Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 30

Thread: Mandatory Seg Heights

  1. #1
    Master OptiBoarder
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Michigan
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    2,827

    Mandatory Seg Heights

    Our co-owner has decided to use a mandatory progressive seg ht measuring system. In other words, no matter what we experienced opticians measure on the patient it is to be voided if it is not 4mm above center. If a patient chooses a frame and is not the mandatory seg ht we are to tell the patient the frame is not recommended or note on the patient's record that we are not responsible. Many of our seg hts are changed in the lab. If the tracer shows the ht "should be" something else it is changed and not always noted on the record. Is everyone's nose shaped like that generic "bridge"? Frames sit differently on people we all know this. He wants to give a a course on seg ht measuring. Are you kidding? I have been measuring segs for 30 years. Has anyone else ever heard of such a thing or is it a control issue here?

  2. #2
    Underemployed Genius Jacqui's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Frostbite Falls, Mn.
    Occupation
    Optical Wholesale Lab (other positions)
    Posts
    7,417
    Quote Originally Posted by cocoisland58 View Post
    is it a control issue here?
    Either that or stupidity.

  3. #3
    Master OptiBoarder
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    NA
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    1,255
    I had a similar issue come up when the boss wanted to send us all to a training on measuring segs. I pulled up the handy remake reasons report and discovered that out of 63 remakes in the previous 10 months, 3 were bad measurements, 60 were Rx errors (OD=boss). Oddly enough, we never made it to that training...

  4. #4
    Master OptiBoarder
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Down in a hole!
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    13,078
    Has there been a wave of redo issues concerning heights? Has the "manager" recently gone to a CE class about progressives, or troubleshooting? New manager? NitWit?

  5. #5
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Gold Supporter Judy Canty's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Virginia Beach, VA
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    7,482
    Sometimes you just have to shake your head in wonder. Do what the boss says, but document the number of remakes this causes and the number of jobs that were lost when they couldn't use the frame they wanted (if it would have worked in the real world). The key to combating questionable practices like this is documentation.

  6. #6
    Ophthalmic Optician
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    USSA
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    12,591
    Quote Originally Posted by cocoisland58 View Post
    ... note on the patient's record that we are not responsible.

    You're not kidding "not responsible"!

    That's the most irresponsible thing I've ever heard!:hammer: (Not that I haven't heard it before, but you're an independent, right?)
    Ophthalmic Optician, Society to Advance Opticianry

  7. #7
    Compulsive Truthteller OptiBoard Gold Supporter Uncle Fester's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    At a position without dimension...
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    5,302

    Priceless...

    Quote Originally Posted by cocoisland58 View Post
    Our co-owner has decided to use a mandatory progressive seg ht measuring system. In other words, no matter what we experienced opticians measure on the patient it is to be voided if it is not 4mm above center. If a patient chooses a frame and is not the mandatory seg ht we are to tell the patient the frame is not recommended or note on the patient's record that we are not responsible. Many of our seg hts are changed in the lab. If the tracer shows the ht "should be" something else it is changed and not always noted on the record. Is everyone's nose shaped like that generic "bridge"? Frames sit differently on people we all know this. He wants to give a a course on seg ht measuring. Are you kidding? I have been measuring segs for 30 years. Has anyone else ever heard of such a thing or is it a control issue here?
    ROFLMAO:p:p:p:p:p:p:p:p

    Thanks for sending me home with a belly laugh!

  8. #8
    Master OptiBoarder
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    NC
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    3,951
    Better start stocking deeda's and carlos. No more trendy little frames for you.:hammer:

  9. #9
    Rising Star
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Opti-World Wide Web
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    78
    Better yet.... just stop with bifocals and progressives! If it's not single vision, don't mess with it! And give everyone a PD of 60.5! (You DO want to be precise, ya know! :bbg:)

  10. #10
    Ophthalmic Optician
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    USSA
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    12,591
    Quote Originally Posted by specti-wolf View Post
    Better yet.... just stop with bifocals and progressives! If it's not single vision, don't mess with it! And give everyone a PD of 60.5! (You DO want to be precise, ya know! :bbg:)

    I'm smelling a multiple pair sale!:cheers:

    You're a genius! I know there was something about bifocals I didin't like!
    Ophthalmic Optician, Society to Advance Opticianry

  11. #11
    Master OptiBoarder
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    NC
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    3,951
    Is this person an optician??

