-2012, 08:25 AM

What will you say about me? We run an online business and also refuse to give out a PD. The online either gets them from the patient or we send them a ruler to use, no big deal and we had zero returns in 2011! So please don't tell me it can't work as we live it every day and have only looked to grow it in the future.

The PD is not the issue for success or failure of online optical; It will succeed and those who do not adapt will fail! The rules change and so do we or we will become extinct.

I sell online for full retail with only free shipping so discounts are not the reason we are growing.

I only share this as a real situation that shows when you focus on your issues and not that of the folks walking in your doors it seems that the Pd is an issue in success or failure.

Craig

**Craig** · 02-17-2012, 08:30 AM

Originally Posted by Barry Santini

Give them their PD, fer cris' sake! Its part of their medical record. Let em try online. If u've done your job all along, charged fair prices, then, if that customer is truly right for you, they will be back! Just like real life when they try another B&M!

You are too nice and mellowing like a fine red wine! I do not drink wine- my wife drinks enough for both of us- and maybe that is why we do not give out PD's unless you donate $30 to my charity box. It happens to be Make A Wish.

I have only had 2 requests ever for a pd from me and maybe 8 total.

Barry,

Do you get many requests for a pd from an existing customer of yours and loose them? I doubt it on both accounts and am curious to see how many folks actually see and from whom.

Craig

**Barry Santini** · 02-17-2012, 08:46 AM

Requests for pds have so far totalled 3-5, mostly from young adults. No problem giving them out.
i do believe now, however, that the PD should be part of the Rx if the client requests it.

B

**Craig** · 02-17-2012, 08:59 AM

Originally Posted by Barry Santini

Requests for pds have so far totalled 3-5, mostly from young adults. No problem giving them out.
i do believe now, however, that the PD should be part of the Rx if the client requests it.

B

You are not the one who did the exam? So how do you become part of the exam unless the OD is in your office and that is the arrangement?

**Barry Santini** · 02-17-2012, 09:11 AM

Craig, my position is that *any* where a person gets examined, the PD should be made part of the RX, upon request. Our industry should not impede consumers in this regard. Our office is primarily no exams, and we take no insurance.

People come because they *want* to.

What a novel idea!

Clearly, consumers are increasingly reacting to optical businesses witholding PDs in an emotionally-negative manner.

I would be *very* careful about fanning the flames of a negative emotional response. If you doubt me, ask the Susan Komen Foundation.

B

**Robert Martellaro** · 02-17-2012, 10:38 AM

Under current GOC regulations, a prescription for glasses is not required to provide one crucial piece of information: the Pupillary Distance or PD

One of many crucial pieces of information actually. Moreover, the OC position is frame dependent, so that the PD is not sufficient unless the lens is non-PAL or low and equal powers.

If you want to DIY, then do it, and quit whining. And don't wear them when driving unless you want to go to jail when you hurt someone due to your incompetence.

**AngeHamm** · 02-17-2012, 11:12 AM

Originally Posted by Barry Santini

Craig, my position is that *any* where a person gets examined, the PD should be made part of the RX, upon request. Our industry should not impede consumers in this regard. Our office is primarily no exams, and we take no insurance.

People come because they *want* to.

What a novel idea!

Clearly, consumers are increasingly reacting to optical businesses witholding PDs in an emotionally-negative manner.

I would be *very* careful about fanning the flames of a negative emotional response. If you doubt me, ask the Susan Komen Foundation.

B

+1.

I have turned completely around on this issue. I'm now the one in the office agitating for us to come up with some way to monetize servicing online eyewear orders.

**LENNY** · 02-17-2012, 12:52 PM

My opinion is very basic!

I will do whatever I am paid for!

So far I dont see any procedure billable for PD measurements!

**4554lake** · 02-17-2012, 04:05 PM

Originally Posted by Chris Ryser

and what do you say to this ?.....................................

Give Me My Pupillary Distance

We, the undersigned, call on the General Optical Council (GOC) to take one simple step to give us, the consumers, a fairer deal and greater choice when buying our prescription glasses.
Under current GOC regulations, a prescription for glasses is not required to provide one crucial piece of information: the Pupillary Distance or PD, which is the distance between the centres of the patient’s pupils as illustrated above.
This measurement is essential to ensure that the optical centres of the lenses in your new glasses are perfectly aligned with your pupils, so as to provide maximum comfort and effectiveness.

Although consumers can, if necessary, measure their own PD, there is no legitimate reason for eye-care professionals to omit this measurement from the eye test prescription.

This is an unethical and anti-competitive practice and places an unnecessary obstacle in the way of patients who wish to exercise their freedom of choice and shop around for their glasses, especially if they want to take advantage of competitive prices from online suppliers.
In the interests of consumer choice, ethical professional practice and patient welfare, we call on the GOC to add the PD measurement to optical prescription forms without delay.

Read more about this campaign and view the evidence at: www.pupillary-distance.net

Who cares?....If people want their pd,I charge $40 for it.....If they dont want to pay,they can try to measure it themselves.....

