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Thread: The crashing of the US.......most interesting

  1. #151
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    Redhot Jumper Why would .....................

    Quote Originally Posted by tonyl View Post
    Why would the optical industry be badly affected by recession? People will still need glasses, they will just buy cheaper ones.
    You are totally right, they will buy cheaper. However if you have gone through the threads on Optiboard everybody or many of them members are telling the highly priced upscale sale they are making.

    Many of them will not admit that people without job, having lost their homes and cars , will not have the cash for upscale glasses with all the bells and whistles.

    Furthermore when all this is over the population will revert to the old system of saving money, instead of spending before they even earned it,

    So the optical retailer has to prepare himself for such times. When times get tougher and you sell for less also the markup spread becomes smaller.
    That is were you got prepare to face the music. Instead of giving all to the lab many simple operations can be done in an office environment that does not even have edging facilities, You can do small repair, you can do lens surface treatment and all those simple jobs that you can do for the cost of a few cents instead of paying the lab big dollars and then end up still making a decent profit on sales at lower cost.

  2. #152
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    Redhot Jumper U.S. recession fears pin down stocks, dollar

    U.S. recession fears pin down stocks, dollar
    Fri Feb 22, 2008 4:30am EST


    By Ian Chua

    LONDON (Reuters) - Worries that the world's biggest economy may be deteriorating more rapidly than expected sent stocks from Sydney to London lower on Friday, and kept the dollar pinned at two-week lows versus a basket of currencies.

    U.S. data on Thursday showed U.S. mid-Atlantic factory production slumped to its lowest level since the 2001 recession, and an index of future U.S. economic activity pointed to even tougher times ahead. ID:nN21572086

    But safe-haven European government bonds, which rose earlier on those U.S. worries, suffered a setback after a report showed euro zone services growth unexpectedly bounced back in Feburary from a 4-1/2 year low. ID:nL20480445

    Still, investors were increasingly wary of taking risk with European credit spreads widening. The iTraxx Crossover index <ITCRS5EA=GFI>, made up of 50 mostly "junk"-rated credits, was 12 basis points wider at 589 points.
    "This is going to be a Darwin market, survival of the fittest and strongest," said Justin Urquhart, strategist at 7 Investment Management.

    "The market is looking ............................

    whole story: http://www.reuters.com/article/hotSt...22857320080222

  3. #153
    Just An Optician jediron1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gemstone View Post
    Yes, I does everyone good to hear , every day how poor the econimy is doing. :hammer: Personally I prefer to be an optomist. . Why the US ecominy. Look around the globe and you will see this is wide spread. I just get a bit offended by a forigner that make's a profit off the US is getting so much delight kicking it in the face. I hope I never need any of his products. And NO, I am not going to read any of it.

    That's the reason you don't get it. You feel by reading a few lines here and there you can up with a solution for the problem, like "It kind of pissis me off to see this every day floating to the top like a turd in the toilet" Turd in a toilet now that is original! :hammer:

  4. #154
    Just An Optician jediron1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tonyl View Post
    Why would the optical industry be badly affected by recession? People will still need glasses, they will just buy cheaper ones.

    Because they would all start going to all those low enders instead of us high enders. 2 cents ;)

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    Some high enders may need to look at stocking lower end. It doesn't mean they will be lesser opticians. Low end sellers can often make more money if they have volume.

    On one hand: in any recession only about one third of the population is worse off. There will always be people with money.

    On the other hand: Even people who aren't badly affected by the recession may stop spending on luxury items such as high end glasses.

  6. #156
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    Quote Originally Posted by tonyl View Post
    Some high enders may need to look at stocking lower end. It doesn't mean they will be lesser opticians. Low end sellers can often make more money if they have volume.

    On one hand: in any recession only about one third of the population is worse off. There will always be people with money.

    On the other hand: Even people who aren't badly affected by the recession may stop spending on luxury items such as high end glasses.
    Actually! In US, during hard times, the low end is the first to suffer. High end stores will most likley feel the pinch last. It takes high volume to make it in low end. High end adds up much faster!

  7. #157
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    Redhot Jumper Uspelling versus downselling................

    Quote Originally Posted by optirep View Post
    Actually! In US, during hard times, the low end is the first to suffer. High end stores will most likley feel the pinch last. It takes high volume to make it in low end. High end adds up much faster!
    Optirep................you are right and wrong at the same time.

