I need my PD taken

[drk]

Unfortunately, no state can regulate what goes on in another state! Your state can pass regulations, but they can only apply to individuals or entities within that state, not outside it.

Let's say that an onliner in Ohio dispenses to Kentucky. Does the onliner have to follow KY dispensing rules? No. Does the onliner have to follow OH rules? Maybe not, in interstate commerce, but maybe so.

Let's say an onliner in Ohio dispenses to Ohio. Does the onliner have to follow OH rules? Absolutely.

Even if they could, checking compliance would be virtually impossible. Most states lack the resources to adequately check compliance with practitioners, much less their suppliers.

I don't think this is too big a problem. All websites should have to register in the state they operate or are owned, etc. If they have a substantial financial penalty for breaking the law (you know, like the speeding tickets are a quite nice "stupid tax" for the municipalities), then I think the job would more than pay for itself.

I guess there could be a regulation-free state set up (as they have in British Columbia) for them to flock to, in order to garner sales tax. I'm sure there is some scuzzy state that would allow it. Probably Nevada.

In that eventuality, there needs to be a federal law that says any and all dispensing regulations must be upheld for the customer's point of purchase. If you're selling online to State A, then you have tough rules to meet. Maybe in State B, there are no rules to meet.

The internet is here to stay folks, best we learn to live with it and not fight it.

I'm sure that you would not agree in an absolute sense. If people were buying terrorist materials online, we wouldn't say that. So, it's a matter of what you think is important, more than a matter of what we can or cannot control. (Wikileaks notwithstanding.)

[AngeHamm]

If people were buying terrorist materials online, we wouldn't say that.

People ARE buying terrorist materials online and have done so for years. Recipes and instructions for bomb-making abound online.

[drk]

So, what should we do? Allow it? Is the internet a sacred cow? If someone were plotting an assasination online, would we say, Oh well?

[WFruit]

So, what should we do? Allow it? Is the internet a sacred cow? If someone were plotting an assasination online, would we say, Oh well?

What I recommend is to educate every single person who comes in on why it's a BAD idea to purchase glasses online. I'm not sure what more you can do right now without fedral legislation. As long as there is no consensus in the industry on whether it should be allowed or not, it's going to be up to individuals whether or not they do it and think it's a good idea.

[Mizikal]

I would ask what type of warranty they offer. I had a lady come in with a broken pair of online glasses that were broken and she had them for less then a year. The warranty was only for 30 days. I think she got them for about $100.00.I bet you the warranty started from the day day they shipped them to you so subtract about 2-5 days for shipping. Then if you had problems you would have to ship them so that they would be received by them before the thirty days were up so another 2-5 days of shipping. The cost of shipping them back would be yours and you would be with out glasses for who knows how long.

If I am going to spend over $100.00 on something I would pay more just for the fact I know they are being backed up by the company I am buying them from. We have a one year warranty it covers defects and a one time breakage.

[Ladyoptician]

I tell them that the optician will do that when they place there order.

I like this reply, I will use this!!!

[ThatOneGuy]

So, what should we do? Allow it? Is the internet a sacred cow? If someone were plotting an assasination online, would we say, Oh well?

Yes, online is a sacred cow. Fraud and harrassment are still punishable offenses that are taken seriously, even with online vendors.

To answer your very misguided premise regarding assasinations, the local, federal, and international law enforcement agencies would certainly and do certainly have something to say about that. You are acting as if online retailers are committing crimes when they are really just providing a service.

Domestic online retailers are providing at home shopping convenience, while foreign retailers are offering low cost goods. Perhaps if B & M practices weren't buying "budget" product and marking it up 1600% (like a local OMD group does near me) and saying it is just as good as similarly priced product, then consumers wouldn't feel like they were being ripped off.

There are two sides to this online discussion, and to say that online retailers are to blame for some imaginary wrong just isn't legitimate. The problems that everyone is complaining about with online retailers affecting consumers are no different than the problems some B & M practices are causing.

Mercedes isn't going to blink twice when someone driving a Kia says their car doesn't hold up. At the same time, Mercedes could care less because Kia buyers aren't their buyers. If Mercedes wants Kia buyers, than they have to lower the quality of their product by reducing their costs and providing an inferior product which would tarnish the brand of Mercedes.

To somehow take a legitimate question regarding should we provide PDs and turn it in to some insane idea that the internet needs regulation is simply not connecting the dots in order.

[Judy Canty]

Ladies and Gentlemen, this conversation is becoming hysterically funny. You are decrying internet eyewear with the same intensity that you once reserved for Wal*Mart and other cost conscious brick & mortar retailers.

I'm enjoying the conversation for a number of reasons, primarily because it is so disingenuous. From my perspective, you are no different than your patients who desert your dispensarys in favor of the low cost options offered by online retailers.

You tout quality, warranty, knowledge and service at a fair price, yet when I call on your practice all you can say is "leave me a pricelist".

You see, regardless of which side of the dispensing table you're occupying, IT IS ALL ABOUT THE MONEY.

[ThatOneGuy]

You see, regardless of which side of the dispensing table you're occupying, IT IS ALL ABOUT THE MONEY.

Unfortunately, that has become the case in many instances. However, price lists are critical to making judgements as to what purchases can be made. I'm not going to go to the car dealer and say I need a 7 passenger vehicle and let them decide which is affordable for me. Maybe I want the $6,000 used mini van, not the the $60,000 brand new SUV because with other purchases I've made, I can't afford the SUV. Please, forgive us when you our rep is ill equiped to answer the questions we want answered regarding your product, and yet you want to spend an hour talking about it.

