For the reps?

[rep]

I agree and dsagree, the customer base seems to be more retail oriented and in my area that leads to price comparisons and the patient shoppign around. True I have foudn that in all cases with every brand we have carried the customer seems to always respect the brand, that has never been an issue, but that respect stops their. They don't respet he price or the people selling it. These patients are often the most ignorant like I mentioned before the most extreme was a frame thrown in my face.

I also seem to get this crazy type patient who seems to be under the impression that their are two types of designer frame the cheap ones we stock and the quality ones that come from elsewhere. For some reson if a Pearle stocks it, it is somehow inferior to another stores, again this might be due to the advertiseing and the discod products being offered us. The funny part is the quality from the average Pearle in my area anyway is hands down 10 times better than the average LC, heck we even have a few LC that were for a while sending us the work they couldn't handle (you know breakage and all) they were and are scarred to make anything bu the ordinary. Our average patient that purchases the high fashion frames turns around and puts the cheapest lenses possible in them. I don't understand why you would put a lens with no scratch coat in a high fashion frame, but the economics fo the situation leads to them wanting the frame and sacrificign the lenses to get them. That to me is just retarded and I am not going to give the lenses away or even give thema break especially when the frame cost more and have less mark up.

I am curious how you made a living selling core product when you seem so gung ho about having brands and getting away from core? Look it's just business to change u your script to match your wares, but the part that's agitateing to me is you are truly trying to convince me the rederick you just recently started to spew to clients and tommorow if you were back to core your stance would change again. On a forum like this it's easy to just talk and throw things out their into the ether, heck I don't mind just running through scenarios, but in the office where I conduct business some of these statements can be harmfull to my business, but they benefit yours so you'll have to excuse me if I don't exactly buy stock in your advice.

Again the poll shows that the reps that carry brands don't exhibit brand loyalty.



This one kinda urked me as I still knwo of more than a handfull of vendors that offer a lifetime warranty. Now I know I only have 10 fingers on my hands but it doesn't take a rocket scietist to figure out that lifetime is longer than two years.:hammer: Plus everyone offers a warranty, but how easy is it to use th warranty? That's where a lot of manufacturers fall short. To me it doesn't make sense to pay 10 times more for a frame then rely on a manufacturer to warranty the product. All that means is that I am paying a premium for each and every frame to cover the few that do have a problem. I could make more money again here by offering the warranty myself and I cut out the additional hassle of paperwork and hoops that I have to jump through to take advatage of the manuf"acturers warranty which further save me on labor.

Harry,

You have a misunderstanding of outside sales. When I was core I called on core accounts(pearles, managed care mills, small rural offices,) Selling luxury I call on fashion houses, upscale od's and opticians. Some MD"s in upscale neighborhoods. Oriental accounts,( very much brand oriented) botiques, sunglass shops and kisoks. Many of my previous core accounts can't pass the luxury guidelines set forth by our designers. They don't have the right brands (price level,), locations, image and personnel who can sell high end product. We have to submit pictures and survey the dispensaries for approval. The more exclusive the line the more strict the criteria.

What is really exciting is the number of previously core accounts that are remodeling and upscaling their office to carry fashion and luxury lines. Why? - because their patients/customers are asking for them and they dont' want to lose them and they make much more money selling luxury brands than they do manage care.

Regarding warranties,

Harry I don't know of any brand that has a lifetime warranty. Our two years is almost unheard of today. But as you stated you have not been purchasing product for a while. Start asking your vendors you might be shocked at their answers. Almost everybody had just one year. Lifetime warranty manufacturers went by the wayside years ago - they never got a reorder.

Reo

[cocoisland58]

You should have seen the look on the area Lux reps face when my boss tryed to open an account. We are a red headed step child. The advertiseing campaign for Pearle does not reinforce us as the place to come to for your stylish hip branded eyewear. So given all that information would it be a prudent business decision to try and advertise differently than what our business model suggests. It is interesting because it is a franchise. Independent, but not at the same time.