    During a recession there is always people that have plenty of money and there is some that are making it too. Therefore high end will make it if they have enough customers, if the don't they wont.

    By being in the middle to low end you can and are used to sell and advertise inexpensive good quality glasses.

    You can start at a basic price that is on the budget of the buyer. The properly feeling out the customer, you can put your feeler out if he or she is ready to spend a little more for an upgrade or addition to the lenses. Many of such additions can be done in house, even without lab.

    Therefore you have the possibility to fully adapt to customers budget and possible addition.

    The high ender on the other side will have to sell a pair for five hundred dollars and the work his way down if there is no positive reaction by the prospective buyer. This attitude cheapens the process. "If you can;t afford gold we can always give you aluminum".

    I prefer a customer saying .........."have you not anything nicer or better ?"

    Up selling is always better than down selling.

  8. #158
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    I work at a chain that relies heavily on upselling. First, they draw the customer in with a great value. The sales people/opticians follow a corporate selling model and just like magic, you've sold 2 or more pairs with all the bells and whistles. That's how it's suppose to work at least. Recently, things have been rough and folks are just more interested in their pocketbooks than their eyes.

    Corporate, with no lost interest in the customers pocket book, is suddenly more interested in volume. We don't even refer to glasses as glasses any longer. Now they are "units". I mean, come on, if I wanted to sell used cars I would. But hey, thats a retail chain, right?

    My real point is that as a "not high end" chain; I can definitely say that we are feeling it across the board. Sounds like a lot of you "high ender's" aren't doing so bad.

    Are retail chains feeling the slow down a little more?

  9. #159
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    Quote Originally Posted by jediron1 View Post
    That's the reason you don't get it. You feel by reading a few lines here and there you can up with a solution for the problem, like "It kind of pissis me off to see this every day floating to the top like a turd in the toilet" Turd in a toilet now that is original! :hammer:
    What is your grand solution? And thanks for the complement.:hammer:Give me a break!:hammer:Take your negative cry baby attitude back to canada or where ever you are from.:hammer::hammer:I will just keep on busting ***, working and do what I can. :hammer::hammer:Are you offering advice?:hammer::hammer:I see none.:hammer:
    Last edited by gemstone; 02-25-2008 at 09:32 PM.

  10. #160
    Just An Optician jediron1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gemstone View Post
    What is your grand solution? And thanks for the complement.:hammer:Give me a break!:hammer:Take your negative cry baby attitude back to canada or where ever you are from.:hammer::hammer:I will just keep on busting ***, working and do what I can. :hammer::hammer:Are you offering advice?:hammer::hammer:I see none.:hammer:
    No advice you seem to know it all! One more turd in the toilet. :hammer:

  11. #161
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    Redhot Jumper Feb consumer confidence slumps to 5-year low

    Feb consumer confidence slumps to 5-year low

    Tue Feb 26, 2008 10:33am EST

    NEW YORK (Reuters) - Consumer confidence fell to a five-year low in February and expectations slumped to a 17-year trough in a tightening jobs market, a new survey showed, fueling fears the economy was already in recession.

    The Conference Board said on Tuesday its index of consumer sentiment fell to 75.0 in February from a downwardly revised 87.3 in January, originally reported as 87.9.

    The median forecast of 67 economists polled by Reuters was for a reading of 82.0.

    The present situation index fell to 100.6 from a downwardly revised 114.3 in January, while the expectations index fell to 57.9 -- its lowest in 17 years -- from a downwardly revised 69.3.

    The deterioration in sentiment was pronounced.

    It was the biggest monthly drop in the consumer confidence and expectations indexes since September 2005, following Hurricane Katrina. The present situation index saw its biggest tumble since October 2001, the last time the United States was in recession.

    Sentiment was hurt ........................................

    see whole artticle at: http://www.reuters.com/article/ousiv...24349720080226

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Ryser View Post
    You can start at a basic price that is on the budget of the buyer. The [sic] properly feeling out the customer, you can put your feeler out if he or she is ready to spend a little more for an upgrade or addition to the lenses.
    That theory has failed in car sales, jewelry sales, and optical sales. What you're recommending is the exact opposite of what years of research and real-world application has taught us.
    You can run a successful business without knowing anything about business--location, customer service, contacts, ability at your craft--all of those things can contribute to making that possible. In your case, some or all of these had to have played a part since you obviously have little understanding of economics and even less understanding of how to sell.
    I won't ask you to stop posting your dire predictions. Every man is entitled to a hobby. I will, however, continue pointing it out when you're wrong.
    Our sales are up this month versus this month last year, and the year before, and the year before...ad infinitum. Lux is doing well, too, and expanding. Perhaps they and we should hire you as a consultant to guide us through the "end times" to come.