[DragonLensmanWV]

I use a Mercedes comparison when people tell me that because they paid a lot for their glasses they should be invulnerable, at least to be able to step on them or sit on them without breaking them.

"Ok take a Mercedes and a Chevy. The Mercedes is unquestionably a better car than a Chevy and it costs way more. Now run them both into a brick wall at 100 mph. You will barely be able to tell which one is which."

[Judy Canty]

You fail to understand my point. If price were the only deciding factor, we'd all be driving KIA's. Few reps have the time to spend an hour talking to you about anything unless you are asking the questions. "Just leave me a pricelist" is the equivalent of price shopping over the phone or searching the internet for the same thing.

[thep]

Maybe not a popular opinion, but I respectfully say...get over your collective selves. When is the last time an incorrect pd killed someone. Offer the service, the adjustment and offer a second pair before they leave. Cooperation builds more loyalty than dissent. I doubt you are going to spend hours on end measuring PD's...just sayin'

[uncut]

Maybe not a popular opinion, but I respectfully say...get over your collective selves. When is the last time an incorrect pd killed someone. Offer the service, the adjustment and offer a second pair before they leave. Cooperation builds more loyalty than dissent. I doubt you are going to spend hours on end measuring PD's...just sayin'

Nope.....but you are probably going to spend hours(subsidized by your real customers) fixing up the messes involved with self-measured, order mistaked, non-fitted, poorly crafted virtual dispensed crap. Don't we have enough issues with Curious Cat's "cost unconscious" sources?....time wasted fixing cheap frames, explaining the difference between cheap ARs and best quality ones?

Online purchasing, sanctioned, and enabled by us, of a medical device....... is not the same as buying a CD, a book, or even groceries.

[drk]

I would respectfully say that those who characterize this as "cheap competition" are not thinking things through. There's always a cheaper alternative, and what would be the big deal with that?

This is about deregulation. It's plain as day.

Anyone here for radical deregulation?

[Mizikal]

I would respectfully say that those who characterize this as "cheap competition" are not thinking things through. There's always a cheaper alternative, and what would be the big deal with that?

This is about deregulation. It's plain as day.
Anyone here for radical deregulation?

You cannot put the genie back in the bottle. Online glasses are here to stay. That does not mean I have to help them do business though. If someone came to my store and asked me to take a measurement for Dr Smiths office down the road I would tell them they need to talk to an optician in that office. If they came in and asked me for pd for an online order I would tell them that the optician would take that when they placed the order.

[varmint]

I once had a small claim judge rule against me making me responsible to pay for a broken lens someone else made after I sold them a replacement frame and they dropped them breaking the lens. The replacement frame was a duplicate style & size.
When it comes to responsibility it all comes down to the judges discretion.

[MikeAurelius]

Nope.....but you are probably going to spend hours(subsidized by your real customers) fixing up the messes involved with self-measured, order mistaked, non-fitted, poorly crafted virtual dispensed crap. Don't we have enough issues with Curious Cat's "cost unconscious" sources?....time wasted fixing cheap frames, explaining the difference between cheap ARs and best quality ones?

Online purchasing, sanctioned, and enabled by us, of a medical device....... is not the same as buying a CD, a book, or even groceries.

Who says it is subsidized by your "real" customers? Are you giving those adjustments and advice away for free? If so, then you are a fool. Charge for services rendered!!!!

[MikeAurelius]

I once had a small claim judge rule against me making me responsible to pay for a broken lens someone else made after I sold them a replacement frame and they dropped them breaking the lens. The replacement frame was a duplicate style & size.
When it comes to responsibility it all comes down to the judges discretion.

Just curious -- did you go to the small claims court hearing and argue your side of the transaction?

[varmint]

Just curious -- did you go to the small claims court hearing and argue your side of the transaction?

Yes I did and I provided documentation and all the notationas I had in the pts file recommeding new exams & lenses since her lenses were 7 years old. Judge didn't care, he said we as retailers take advantage & he awarded in her favor anyway.

I did vote against this judge on the next election.

[thep]

And yet, when fellow Optiboarders ask for advice on anything from frames to AR stock lenses, the words cheap or China show up. I'll leave you all alone now.

[MikeAurelius]

Yes I did and I provided documentation and all the notationas I had in the pts file recommeding new exams & lenses since her lenses were 7 years old. Judge didn't care, he said we as retailers take advantage & he awarded in her favor anyway.

I did vote against this judge on the next election.

Ok, then he did not hand down his ruling under the rule of law but his "opinion" of retailers...and you could have appealed that judgment, if you chose. Good for you for voting against him, judges like that do not deserve to be serving behind the bench, they need to go back to being bad lawyers.

[chip anderson]

Varmit: Should have contributed a few bucks to his opponent's campaign.

[Plausible]

Ladies and Gentlemen, this IS ALL ABOUT THE MONEY.

Truer words could not have been spoken sooner!!! Figure out how to capitalize on the internet within your business scope because your competitors certainly will and probably already are.

[Dlls218]

We aren't allowed to give out PD's because of liability issues also. But, I bet if the doctors got together and came up with a fee for it we would be allowed. I actually have patients ask often. They are ordering on-line. The on-line ordering is becoming big. I expect to see it more often.

[obxeyeguy]

We aren't allowed to give out PD's because of liability issues also.

But, I bet if the doctors got together and came up with a fee for it we would be allowed.

These two statements have to be the funiest in a long time.


PS: Please enlighten me as to what exactly you would be liable for when it's free, but not liable for when you charge.