This 2 word sentence is all over the internet and can likely turn the debate around if proven to be true or false.
Can anyone verify it? what is the truth?
This 2 word sentence is all over the internet and can likely turn the debate around if proven to be true or false.
Can anyone verify it? what is the truth?
I think on the surface it represents how out of control and irrational that a lot of Republicans have gotten since the election. I mean, if Obama drank Colombian coffee over Folgers, he'd be accused of being in league with illegal drug traders. No one is free from criticism, especially the President, but you don't have to be a jerk about it.
Just a couple of days ago, these same people were freaking out over the speech Obama gave to school kids, yammering about "brainwashing" and "Nazi Youth Party". When the WH released the text of the speech and mentioned that Obama changed ONE LINE to try to appease the haters, they jumped on his case with, "Oh, I wonder WHAT ELSE he changed?" Stupid. And now that a lot of kids have seen it and simply took home the message, "Stay in school, work hard," the parents who went apes**t are quiet as crickets.
It's stupid, and completely unproductive. We can't get anywhere unless cooler heads prevail.
BTW, I'm a Libertarian, and I wrote in my candidate.
The truth?Originally Posted by braheem24
You can't handle the truth!!!
.Claim: Page 50: All non-US citizens, illegal or not, will be provided with free healthcare services.False. That’s simply not what the bill says at all. This page includes "SEC. 152. PROHIBITING DISCRIMINATION IN HEALTH CARE," which says that "[e]xcept as otherwise explicitly permitted by this Act and by subsequent regulations consistent with this Act, all health care and related services (including insurance coverage and public health activities) covered by this Act shall be provided without regard to personal characteristics extraneous to the provision of high quality health care or related services." However, the bill does explicitly say that illegal immigrants can’t get any government money to pay for health care. Page 143 states: "Nothing in this subtitle shall allow Federal payments for affordability credits on behalf of individuals who are not lawfully present in the United States." And as we’ve said before, current law prohibits illegal immigrants from participating in government health care programs
From Factcheck.org
The Republicans' argument here, like many of their arguments in the health care debate, is based on a conjecture: while HR 3200 does expressly state that its provisions will not apply to persons who are in the U.S. illegally, it does not expressly state that a person seeking coverage under the law must furnish proof of citizenship; therefore, it is possible that an illegal alien could obtain some benefit afforded by the law (illegally, they do not add).
As though that would be end of the freakin' world.
Haven't you noticed that over the last few months most of the opposition to this plan has been lying to you guys?
I mean Death Panels?
HOLD YOUR POLITICIANS ACCOUNTABLE
No more lies!
Haven't you noticed that over the last few months most of the opposition to this plan has been lying to you guys?
I mean Death Panels?
HOLD YOUR POLITICIANS ACCOUNTABLE
No more lies!
You can say that again!
Oh wait..........................you already did!
;):cheers::cheers::cheers::D
That's great! They aren't allowed to receive government money for health care. So when an illegal alien goes to the ER, will they be made to pay up front before they are treated OR will they be seen, treated and released with absolutely no intention of paying the bill.
If they are treated and do not pay, then that is more money that is being lost by the doctors and hospitals on top of the $550 Billion that will be cut from payments over the next 10 years.
I haven't had the time to read the entire bill. How is this addressed in the proposed legislation?
A lack of planning on your part DOES NOT constitute an emergency on mine!
"It" is not addressed; presumably, illegal aliens will continue to show up at any such places as will treat them, including ER's (which have to screen them for emergency conditions).
That's not "more" money - it's happening today.
Of course, under a scheme under which all persons are required to have insurance, a person lacking insurance might raise suspicions when he shows up looking for care.
I think it's too bad that the politics are such that it's not possible to include all persons in the U.S. under some kind of care regime. But there are an awful lot of people - most of whom are the children or grandchildren of immigrants - who bear tremendous resentment towards illegal aliens. And I guess, after all, compassion has its place, but it's no competition for money insofar as our national priorities are concerned.
But, I'm curious; what do you think we should do with illegals who get sick in our country?
truth is....a river! so says G'Kar!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ylAsZQyOBMk
Bart Smith, continuing to be awesome since 1982 so that you don't have to.
Love is a duet, each voice complementing each other and making them sound better than they would alone, each voice at times stepping back and letting the other shine. We've got a pretty good duet going Tina.
On April 28th, I'll be marrying my best friend. I can't wait!
I apologize. It indeed is not "more money". It is money that is currently being lost that will now be in addition to the $550 Billion that will be cut from Medicare payments over the next 10 years.
Unfortunately, the first hospital that refuses treatment due to the patient not having insurance, whether legal or not, will be protested and boycotted out of business -- even if they are following the law.
My opinion concerning illegal aliens in this country is: if they chose to break the laws when coming here, why should they be entitled to anything? If they are sick and need medical care, they can go back to their home country for treatment. Or they can make a trip to the embassy for their country and seek treatment from the doctors on staff there.
This is along the same lines as a burglar breaking into someone's house and cutting their hand on the window they broke or being attacked by the dog, then suing the homeowner for the medical bills.
A lack of planning on your part DOES NOT constitute an emergency on mine!
WOW! Talk about the ultimate "Hijack This" thread! (Or is there more than one debate, and I'm missing something here?)