  13. #163
    Master OptiBoarder rbaker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul E. Carbonate View Post
    That theory has failed in car sales, jewelry sales, and optical sales. What you're recommending is the exact opposite of what years of research and real-world application has taught us.
    You can run a successful business without knowing anything about business--location, customer service, contacts, ability at your craft--all of those things can contribute to making that possible. In your case, some or all of these had to have played a part since you obviously have little understanding of economics and even less understanding of how to sell.
    I won't ask you to stop posting your dire predictions. Every man is entitled to a hobby. I will, however, continue pointing it out when you're wrong.
    Our sales are up this month versus this month last year, and the year before, and the year before...ad infinitum. Lux is doing well, too, and expanding. Perhaps they and we should hire you as a consultant to guide us through the "end times" to come.
    We have also enjoyed a very good year. In fact the last three months have seen record dividend checks, in particular the energy sector of our holdings. Now, admittedly, the net value of some of our stocks are nothing to write home about but the market goes up and the market goes down. Over the long haul it goes up, way up. The first dollar that I invested is worth over twenty dollars today.

    Cripes, remembering the Carter years we all thought that we would be living under bridges eating squirrels on a stick. If you think the housing market is the pits now back then you could not give a house away. Just relax, don't worry, be happy.

    There are no limits to what you can achieve here in America despite what the losers say.

  14. #164
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    Redhot Jumper Don't need to know anything..................

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul E. Carbonate View Post
    You can run a successful business without knowing anything about business--location, customer service, contacts, ability at your craft--all of those things can contribute to making that possible.

    So.....................now we learned that you need to know nothing to be a successful man and can run such a business without knowing anything about it.

    Why then are you poking your nose into the Optiboard, maybe you are going against your own principles and want to pick up a good point here and there?

    Why are you going on this thread that right now shows right know 4657 views ? This is a direct proof that there is interest in what is happening with the economy in general because it will affect us, our businerss, our neighbors, friends and families in one way or another.

    It will not affect rbaker who is retired has his investments who go up and down but when everything is over he will still make money with it,

    If you don't like this thread don't go on it. but go and look at the ones that are looking for a green frame or the ones that are asking how to measure a PD............they seem to be more in your line of thinking and principle of running a successful business without knowing anything. :hammer:
    Last edited by Chris Ryser; 02-27-2008 at 06:46 AM.

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    Redhot Jumper U.S. growth worries hammer dollar to record lows

    U.S. growth worries hammer dollar to record lows
    Fri Feb 29, 2008 7:20am EST

    By Veronica Brown

    LONDON (Reuters) - The dollar hit record lows against the euro, Swiss franc and a basket of major currencies on Friday, pressured by concerns about the U.S. economy and expectations of further aggressive interest rate cuts.

    A surprisingly large rise in weekly U.S. jobless claims on Thursday and confirmation that the world's biggest economy barely grew in the final quarter of 2007 fuelled recession worries.

    That contrasted with upbeat releases from other countries.
    Economic woes, coupled with Fed chairman Ben Bernanke's warning on the health of small U.S. banks on Thursday, also weighed on stock markets and risk appetite, to the benefit of low-yielding currencies like the yen and Swiss franc.

    Bernanke told the U.S. Congress he expected "some failures" among small U.S. banks due to the financial stress of housing .....................

    whole article: http://www.reuters.com/article/hotSt...12408420080229

  16. #166
    Just An Optician jediron1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul E. Carbonate View Post
    I won't ask you to stop posting your dire predictions. Every man is entitled to a hobby. I will, however, continue pointing it out when you're wrong.
    Our sales are up this month versus this month last year, and the year before, and the year before...ad infinitum. Lux is doing well, too, and expanding. Perhaps they and we should hire you as a consultant to guide us through the "end times" to come.

    While I believe Chris is right it usually takes a number of months for the optical field to feel the pinch. Like in the 70's the optical community did not start to feel that pinch until we were in the middle of a recession. As far as Lux from what I'm hearing they are shedding BJ's and have already shed Things Remembered so maybe they are feeling a pinch. just a thought ;)

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    Blue Jumper Now the car industry................................