  12. #12
    Master OptiBoarder
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Michigan
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    2,827
    Quote Originally Posted by Fezz View Post
    Has there been a wave of redo issues concerning heights? Has the "manager" recently gone to a CE class about progressives, or troubleshooting? New manager? NitWit?
    I'm the manager and the person in question is not new. Hasn't been to any class recently and our remakes are low. Not a nitwit either, has been in the business since childhood. We don't get it.

  13. #13
    Master OptiBoarder
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Michigan
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    2,827
    Quote Originally Posted by Johns View Post
    You're not kidding "not responsible"!

    That's the most irresponsible thing I've ever heard!:hammer: (Not that I haven't heard it before, but you're an independent, right?)
    Yes, independent.

  14. #14
    Ophthalmic Optician
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    USSA
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    12,591
    Quote Originally Posted by cocoisland58 View Post
    Not a nitwit either, has been in the business since childhood. .
    In what capacity?
    Ophthalmic Optician, Society to Advance Opticianry

  15. #15
    Master OptiBoarder
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Michigan
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    2,827
    Quote Originally Posted by obxeyeguy View Post
    Is this person an optician??

    Yes, for many years. I swear I'm ready to jump ship over this one.

  16. #16
    Master OptiBoarder
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Michigan
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    2,827
    Quote Originally Posted by Johns View Post
    In what capacity?

    Lab Rat.

  17. #17
    Optician Extraordinaire
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Somewhere warm
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    3,130
    Quote Originally Posted by cocoisland58 View Post
    Our co-owner has decided to use a mandatory progressive seg ht measuring system. In other words, no matter what we experienced opticians measure on the patient it is to be voided if it is not 4mm above center. Many of our seg hts are changed in the lab. If the tracer shows the ht "should be" something else it is changed and not always noted on the record.
    This is the stupidest thing I have read in a long time. Why is he doing this? Has there been problems with seg heights?

    If there weren't problems before I am going to guess there will be problems now! Just unbelievable!

  18. #18
    Master OptiBoarder
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Ontario, Canada
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    982
    If you're the manager and he's not a nitwit, ASK him. Find out what the reasoning behind it is. Explain exactly the same reasons you told us why it's a BAD idea. If you don't get anywhere with that, either deal with it, or start looking.

  19. #19
    Master OptiBoarder
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Down in a hole!
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    13,078
    Quote Originally Posted by cocoisland58 View Post
    I'm the manager and the person in question is not new. Hasn't been to any class recently and our remakes are low. Not a nitwit either, has been in the business since childhood. We don't get it.

    Irrational thoughts, delusions, nonsense demands....

    Maybe drug or alcohol abuse? Meth and Bolivian Marching Powder makes the user delusional.

    You are right...doesn't make sense.

    Is this person *approachable*, can you have a safe and candid conversation about the issue?

    Good luck!!!

    :cheers::cheers::cheers::cheers:

  20. #20
    Master OptiBoarder
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Michigan
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    2,827
    Quote Originally Posted by Fezz View Post
    Is this person *approachable*, can you have a safe and candid conversation about the issue?
    I can try. Canidid maybe. Safe, well he's not going to tell me to hit the door. This person does not like(no refuses to)be wrong. I wanted to ask everyone here because I somehow thought I may be missing something. As in : maybe there IS some rule of seg hts I don't know about. The thing is it's not the first time there have been odd requests like this and to be honest I may just ignore it. But I wanted to be sure before I asked him the reasoning behind this one.

  21. #21
    Master OptiBoarder
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Ontario, Canada
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    982
    There's only one rule when it comes to fitting bifocals. Everyone is fit different. There's absolutely no single method that will work 100% of the time. You have to take so many things into account that you literally can't accurately measure by following some sort of formula. Fit of the frame, where the old lenses were fit, how the patient WANTS to wear them, so many different variables. You're not the one who's lacking knowledge here.