I have worked for franchises many times including managing a Pearle for quite a few years but back when Pearle was still Pearle. Every owner not only carried what corporate sold but had their own accounts on the side with different frame companys. That was the only way to sell to our market. If corporate ever cared they never said so and we won sales awards every year. We also did a little of our own advertising in the area to enhance what corporate did for us. Also as a franchise you can sign up under your own corporate name for insurance plans. Franchising can be great if you perk it a little on your own.

[HarryChiling]

Harry,

You have a misunderstanding of outside sales. When I was core I called on core accounts(pearles, managed care mills, small rural offices,) Selling luxury I call on fashion houses, upscale od's and opticians. Some MD"s in upscale neighborhoods. Oriental accounts,( very much brand oriented) botiques, sunglass shops and kisoks. Many of my previous core accounts can't pass the luxury guidelines set forth by our designers. They don't have the right brands (price level,), locations, image and personnel who can sell high end product. We have to submit pictures and survey the dispensaries for approval. The more exclusive the line the more strict the criteria.

What is really exciting is the number of previously core accounts that are remodeling and upscaling their office to carry fashion and luxury lines. Why? - because their patients/customers are asking for them and they dont' want to lose them and they make much more money selling luxury brands than they do manage care.

Regarding warranties,

Harry I don't know of any brand that has a lifetime warranty. Our two years is almost unheard of today. But as you stated you have not been purchasing product for a while. Start asking your vendors you might be shocked at their answers. Almost everybody had just one year. Lifetime warranty manufacturers went by the wayside years ago - they never got a reorder.

Reo

I understand perfectly well what you are saying, it goes to show you that their are various types of businesses and high end branded lines are not for every one.

I almost feel sorry for you, here you are thinking I don't have an understanding for the business and you don't even know the liness out there that have lifetime warranties. If any one is interested PM me for a short list. The idea is honor not offer so it would be extremely rude of me to throw their business out their like that. So you offer a two year warranty. Name one frame model that has been available for two years? Name it and I will end my rebuttals.

[optirep]

I understand perfectly well what you are saying, it goes to show you that their are various types of businesses and high end branded lines are not for every one.

I almost feel sorry for you, here you are thinking I don't have an understanding for the business and you don't even know the liness out there that have lifetime warranties. If any one is interested PM me for a short list. The idea is honor not offer so it would be extremely rude of me to throw their business out their like that. So you offer a two year warranty. Name one frame model that has been available for two years? Name it and I will end my rebuttals.

I can The Prada 52E has been out for about 4!

But who would want a lifetime or even one year. Why would the patient ever buy a new frame from you.

I have been telling cutomers to go for 6 months or even 3. Hey Lenscrafters only offers 30 days.

[rep]

I understand perfectly well what you are saying, it goes to show you that their are various types of businesses and high end branded lines are not for every one.

I almost feel sorry for you, here you are thinking I don't have an understanding for the business and you don't even know the liness out there that have lifetime warranties. If any one is interested PM me for a short list. The idea is honor not offer so it would be extremely rude of me to throw their business out their like that. So you offer a two year warranty. Name one frame model that has been available for two years? Name it and I will end my rebuttals.

that we called on different accounts by this statement in your previous post. It indicates to me you thought we were calling on the same accounts.

Look it's just business to change u your script to match your wares, but the part that's agitateing to me is you are truly trying to convince me the rederick you just recently started to spew to clients and tommorow if you were back to core your stance would change again

.

You are greatly mistaken. The best sellers of my lines have been around since October 2005 when they were introduced DG 4005B was introduced then and is still available today as is the 2005, 2012, 4007B, 6002, and the 893S. These models are all sunglasses which tend to change yearly.
I have many more ophthalmics that are still in the 2005 inital release and are still available. Granted the higher end does trend to change fashion annually but as you can see nothing like what you have implied.