    February auto sales tumble, Detroit hit hardest

    Mon Mar 3, 2008 6:41pm EST

    By Ben Klayman and Kevin Krolicki

    DETROIT (Reuters) - U.S. auto sales tumbled in February in the face of a slumping economy and high gas prices with double-digit declines by all three struggling Detroit-based automakers.

    Sales at General Motors Corp(GM.N: Quote, Profile, Research), Ford Motor Co (F.N: Quote, Profile, Research) and Chrysler LLC CBS.UL fell 16 percent, 10 percent and 17 percent, respectively. GM and Ford responded with cuts to second-quarter production plans, while Chrysler rolled out a new program of sales incentives.

    "February was a very disappointing month for industry sales," GM Vice Chairman Bob Lutz told Reuters at the Geneva auto show. "We still expect the economy to recover in the second half. Our crystal ball is not that much better than anybody else's."

    Japan's Honda Motor Co Ltd (7267.T: Quote, Profile, Research) was the only major automaker to buck the downturn with an increase of nearly 1 percent. Toyota Motor Corp (7203.T: Quote, Profile, Research) and Nissan Motor Co Ltd (7201.T: Quote, Profile, Research) reported declines of 6.6 percent and 3 percent, respectively.

    Auto sales represent one of the first snapshots of overall U.S. consumer demand, and the weakness in February results could provide more evidence for those who believe the U.S. economy has already slipped into recession.

    GM's results were at the bearish end of analysts' expectations due to weaker demand for.........................

    whole article: http://www.reuters.com/article/ousiv...11475720080303

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    Redhot Jumper Economy, credit fears hit stocks as dollar sinks................

    Economy, credit fears hit stocks as dollar sinks

    Fri Mar 7, 2008 4:26am EST

    By Jeremy Gaunt, European Investment Correspondent

    LONDON (Reuters) - Fears about U.S. recession, increased credit woes and a sinking dollar battered world stocks on Friday while oil remained stubbornly above $100 a barrel and investors sought safety in government bonds.

    The dollar fell to more all-time lows low against major currencies, including the euro, which hit a record beyond $1.54.

    Investors were focused on key U.S. jobs data later in the day for a steer on likely interest rate moves from the Federal Reserve but also on the depth of the U.S. economic decline.

    "Markets are braced for a rather bad employment number today. These ongoing recessionary worries are hitting risk appetite across the board," said Geoffrey Yu, a currency strategist at UBS in Zurich.
    Overnight losses on Wall Street -- where the S&P 500 .SPX fell 2.2 percent -- spilled over to the rest of the world.

    MSCI's main world stock index .MIWD00000PUS, a benchmark for many professional investors, lost 1 percent while .............................

    whole article: http://www.reuters.com/article/hotSt...22584520080307

  19. #169
    Just An Optician jediron1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rbaker View Post
    We have also enjoyed a very good year. In fact the last three months have seen record dividend checks, in particular the energy sector of our holdings. Now, admittedly, the net value of some of our stocks are nothing to write home about but the market goes up and the market goes down. Over the long haul it goes up, way up. The first dollar that I invested is worth over twenty dollars today.

    Cripes, remembering the Carter years we all thought that we would be living under bridges eating squirrels on a stick. If you think the housing market is the pits now back then you could not give a house away. Just relax, don't worry, be happy.

    There are no limits to what you can achieve here in America despite what the losers say.

    I m not worried. Now where did that squirrel go? Hey some of those bridges are quite nice. Now where is my bed roll? :bbg:

  20. #170
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    Blue Jumper Risk aversion pushes dollar towards lows...................

    Risk aversion pushes dollar towards lows

    Mon Mar 10, 2008 7:38am EDT

    By Toni Vorobyova

    LONDON (Reuters) - The dollar closed in on last week's lows versus the yen and the Swiss franc on Monday as worries about a recession in the world's biggest economy dented investors' risk appetite and sparked a sell off in equities.

    U.S. data on Friday showed an unexpected second monthly fall in non-farm payrolls in February, sending the dollar to fresh record lows versus the euro, the Swiss franc and a basket of major currencies and eight year lows against the yen.

    Although the greenback rebounded later on Friday as investors focused on a package of liquidity-boosting measures from the Federal Reserve, risk aversion returned on Monday as Japan's benchmark Nikkei .N225 fell to its lowest in 2-1/2 years and European stocks also eased .

    Such an environment tends to benefit the yen and the Swiss franc, as investors unwind relatively risky carry trade bets previously funded by borrowing in these low-yielding currencies.

    "It (payrolls) was unambiguously weak data...Two consecutive payroll falls and other bits of data last week are all pretty consistent with a recession, which we think started late last year," said Steve Barrow, chief currency strategist at Bear Stearns..................................

    See whole article: http://www.reuters.com/article/hotSt...12408420080310

  21. #171
    ATO Member HarryChiling's Avatar
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    Here's an interestign link for those that want to keep an eye on your local economy or the economy of the nation at a glance:

    http://www.bls.gov/eag/home.htm
    1st* HTML5 Tracer Software
    1st Mac Compatible Tracer Software
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    *Dave at OptiVision has a web based tracer integration package that's awesome.

  22. #172
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    Blue Jumper Link...............

    Quote Originally Posted by HarryChiling View Post
    Here's an interestign link for those that want to keep an eye on your local economy or the economy of the nation at a glance:

    http://www.bls.gov/eag/home.htm
    That is a super link, I just wish that the results would be current to get a better picture.

  23. #173
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    Quote Originally Posted by jediron1 View Post
    While I believe Chris is right it usually takes a number of months for the optical field to feel the pinch. Like in the 70's the optical community did not start to feel that pinch until we were in the middle of a recession. As far as Lux from what I'm hearing they are shedding BJ's and have already shed Things Remembered so maybe they are feeling a pinch. just a thought ;)
    That's just smart business, not pinch-feeling. BJ's was tiny and not worth keeping, and Things Remembered had NOTHING to do with the Optical field, it was just something they happened to inherit when they bought out Cole vision.

    Now, I don't claim to be an economics master, or even having the slightest idea how it works, but it amazes me how most of these recent articles have been pointing out that the economy is crashing... because we're worried about the economy crashing. "Risk aversion pushes dollar towards lows" "Economy, credit fears hit stocks as dollar sinks" "U.S. growth worries hammer dollar to record lows" "U.S. recession fears pin down stocks, dollar"

    Lets all just calm down. It seems like the situation wouldn't be half as bad as it were if everyone wasn't running around saying the sky was falling. Obviously there are issues. I live across the river from Detroit, so I know there's definatly a problem... but I think a large part of the issue stems from people saying it's worse than it is. "The world is doomed!" "Oh god, did you hear the world is doomed? I better stop spending money!" "Hey, frank's not spending money! WE SHOULD STOP TOO!"

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    Blue Jumper Continue spending.........................

    Quote Originally Posted by AdmiralKnight View Post
    .. but I think a large part of the issue stems from people saying it's worse than it is. "The world is doomed!" "Oh god, did you hear the world is doomed? I better stop spending money!" "Hey, frank's not spending money! WE SHOULD STOP TOO!"
    You beingin Canada, will feel the pinch a bit later than the US where it startet with the housing bubble (During January, it was reported this week by RealtyTrac, there were 153,745 initial foreclosure notices sent out in the United States.)

    Spend your money, but prepare for other people not spending, or your patients might start purchasing their glasses on line.

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    Blue Jumper U.S. consumer confidence falls in March.....................

    U.S. consumer confidence falls in March
    Tue Mar 11, 2008 10:26am EDT

    NEW YORK (Reuters) - U.S. consumer confidence fell in March, turning its most pessimistic in nearly two and a half years on the back of high fuel prices and a wave of grim economic data, according to a survey released on Tuesday.

    Investor's Business Daily and TechnoMetrica Market Intelligence said their IBD/TIPP economic optimism index fell to 42.5 from February's 44.5. A reading below 50 indicates pessimism.

    March's result was the lowest since a reading of 42.0 in October 2005 in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina and was the 12th straight month the index has been in pessimistic territory.

    "Consumer confidence fell again this month amid persistently high fuel prices, which are reverberating around the economy," Raghavan Mayur, president of TIPP, a unit of TechnoMetrica Market Intelligence, IBD's polling partner, said in a statement accompanying the release.
    The reading was the third-lowest in the index's 86-month history. It was 4.4 points below the prior 12-month average and 10 points below the index's historical average, IBD/TIPP said.

    Whole article: http://www.reuters.com/article/ousiv...00379520080311

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