Ophthalmic Optician, Society to Advance Opticianry
I'm missing it too I don't know how this got onto healthcare.
The "You Lie" comment was made by a Rep. from South Carolina in response to President Obama's statement that illegal aliens would not receive government funded healthcare under his proposal.
Seems like logical thread drift to me.
A lack of planning on your part DOES NOT constitute an emergency on mine!
-
Thanks for S-P-E-L-L-I-N-G it out for me. I guess I'm really in the dark much more than I realize.
A politician called another politician a LIAR?Now that IS news!!;)
Ophthalmic Optician, Society to Advance Opticianry
As a S.C. rep I'm going to assume he professes to be Christian.
I wonder what word would Jesus use to respond to those who would deny care to the sick and indigent? Maybe -- "Hypocrite!"
With regard to the first point, are you now the defender of Medicare spending? The $550 billion to which you're referring is not a cut required by this proposal, but an objective (to be achieved in substantial part through the elimination of the corporate welfare program, Medicare Advantage). Are Republicans now opposed to setting cost-cutting objectives (perhaps because they're proposed by Democrats)? This is really just another point on which the Republicans figure they can evoke fear, which seems to be their only operational strategy at the moment, in this case by speculating on how we can save that much money (e.g., only by killing Grandma).
With regard to the second, recall what I said about "conjecture". In any case, many state laws go further than do federal law in requiring the provision of care. And rightly so, I think; it would be obscene to refuse it, although it could certainly be provided in a more organized (and more efficient, and less expensive) fashion than it is presently. That's why I think it's a mistake to leave illegals out of the scheme; it's really just ignoring that aspect of the overall problem.
I don't make any claim as to what they are "entitled". I think that as a matter of simple decency, we should take care of people in our country, whether they're here legally or not. Require them to pay what they can (which is what I think the basis of payment for care should be, generally, outside of the context of risk sharing). It is merely compassionate.
My opinion concerning illegal aliens in this country is: if they chose to break the laws when coming here, why should they be entitled to anything? If they are sick and need medical care, they can go back to their home country for treatment. Or they can make a trip to the embassy for their country and seek treatment from the doctors on staff there.
This is along the same lines as a burglar breaking into someone's house and cutting their hand on the window they broke or being attacked by the dog, then suing the homeowner for the medical bills.
Your suggestions as to what sick illegals can do strike me as absurdly impractical. Do you know what the closest embassy of any nation is to, say, Waco? What's a sick illegal to do, walk there? And how likely is he to get care where he came from (oh, sorry, that's not our problem...)?
Maybe we could have the Marines airlift sick aliens back home?
I find it remarkable that there appears to be an incredibly strong sense of community underlying your attitude towards illegals... that being an American makes one part of a group, membership in which is so important, that it forms the basis for something as important as deciding whether or not one gets medical care. You're one of "us", we take care of you; not one of us, go die, you're someone else's problem. Yet despite that strong sense of community in this context, when it comes to the essentially communitarian idea of government action, you're (I suspect) ardently opposed.
Were that not true, I suppose that by your burglar analogy, we shouldn't provide care to convicts in our prisons, either. They've broken laws, too (felonies, in most cases, unlike illegal entry). Too bad there are so many of them. What a relief that they get pretty poor care presently.
I'm probably looking for consistency where there is none... it's probably really just about the money.
It started with a question related to healthcare.
non political song lyrics
You lie you don't want to hurt me
So you lie, buy a little time, and I go along
What else can I do, maybe it's wrong
But you know how much I love you so you lie
'Til you can find a way to say goodbye
You lie
Reba McEntire
I wonder how an American Indian would feel about this attitude? I believe every treaty we made was broken.
Now back to healthcare or should we start another thread?
The government should pay the tuition for all healthcare providers and require a set period of mandatory public healthcare service in the area the graduate received their degree in. During the mandatory public healthcare service, the HCP should have housing, cafeteria, and other necessesities covered along with a small stipend. The return on the investment should more than cover tuition.
Built-in incentive programs for the HCP should be in place covering all areas of patient management and care which rewards effective care coupled with fiscal responsibility. The healthcare service would be available to insured and uninsured. The billable services should be based upon the cost to operate each specialty unit not based upon usual and customary fees. Payed managers of units would be rewarded for efficient operation, not denia of service. Penalties would be in place for inefficiency and/or denial of service as a means to keep costs down. Billable servies to insurance companies should be reduced thereby lowering the cost of insurance for this persons opting into this service. This would be a hybrid version of an HMO.
I need more coffee..apparently I am still half asleep. :hammer:
that is about as nonsensical as equating death by abortion and death during war which I've heard both from liberals.
And I also love it when people who don't believe in Christ use his name to promote their causes.
That's exactly what was intended by the comment which started this thread. The nincompoop who made the original statement knew exactly what he was doing when he did it. The talk is now all about his outburst rather than the subject at hand. I cannot believe these people get elected! My guess is, however, he put a nail into his political coffin.
PS I am referring to Rep Joe Wilson, NOT the originator of this thread!
Last edited by hcjilson; 09-10-2009 at 06:57 PM. Reason: typo
"Always laugh when you can. It is a cheap medicine"
Lord Byron
Take a photo tour of Cape Cod and the Islands!
www.capecodphotoalbum.com
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote
Bookmarks