  22. #22
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Gold Supporter Judy Canty's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Virginia Beach, VA
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    7,482
    Quote Originally Posted by AdmiralKnight View Post
    There's only one rule when it comes to fitting bifocals. Everyone is fit different. There's absolutely no single method that will work 100% of the time. You have to take so many things into account that you literally can't accurately measure by following some sort of formula. Fit of the frame, where the old lenses were fit, how the patient WANTS to wear them, so many different variables.
    ...no matter WHAT those online guys say!;)

  23. #23
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter Barry Santini's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Seaford, NY USA
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    6,008
    Actually, my experience is that an individuals' preference for frame fit (up higher or down lower), and head and neck posture/habits will influence seg height more that if you would take most frames and infer a default height for a particular frame style.

    FWIW

    Barry

  24. #24
    Master OptiBoarder
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Kansas
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    2,203
    You know I will admit there are reasons to change the FH for a progressive. Sometimes I see pupil dots that show a FH of 18 w/ a B of 27. Only leaving 9mm above the fitting cross is not the best, even though that is how the frame fits. So I will shorten the FH to 16 mm and fit a short corridor.

    Sounds like the guy is just coming off as a jerk and is causing some resentment. Refresher training is always a good idea. We have refresher training on the how the answer the phone, dress code, collecting co-pays. . . It never ends. We have even had refresher training on taking PDs and measuring SHs. We didn't have anyone that felt their abilities were being questioned.

    Approach it positively and see if you can learn something and see if the "trainer" can be taught something.

    EyeFitWell had a good idea about pulling remake stats. Maybe an introduction to the training that goes something like this: "I'm glad we are having this training because OUR stats indicate that just over 2% of our remakes are due to seg heights changes, I'm sure we will see them go down after this refresher" And be sure and pull them again in 6 months.

    Or maybe the lab guys are just specifying the wrong lenses. I have found that you really can fit those short corridors as low as 14mm like the mfg says and have a decently happy client.

    Let's see. B=26mm. Datum + 4mm = 17. That leaves 9.0mm for distance viewing = unhappy patient. Not because the frame was too small, but because the lens was fit too high.

  25. #25
    One of the worst people here
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Canada
    Occupation
    Other Eyecare-Related Field
    Posts
    8,331
    Quote Originally Posted by cocoisland58 View Post
    Our co-owner has decided to use a mandatory progressive seg ht measuring system. In other words, no matter what we experienced opticians measure on the patient it is to be voided if it is not 4mm above center. If a patient chooses a frame and is not the mandatory seg ht we are to tell the patient the frame is not recommended or note on the patient's record that we are not responsible. Many of our seg hts are changed in the lab. If the tracer shows the ht "should be" something else it is changed and not always noted on the record. Is everyone's nose shaped like that generic "bridge"? Frames sit differently on people we all know this. He wants to give a a course on seg ht measuring. Are you kidding? I have been measuring segs for 30 years. Has anyone else ever heard of such a thing or is it a control issue here?
    I do not mind the concept. Not exactly his way of doing it, but the idea of creating a standard. I can see that he is trying to create uniformity among the organization. For instance, several years back I worked for a lady who did not fit below 19mm. While I disagreed with her, I followed her lead. There is nothing worse for a customer than having one Optician say one thing and another say something else.

    As for changes in the lab, I have no idea why that is happening.


    Edit - Now I may be confused here. Is he saying that it must be at least 4mm above the centre, or does the seg height have to = 4mm above the centre. If it is the other then it is a horrible idea.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Mandatory Name Tags?
    By HarryChiling in forum General Optics and Eyecare Discussion Forum
    Replies: 31
    Last Post: 06-15-2008, 06:41 PM
  2. Mandatory Health Insurance
    By rbaker in forum Just Conversation
    Replies: 30
    Last Post: 12-28-2007, 11:31 PM
  3. Mandatory eye exam before entering 1st grade?
    By fjpod in forum General Optics and Eyecare Discussion Forum
    Replies: 22
    Last Post: 10-27-2005, 10:11 PM
  4. Mandatory CL Release Law
    By Foveator in forum General Optics and Eyecare Discussion Forum
    Replies: 24
    Last Post: 12-05-2003, 02:50 PM
  5. Mandatory eye exams?
    By PAkev in forum General Optics and Eyecare Discussion Forum
    Replies: 22
    Last Post: 12-23-2001, 10:51 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •