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Thread: Adjustments "At Your Own Risk?"

  1. #1
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    Adjustments "At Your Own Risk?"

    If someone walks into your store with a pair of glasses they did NOT purchase from you and asks for an adjustment, do you do it w/o saying anything or do you warn them that *if* it breaks, you're not responsible for replacing it? Regardless of the condition of the frame but especially if it is in bad shape, I always warn them that it's at their own risk. I think that is the official rule everywhere. But, with out fail, everyone I say that to says they've never been told that before. They get nervous and I'm sure they're thinking in their head I must not know what I'm doing - or I am going to break them so I can sell a new pair. I've had patients decline my services to go somewhere else (that the optician neglects to tell them. )
    If you don't tell them and it breaks, you just bought them a new pair, frame and lenses! Plus, what if their Rx is ten years old? But if they want me to adjust their 20 year old plastic frame, I'm not going to be responsible! I know how to perform adjustments with minimal risk of breakage but it happens - even when the frame looks fine.

    What do you guys do?

  2. #2
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Gold Supporter Judy Canty's Avatar
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    Do more than just tell them, show them. They need to see where the weak spots, cracks, etc are and what they mean. Most customers just don't know what to look for and therefore assume you're blowing smoke and trying to make a sale. Keep a couple of strong readers for us presbyopes who can't see without the glasses you're fixing.

  3. #3
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    I politely explain that I will be willing to adjust them, but caution about breakage and us not being responsible. I then tell them my service fee. Most balk and are truly blown away. Bottom line is..they did not buy them from you, you have made NO $$$$$, and they will probably never buy from you anyway. I do not work for free...these patients would not work for free either....do not give away your experience and skills.

    Exceptions to service fee=Family members of patients who are in from out of town and are in a jam.

  4. #4
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    Judy,
    If there's something obviously wrong with the glasses, that's fairly easy to explain. What about just CYA in all cases?
    I remember one time, I was at LC so there were probably 6 employees there who were (theoretically) capable of adjustments. We had all been instructed to warn people that it's at their own risk. Gentleman walks in and asks for an adjustment, didn't get them from us. I politely and carefully explained that I would be very careful, but sometimes breakages happen w/o warning and we wouldn't be able to replace them in that case. (This was a very easy and simple adjustment-I was 99.99% sure nothing was going to happen). Get gets all nervous looking and says he'd rather not. I tried to calm him and explained that we are instructed to always say that, no matter how unlikely it is. He says he's never been told that... He says that's about on par with signing a waiver that you won't sue the store if the roof falls on you...he says we're just supposed to take responsibility for those things. After all, that's why he's not adjusting them himself!
    He ends up taking the glasses from me and handing them to another associate who (because she was not performing her job correctly) did not inform him of his risk (even though she had the same instructions I did to always warn). It just REALLY annoys me that I seem to be the only one in this city being honest with customers about what would happen if they broke....and since no one else every says it, it makes me look bad.

    The point here is, I'm concerned that by covering my butt, I'm making myself appear (in the eyes of the customer) to not know what I'm doing (she must be new...) when in fact, I consider myself to be quite good at adjustments!
    Last edited by EyeFitWell; 12-01-2006 at 10:44 AM.

  5. #5
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Gold Supporter Judy Canty's Avatar
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    Warn every customer about the chance of breakage, by all means, even if they're regular customers. Also remember that what is obvious to us may not be obvious to your customer. Heavy smokers? Not only does the frame smell funky, but they're usually pretty dried out even after just a relatively short wearing time. Live/work in a moist climate or near salt water? Frames can corrode at a much faster rate. I think you're actually showing your customer that not only are you honest and up-front about their eyewear, you also care about them.

  6. #6
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    What Judy said....

    That just about covers it! Always warn them--Always. And those other employees who you see NOT warning patients??? Well, after they get their a***s "burned" enough times when the frame snaps, well, they'll learn the right thing to do!:shiner: Chris..

  7. #7
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    I always warn them even if they did get them from me and their an old pair and out of warranty. I have never had someone balk at it either. If they do complain about it to you, DO NOT adjust them. Fezz is right, they didn't get them from you in the first place and probably won't buy them from you in the future. Save yourself some headaches.

  8. #8
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    I'm really glad to hear that you all agree it's best to warn them.
    Doesn't it make you feel silly when their temple needs to be bent 10 degrees and they refuse to have them adjusted because they're afraid they will break?
    I guess you're right though...the bottom line is, my time is worth something and if they're going to be like that, let them walk around crooked! I guess I was taking it like a personal slam when they got freaked out and refused an adjustment.

  9. #9
    OptiBoardaholic a1vo's Avatar
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    tell them, again and again

    Warn them about the risk, agin and again so they will also think it is the norm not exception.

    It's our responsibility to our fellow opticians.
    Paul @ Silicon Valley California

  10. #10
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    Paul,
    Amen!

  11. #11
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter Barry Santini's Avatar
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    My partner has the best line in these situations

    The client's frame is usually *very* bent or smashed, and they timidly ask if you can help them out. We say sure, but your frame is very mangled/bent, and sometimes, despite our best efforts, metal fatigue is already in your frame from being this bent-up, and it may break when we go to straighten it out.

    The client (usually a *one-pair owner) then says: "...so please be very carefull!.."

    And my partner's reply is: "Too late...that was your job!"

    I Luv that reply! And its so true!

    Barry

  12. #12
    Sawptician PAkev's Avatar
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    We use a POP (Patients Own Property) waiver which is located at our dispensing table. I covers patients own frames, patients own lenses, repairs, and adjustments. In addition we make our fees for misc. services, nosepads, temple bars, rimless cord, etc. visible so that folks can put a value on the service we are providing to them.

    If anyone is interested PM me and I can e mail a copy as a word.doc attachment.

  13. #13
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    reapira/warnings

    I think I warn everyone even if they did buy them from me. I mean if they are bent they potentially could be fractured or at the least compromised in some way. I than tell them, after successfully streightening their damage, that since they bought such good quality we were able to realign them however now like a car accident that has been repaired they are at risk of being weaker than like new and that this would be a good time before they are in an emergency situation to select a new pair and have them ready just in case. If I sell them a new pair I tell them that I will wave the repair fee but if not of corse the repair fee is rated acording to how much time to repair and if I needed to replace any parts, screws etc. Bu the way how many of you replace hinge screws after the glasses have been steped on or sat on ? They are almoste always bent and will be back soon with missing lens.:hammer:

  14. #14
    opti-tipster harry a saake's Avatar
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    waiver

    thise waivers are hardly worth the paper there printed on, if a patient were to take you to court, you touched it , your responsible, usually the sham artists will take them and leave, these are the ones that walk in and know its going to break as soon as you touch it. you also need to point out scratches in the lenses before you even clean them

  15. #15
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    If the frame is horribly messed up I do warn them. Usually the frame is unwearable so if it breaks they are no worse off.

    Otherwise I don't say anything. The last time I broke a frame that wasn't really messed up was more then 5 years ago. I'm pretty careful. I guess I should warn them, but I don't. I have never heard anyone in my shop warn anyone either, unless the frame was really bad.

    We do have a small sign that says we aren't responsible.

  16. #16
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    For the most part, if I break it, I replace or repair it.
    Of course my bottom line and my cash reserves are none too good.

  17. #17
    Master OptiBoarder Joann Raytar's Avatar
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    We've all forgotten to warn someone; and of course, that's the frame that's going to break. We posted a sign at our front desk that we printed from the Marchon MVP website, Patient Own Frame (POF) Release Form. We modified a version to cover adjustments and repairs without offering free lenses:

    Patient’s Previously-Worn Frame Release Form



    There are a few things we would like you to know before we put new lenses in your old frame.

    1. Although we use the utmost care when manufacturing and inserting lenses in our patients’ pre-worn frames, occasionally an older frame will break in the process. Plastic materials become brittle and solder points on metal frames can weaken with wear.

    2. We cannot be responsible if breakage occurs during the process of putting new lenses in your old frames.

    3. Frame manufacturers regularly discontinue old frame styles as they launch new ones. Because of this, we may have difficulty obtaining replacement parts for your old frame if it breaks in the future.

    4. Your prescription lenses are an investment in your good vision. Because of this, we highly recommend that you order them placed in a new, quality frame.

    5. If you choose to have us make your new lenses for your old frame and your old frame breaks during the process, we will make new lenses for you at no charge, but you will be responsible for the purchase price of a new frame.


    Please sign below if you if you have read and understand our recommendations and policies regarding the use of your previously-worn frame and still choose to have us put your new lenses in your old frame.




    Patient Signature Date

    The above form can be found on Marchon's MVP website. http://www.marchon.com

  18. #18
    Ophthalmic Optician
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    Quote Originally Posted by chip anderson View Post
    For the most part, if I break it, I replace or repair it.
    .
    I do the same. It's never been a big deal, and they often insist on paying for it.

  19. #19
    Master OptiBoarder rbaker's Avatar
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    It might cause you to wonder why people came into your shop and asked you to adjust or repair eyewear that they bought up the street. The usual reason is that they are unhappy with the services that they receive. Certainly, they have no loyalty to their eye care provider. So, tell them to take their glasses back to where they bought them. Chances are they will give you a tale of woe about how that the guy up the street couldn’t adjust a pair of glasses for Helen Keller. Then, inform the poor soul that they might just want to start all over, neutralize their lenses and have them select a nice new properly fitting frame. Collect your money and go to the bank.

    You are going to make a lot more money doing this than by fooling around with someone else’s problems. And, by the way, you will make a lot more friends this way than by just adjusting a frame.

    By the way, signed forms are of absolutely no value in court and more importantly of no value to an irate customer. If you touch it and break it – you own it. Hence, my advice, never touch anything that you did not make.

  20. #20
    Manuf. Lens Surface Treatments
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    Thumbs up Gain new customers...............

    Opticians who have worked in a finishing lab. or have their own, have aquired plenty knowdlege to just look at a frame to know if it can be put back into a usable shape.

    Having the right plyers and tools and know how to use them to do the job will promote your business to the particular customers ,who most probably tried to have it done elsewhere before.

    By warning them over and over again..........having them sign a release shows that you are not sure of your capability to do the job.

    You should be able to have the proper judgement and do it whenever possible......................or tell customer "impossible to do" and why.

    You will only win you new customers this way.

  21. #21
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    A major chain in the UK spoke to their legal department about the "at your own risk" issue, and were told even if you say it, there is no such thing. By agreeing to the remake/repair you are accepting legal responsibility.

    I don't think a patient has ever tested it in law though, and it may have been a ruse to get staff to sell a new pair rather than repair or reglaze.
    Optical technicians in Britain.

    http://www.optiglaze.co.uk/forum/

  22. #22
    Ophthalmic Optician
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Ryser View Post
    By warning them over and over again..........having them sign a release shows that you are not sure of your capability to do the job.

    You should be able to have the proper judgement and do it whenever possible......................or tell customer "impossible to do" and why.

    .
    I couldn't agree more!


    Why not just put a sign on the front door:

    Caution: Do Business Here at Your Own Risk!

  23. #23
    Paper Shuffler GOS_Queen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Santini View Post
    And my partner's reply is: "Too late...that was your job!"
    Man, that's perfect! I wish I'd thought of that when I was dispensing :cheers:

  24. #24
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    Legal mumbo jumbo

    I happened upon this and decided to look it up.

    When a patient gives you thier glasses that were not purchased from you that is a bailment "the transfer of possession and control of personal property to another with the intent that the same property will be returned later."

    If the property is damaged while in your posession for you to be liable you would have to show gross negligence. The burden of proof to show you did not use gross negligence is also upon you. So I would do adjustments in front of the patient if reasonable and not use my foot to re align the temples.

    Also, if the glasses were stepped on in the first place what could be more negligent than that?

    Just my 2cents:D

  25. #25
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    Very new to Optiboard... Could you please let me know how to PM you so that you could send me a copy of your waiver. I want to make sure that I have worded my document right.
    Thanks Very Much!!

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