That's a very good argument you made there, Dave. Not saying I necessarily agree with you, but very well put.If anything, it places the value of human life in a realm where the value is so great, the taking of it justifies an action of similar gravity.
Spexy, the context those scriptures are taken from is relevant- you can't just quote them in part to prove a point. And since none of us are without sin we all should take our stones and go home.Originally Posted by Spexvet
Let the refining and improving of your own life keep you so busy that you have little time to criticize others. -H. Jackson Brown Jr.
If the only tool you have is a hammer you will approach every problem as though it were a nail
Part of george washingtons second address to the first congresss, says,
MORE THEN 99 99/100 PERCENT BY THERE VERY SILENCE INDICATES THEY ARE IN SAFE AND SANE HANDS, true then and still true
how someone can use the term "Christian" right and ask why they are opposed to sin. How can you be Christian and not be opposed to open rebellion against the word of the very one who said it.
How often people try to use the words of Jesus totally out of context to prove a point. Ignorance is bliss.
God's word give rulers, goverments and kings the authority to decide the proper punishment for criminals TO PROTECT THE COMMON FOLK. If you don't know or understand this try doing as the Word says.
STUDY TO SHOW THYSELF APPROVED UNTO GOD, A WORKMAN THAT NEEDTH NOT BE ASHAMED, RIGHTLY DIVIDING THE WORD OF TRUTH.
As for gun control, that would be me not using mine to kill someone unless absolutley in self defense.
And this is why the general rule is to not talk about religion in public. It get you nowhere except frustrated.
It also helps to not believe in God at all. Makes things a lot simpler and takes unwarranted guilt and worry off of your shoulders. If humanity hadn't evolved to believe that it was better than its animal brethren, we wouldn't be having the troubles we're having now. You don't kill another person, unless threatened like any species would, because it makes no sense to do so. No one really benefits from the act. It works against our common good as a race.
Captial punishment is a human invention, and the need for it has been caused in part by religion and society in general. Elephants don't have executions, but then they don't have the mental issues we do.
Possessing a tool to guard against attack is primal and should not be forbidden, just regulated and moderated as best as we can. Cats have claws, dogs have teeth, bears have size, teeth and claws. Do we disarm them to make them "nicer" and to get along better with the other lions and wolves?
Women have more miscarriages than abortions each year, which is just nature's way of trying to keep things in check. So is Nature against the Christian God's will as well? It's when women have multiple abortions that they're abusing it, and should have hysterectomies to save themselves (and us) the trouble. This kind of thinking, that people need to be fruitful and multiply was fine back in the Bronze Age, when our populations were low and resources were in no danger of depletion. But now? When our numbers are close to 7 Billion and the planet that birthed and gave us life is in danger of becoming an unhabitable dust ball? Sure, just keep popping out those kids, because destroying our planet must also be God's will. And don't bother quoting Scripture, because I can pull stuff out of a book and use it as a basis for my arguments too.
I'm sure I ticked a lot of people off with this post, which was not my intent. I just had to state my opinion on this, which so far I've kept holstered.
ANOTHER UNTRUE STATEMENT. WE SHOULD ALWAYS SEEK THE TRUTH BEFORE WE SPREAD LIES.:finger:
How is that untrue? Is that all you've got to say? Speak for yourself before waving your sanctimonious finger at me.
By the way, typing in all caps is equivalent to shouting on the internet and is considered extremely rude.
That's done all the time ("I knew you before you were born"), but how are my points out of context?
My point exactly. No one should impose his/her "morals" on anyone else.
In this world, for sure...
but I wouldn't bet eternity on it.
Ophthalmic Optician, Society to Advance Opticianry
Ahh yes, but one would have to believe in eternity to be concerned about it ;)
C'mon! If you've ever been to an emergency room, you believe in eternity!:D
Ophthalmic Optician, Society to Advance Opticianry
Hmm. Why am I reminded of Dave Cook's Vicious Circle and his conversation with the atheist?
"Some believe in destiny, and some believe in fate. But I believe that happiness is something we create."-Something More by Sugarland
I would like to see you or anyone else prove that statement that I highlighted in your remarks. Saying it does not make it so.
PROVE IT.:finger:
Bill, what other creatures on this earth practice capital punishment? Do whales or monkeys or birds have Supreme Courts that sign death warrants for offenders? Or do you just have the comprehension of a 5 year old?
"Capital punishment, the death penalty or execution, is the killing of a person by judicial process as punishment."
"Common in virtually every society....The Roman Catholic Church traditionally accepted capital punishment as per the theology of Thomas Aquinas (who accepted the death penalty as a necessary deterrent and prevention method, but not as a means of vengeance; see also Aquinas on the death penalty)."