Why can't you post those lines you claim have a life time warranty and let me know how many of them have frames that are two years after initial release.

After all its all about, honor, not offer as you posted.

Isn't it?

Rep

[Andrew Weiss]

After a weekend away, I'm catching up on this thread.

The meaning that branding has -- by which I mean recognized, national/international brand names that cut across different products (like Polo, Coach, etc.) -- will, IMHO, depend on the optical dispensary. As a small OD office in a relatively affluent but conservative corner of Raleigh, the importance of branding will be different than if I were located, say, at SouthPoint Mall, a major and relatively high-end mall at the corner of Durham and Chapel Hill.

What I look for in branding is not so much name recognition but, rather, style and execution. There are different looks that I want to have in this dispensary. I'm less interested in the name than I am in having the line's style-sense differentiate itself from other frames I carry. And, because I have a relatively small dispensary with about 500-550 pieces, I have to be selective.

Harry, your dispensary may be larger, but you may be thinking the same way about how to stock it. Here are the brand-name lines I carry:

Women's: Valentino (Safilo), Ellen Tracy (ClearVision), 9 West (Safilo), Cynthia Rowley (Kenmark), Thalia (Kenmark), Sigrid Olsen (Altair), Vera Wang (Kenmark), Jones NY/Jones Petite (REM), Kate Spade (Safilo).

Men's: Jhane Barnes (Kenmark), Joseph Abboud (Altair), Claiborne (Safilo), Carrera (Safilo), Jones NY Mens (REM), Izod (ClearVision). Converse (REM).

Unisex: Tommy Bahama (Altair), Scott Harris (Europa), Chesterfield (Safilo), Nautica (Marchon), Timex/TMX (Kenmark), Ocean Pacific (ClearVision).

"Brands without name recognition" (meaning, named lines that don't have recognition outside the optical industry) can work really well and sometimes better than the name-brands. I find that frequently the style-sense is clearer and more differentiated. Here are some of my favorites:

Toki
ProDesign
Jonathan Cate (i-deal optics)
Oxydo (Safilo)
Koali (Cottet)
Oga (Cottet)

I've found that mixing together lines like these can give a diverse dispensary where most folks can find something they like.

Of course, depending on your demographics, the mix and types of styles you seek out will vary.

IMHO, it really is an art to put together a dispensary that looks good and offers a range of styles which will serve the needs of the patient population.

Also: for the reps: having a not-so-great rep can easily influence whether or not I accept a line. There are lines I used to MA that I won't use here in NC because the local reps have bad reputations.

[MarcE]

This is what I like about selling Luxury frames. The customer base is much more retail oriented and the more retail oriented they are the more they respect really great brands and every thing I can help them with in selling those brands thru I also have two more channels of trade (sun shops and boutiques) to sell sunglasses thru. Never could do that with core.
They are some of my biggest customers.

The fake Chanel's must be a regional thing because I have never seen or heard of one down here. I have seen some discontinued Dolce that Marcolin released after they lost the line.

Rep

I think you are giving some sketchy advice here. Not everyone is a boutique shopper. Where I live, even If I were a boutique, it wouldn't work. Because you have to travel to the city to stuff like that. No one local could carry the high-end stuff (in the consumer's mind).

Carrying high-end stuff could be a recipe for disaster. Depends on your market.

I'm not sure I have seen anything EXCEPT fake Chanel's. And almost all of the D&G I see were bought off the internet at 1/2 retail (according to my unscientific survey). Probably stolen. Maybe even from some of your accounts.

So who has their finger on the pulse of the market? The guy in cow country that replaces screws in fake Chanels and D&G's that were bought for $80, or the guy that calls on "Oriental" boutiques (never heard of one before your post)

P.S. A recent tour of completed listings of D&G glasses on ebay shows me that the market price is lower than I thought. http://search-completed.ebay.com/sea...6fsoo%3D2&fgtp=

I didn't flame you too bad, did I?