Why should I give away my services,so someone can be their own optician ?

**4554lake** · 02-17-2012, 04:08 PM

Originally Posted by Barry Santini

Give them their PD, fer cris' sake! Its part of their medical record. Let em try online. If u've done your job all along, charged fair prices, then, if that customer is truly right for you, they will be back! Just like real life when they try another B&M!

So,do you do no charge, after sales service, for these online shoppers?

**Johns** · 02-17-2012, 09:36 PM

6561 people signed the petition since January 13, 2010...............................

and what do you say to this ?.....................................

Are you serious????? Are you REALLY serious??? From what we are told, there are (I'm round up here) somewhere around 400 trillion pairs of glasses being sold every hour online. And (correct me if I'm wrong here) since January of 2010 (2 years ago right?) there have only been 6,561 people sign this stupid petition?? That's almost a whopping 7 people per day!!!! OMG!!, WTF!!!!!HHC!!! (that's Online My Glasses, Wife That's Fat, & Holy, Holy, Cow)

Heck we've had Optiboard polls that drew more responses than this PD petition has!

Really?

**Johns** · 02-17-2012, 09:37 PM

6561 people signed the petition since January 13, 2010...............................

and what do you say to this ?.....................................

Are you serious????? Are you REALLY serious???

From what we are told, there are (I'm rounding up here) somewhere around 400 trillion pairs of glasses being sold every hour online. And (correct me if I'm wrong here) since January of 2010 (2 years ago right?) there have only been 6,561 people sign this stupid petition?? That's almost a whopping 7 people per day!!!! OMG!!, WTF!!!!!HHC!!! (that's Online My Glasses, Wife That's Fat, & Holy, Holy, Cow)

Heck we've had Optiboard polls that drew more responses than this PD petition has!

Really?

**Fezz** · 02-17-2012, 09:55 PM

You can say that again!

**Johns** · 02-17-2012, 09:59 PM

Originally Posted by Fezz

You can say that again!

Ok...if I can remember it all.

Are you serious????? Are you REALLY serious???

From what we are told, there are (I'm rounding up here) somewhere around 400 trillion pairs of glasses being sold every hour online. And (correct me if I'm wrong here) since January of 2010 (2 years ago right?) there have only been 6,561 people sign this stupid petition?? That's almost a whopping 7 people per day!!!! OMG!!, WTF!!!!!HHC!!! (that's Online My Glasses, Wife That's Fat, & Holy, Holy, Cow)

Heck we've had Optiboard polls that drew more responses than this PD petition has!

Really?

**Opticianjw** · 02-18-2012, 12:58 AM

let's be honest with ourselves, the online business is here to stay and we need to see how we can compete. The lens companies and frame companies have not objected and now are getting into online sales themselves. Independents are not unified and can continue to complain till the cows come home but that will not change anything. So that being said, if you lose 20 % of your business to online sales you need to figure out how to increase your business either by taking on line sales yourself or coming up with other ways to maintain your business. Right now laws prohibit licensed professionals to offer online eyewear legally but every year more and more people are purchasing eyeglasses on line, that needs to be changed. Licensed professionals need to be able to compete for that same business if they desire to offer online eyewear. I would prefer going back to the way business was a few years ago but since that is not an option, we need to change with the changing ways or look for another career.

**optical24/7** · 02-18-2012, 06:29 AM

For the one millionth time;

There are B&M right down the street from you that offer complete eye glasses starting at 39 bucks. There is a chain here offering 2 pair of PAL's with frames for 100 bucks. And you (*the collective you) really worry about online sales? Really?

I suggest you ( *the collective you) worry about that!

* Collective you; People that think online eyewear percentages will surpass online CL sales. ( Which is a whooping 8-10% of total CL sales).

**opt63** · 02-18-2012, 07:21 PM

In stark contrast to the logic put forth by some, the PD can't both be a:

- supercritical medical measurement that if done online will lead to blind masses driving over pedestrians

AND

- proprietary commercial data that is being 'stolen' by online optical shops

If its a danger to public health then it should be part of the exam and performed only by ODs... and if it's medical data it belongs to the patient, period, to take where they please. Regulators have long since written such in stone (there was a time when ODs argued that only if their people made and sold the glasses could the patient be properly treated... such arguments lost and now ODs must give the Rx to patients to take where they please).

**Aberdeen Angus** · 02-20-2012, 04:46 AM

I am not worried about online sales, in the same way I am not worried by Specsavers (big discount optical chain here). However I do not see any reason to aid my competitors. I suppose as well that the situation is slightly different here as the NHS pays for all eye examinations, and as such it would be rather hard to charge for a PD. Also, the optometrist does not measure the PD, except in very rare circumstances where the wish to produce prismatic effect, or in very high powers. It is the responsibilty of the dispensing optican here to ensure the correct measurements, and as I am not providing the eyewear I see no reason to do the measurement for who is.