"Historically, the execution of criminals and political opponents was used by nearly all societies—both to punish crime and to suppress political dissent. In most places that practice capital punishment today, the death penalty is reserved as punishment for murder, espionage, treason, or as part of military justice. In some countries sexual crimes, such as rape, adultery, incest and sodomy, carry the death penalty, as do religious crimes such as apostasy (the formal renunciation of the State religion). In many retentionist countries (countries that use the death penalty), drug trafficking is also a capital offense. In China, human trafficking and serious cases of corruption are also punished by the death penalty. In militaries around the world courts-martial have imposed death sentences for offenses such as cowardice, desertion, insubordination, and mutiny."
If you can't come to grips with the fact that execution as a means of justice is a purely human contrivance, I'll not be the one to hold your hand and convince you otherwise. Stupid can't be fixed.
There's also probably a pretty good reason why you don't have any friends on your profile. I also find it both sad and amusing that the only times I ever see you make posts, is when I or someone else makes an uncomplimentary statement regarding Christianity, or in this case, whether or not executions are solely practiced by human beings. You get all in a huff, demanding "facts" and "evidence", when it's right in front of your face. Quite honestly, you're not worth responding to, so this will be the only time I will ever reply to one of your posts, even if you try and "call me out" for not presenting the facts as YOU see them, being too lazy to look them up on your own.
Last edited by LilKim; 11-04-2008 at 08:28 PM.
Yes I have, several times, although I'd liken that to purgatory (which is eternal also, but totally sucks), one which also costs me money, lol. :bbg:
You compare me to a five year old, call me lazy and stupid. If I had done that to you this board would shut me down. Funny how one sided this board is, eh, Harry?
You still haven't gone to the proper source of reading material for the facts and ranting and raving DOES NOT PROVE A THING.
Cheers :finger:
The first statement was, "capital punishment is a human invention", the second, " capital punishment is practiced only by humans".
Slight difference here, I responded to the first one. I still say you cannot prove that statement and neither can anyone else.:finger:
Maybe with all your wisdom you can point out to us who exactly invented capital punishment.
DragonlensmanWV N.A.O.L.
"There is nothing patriotic about hating your government or pretending you can hate your government but love your country."
This question is about duplicity. Unfortunatally history tells us that that virtually all religious people are duplicitious, and almost all societies have used religion to validate unpaletable policy
On the same note, once the religious sorts start gettin organised, tey seem to twist and pevert the original message - and all of a sudden tradition and politics replace the original values. This usually stems from a sense of self preservation, and basically if religions had anything at all going for them, then they would nt need a sense of self preservation
I'm glad to see that you don't support abortion. I've always felt that it isn't a religious issue. It's a moral issue that even atheists feel strongly about. (at least one athesist anyway)
I have never understood why in general, one party supports the right to have an abortion, but is completely against capital punishment. While the other party wants to stop abortion completely but to execute our criminals.
What happens when a child is born to a mother that was refused an abortion and that child grows up to become a murderer?
Which side is to blame? Had he been aborted before birth, he never would have grown up to kill another. Had there been capital punishment, he may have been deterred from the killing.
These are the type of thoughts I have when I can't sleep.
A lack of planning on your part DOES NOT constitute an emergency on mine!
I am pro-life.
I am against abortion.
I am against capital punishment.
Is there a party for that?
Ophthalmic Optician, Society to Advance Opticianry
Catholic
Actually Marc, I do support it, but only in the first trimester, and not when used as a mere method of contraception by women who can't be bothered to take the pill or use a condom. Unjustifiable murder, I do not support, but if someone is bent on killing me or my family? They're getting one between the eyes, and one in the heart for good measure.
I understand many people feel strongly about abortion, but I feel very strongly that it is up to the woman carrying the fetus to decide that, not her neighbor or cousin or father or county sheriff, or people who have never met her, to decide what she's allowed to do with the life she and another person created.
Practices much crueler than abortion are still going on around the world--young babies born full term and left to die in the wild because they are not a desirable sex, have a deformity, or there are just too many mouths to feed. Or female babies taken from their mothers at birth and given to slavers so they can raise the girl up as a sex slave. Which is worse? Aborting a fetus smaller than a seahorse, or birthing it and selling it off to later be raped, abused, and most likely given multiple diseases, birthing the numerous children sired by her "customers", to know nothing but misery and pain? The likelihood of the child escaping that life are slim to none.
One has to weigh the odds in every circumstance, and not just act on a generalized principle that may not fit the current situation. But that's just me, and I certainly don't expect everyone to share my views ;)
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