[HarryChiling]

I think you are giving some sketchy advice here. Not everyone is a boutique shopper. Where I live, even If I were a boutique, it wouldn't work. Because you have to travel to the city to stuff like that. No one local could carry the high-end stuff (in the consumer's mind).

Carrying high-end stuff could be a recipe for disaster. Depends on your market.

I'm not sure I have seen anything EXCEPT fake Chanel's. And almost all of the D&G I see were bought off the internet at 1/2 retail (according to my unscientific survey). Probably stolen. Maybe even from some of your accounts.

So who has their finger on the pulse of the market? The guy in cow country that replaces screws in fake Chanels and D&G's that were bought for $80, or the guy that calls on "Oriental" boutiques (never heard of one before your post)

P.S. A recent tour of completed listings of D&G glasses on ebay shows me that the market price is lower than I thought. http://search-completed.ebay.com/sea...6fsoo%3D2&fgtp=

I didn't flame you too bad, did I?

In his defence those are DG suns not D&G suns, the are a knock off. I still agree with everythng you said though. Most of high fashion designer lines sit there and yes the more we have the more they get stolen. Our store has issues with:

• Low Margins
• Slow Turnaround
• High Theft
• Don't fit our image

I hae a tendency of stopping in opticals whenever I see them to get and idea of the competition and just to get fresh ideas everynow and again for our store, and I notice that despite all the exclusivity the reps try to portray a lot of stores have the same high fashion frames and tend to look the same. This summer when I was at the beach (Ocean City, MD) I walked up and down the boardwalk and went into every sunglass shop I saw and they all carried the same lines, thesse guys were within blocks of each other it's almost like the rep just walked the boardwalk like myself and sold their wares to everyone. The funny part was the busier sunglass shops had all knock offs or designer look alikes and they weren't that much cheaper than the other sunglass shops, and they had and displayed all the high fashion displays without carrying the frames. The displays acted as the bait, and once there the consumer tryed on what was there and bought what was there. That's the same mentality I am seeing in our store they come for glasses and they are going to leave with glasses, unless we totally crap the frames on the board this has held true, so why not carry more high profit (High profit for us no the rep) products.

[Chris Ryser]

Our store has issues with:

• Low Margins
• Slow Turnaround
• High Theft
• Don't fit our image

I just wanted to make a comment at this stage:

It ys so refreshing to see how the Optiboard members mentality has evolved over the last few years from praising the corporations and their products..................

to discussing real life optical issues in a positive way that affect everybody.

Keep it up Harry...............you are a good influence.

[optigrrl]

Harry & MarcE - you guys are the business pro's BECAUSE you know your market. The brands work - they're making money but there is something for everybody out there. Some areas just won't support them, some will.

It's just like fashion. Patent leather thigh-hi boots with mini dresses may well be the hottest trend this season, but are you going to see women wearing that outside of a big metropolitan area? Louis Vuitton handbags are so incredibly vogue right now, and here where I live even teenagers carry them. But if I go 25 miles outside of city limits into the outerlying, smaller towns I doubt I'll see so many, and there's a reason that there isn't a Luis Vuitton store in those towns, too!

Look at Johns - not a brand buyer but his locations do very well because he has observed and listened to the customers. When I worked in a retail luxury shop, we had to carry frames that retailed for $300 or more - and sell the Chanel along with the Cartier. Core product would not have worked. (too close to a Luis Vuitton store, probably)

As a rep, selling a brand vs. a non-brand is a bit more fun. For most buyers, it is still an emotional purchase. I carry 2 brands, several non-brands. You can almost see their faces fall when we get to (what some opticians refer to as) "the boring stuff."

From what I've observed in the retail sector (brand-wise) if the optician likes it, it sells. So when you carry a line that makes a buyer happy to see you, excited to see the new products then yeah - it's a pretty fun job. :cheers: