Irlen Filters? (for Dyslexia)

[Jimbob]

Has any of the optics world heard of a 'special' lens called an irlen filter???

If so would anybody be able to help me out with determining why this lens would cost so much??

We have people from the Dyslexia Clinic here, come choose aframe, and give us lenses to cut to the frame.. no prob, well not really....

I had a problem with a dodgey edger...anyway the lens was too small, no amount of filler would help, with out sticking out like red flag in the snow.

Upon consulting with the clinic, he said he could get the lenses (standard CR-39) sent to me, no probs, but it will cost $AUD 70.00....
bit of a far cry from the $7.00 we normally pay for lenses, + $4.00 tiniting charges, can some one please explain this cost to me??? or should i get onto the lab that make these lenses???

[Steve Machol]

I don't have much time now, but I once did a lot of research on the Irlen system - even talking to Dr. Irlen herself. Bottom line - the lenses are simple tinted lenses, nothing more. What you really pay for is the 'consultation' that helps determine which tint is right for your particular case. At least that's how it worked about 10 years ago.

Also be aware that there have been studies that refuted the Irlen system's ability to do much for dyslexia. I don't have those references anymore but perhaps a search on the Internet will find them.

[chip anderson]

Over the 40+ years I have been in this business, I have seen many treatments, gadgets and discussed this subject with many opthalmologists. Optometrists, Opthalmologists, psychologists, and others have all tried to get in on the band wagon. The bottom line seems to be that there are a lot of schemes to get fees from people on this but nothing other than the patient learning to cope with the handicap seems to be of any benefit. Grind prisms, mirrors, tints all you want, nothing helps.

Chip

[harry a saake]

As i remember Dr. Irlin would not put this system out for scrutiny. I believe the sytem was designed for visual perception, not to cure color blindness.

[Jimbob]

Sorry all havn't been on for a while, too busy with work, and the study of phorias, tropias, and all that other prism stuff after work (mainly friday and saturday nights......)

You say that Dr Irlen wouldn't put his system out for scrutiny.....please explain????

I think the idea behind these was the visual perception, by creating a coloured environment this relaxes the individual. I think blue is the most popular for treating dyslexia, i guess its like looking through a fish tank...but with no fish..

could somebody get back to me let me know if thats right/wrong??


Regards,
James

[Steve Machol]

I remember something about an Australian study that did show some improvement for dyslexics using bue filters. I believe the study also concluded the rest of the Irlen filters were ineffective.

[Clive Noble]

I know I've mentioned before that we run a low vision clinic in one of our practices. Sometimes we get 'dyslexic' referrals and quite frankly it is a matter of working with the patient to determine which filter or gel gives them the most comfort for reading.
It's not only the filter that's important, but also the type and quality of lighting used.

Now, sometimes they go home with the coloured sheet and just use this over the reading material. There are success stories and there are also those who say it really doesn't help.

I've also dyed lenses as close as possible to the filters using uv/tints not easy! usually light pinks and blues and again there are those patients who are really happy with the results.

I suppose it's similar to CPF lenses, Corning give guide lines as to which type of lens is suitable for the various problem, but in the end it's subjective with the Pt who feels more comfortable with a particular filter.

[Cindy Hamlin]

http://melbourne.citysearch.com.au/E...3/33/39/1.html

http://search.dogpile.com/texis/sear...&geo=no&fs=web

[Darris Chambless]

Hello there,

I realize I'm a little behind on this one but I'll throw something out for you. I'm familiar with these lenses, even used them for patients at doctors request and can honestly say that if the patient truly believes it will work it will work for them. It's a placebo for dyslexia. The mind can do many interesting things if you let it.

Darris C.

[chip anderson]

If someone has a working theory or product that is profitable, they will "put it out for scrutiny". If not you can bet it's a money making gimick based on bad science. This is why some branches of our industry get accused of "cultism."

Chip

[Ian Jordan]

We use methods that seperate the LMS pathways (sponsored by UK government). Tints do have an effect on around 30% of patients if you know how to prescribe them. Most people don't.
Clinical eveidence is now overwhelming.

[Steve Machol]

Ian, it's not really necessary to drag up all the old threads that are years old. Feel free to start a new one - providing this is not an attmept at marketing a product or service.

[Ian Jordan]

I did search to determine levels of knowledge.
Didn't check on dates but surprised at how little knowledge there is in US on the effects of tinted lenses. Dyslexia is only the tip of the iceberg, the clinical evidence of the effects of stimulus is enormous.
The date of the post shows how little progress there has been by opticians, sad but true.

[Steve Machol]

I did search to determine levels of knowledge.
Didn't check on dates but surprised at how little knowledge there is in US on the effects of tinted lenses. Dyslexia is only the tip of the iceberg, the clinical evidence of the effects of stimulus is enormous.
The date of the post shows how little progress there has been by opticians, sad but true.

Feel free to post a new thread telling people how ignorant they are. Don't expect a warm welcome though. ;)

[drk]

I'll go on record as saying it's crapola.

[Spexvet]

I'll go on record as saying it's crapola.

[chip anderson]

Where does your clinic overwhelm it's banker?

[coda]

I did search to determine levels of knowledge.
Didn't check on dates but surprised at how little knowledge there is in US on the effects of tinted lenses. Dyslexia is only the tip of the iceberg, the clinical evidence of the effects of stimulus is enormous.
The date of the post shows how little progress there has been by opticians, sad but true.

Ian, as a purported scientist why don't you post some peer reviewed studies for us ignorant Americans to peruse?

[Jim G]

The "official" site: http://www.irlen.com/.

Dr. Irlen, I believe, was a phychologist at Cal State Long Beach where she initially developed her theories. The practice seems to be concentrated in Austrailia and England but, there are many listed in the U.S. as well.

We looked at it pretty close in the early 90's and while not quite terming it huxterism, we decided that it wasn't something we wanted to become involved with.

[Ian Jordan]

Happy to send papers when reviews completed.

Papers have already been presented at peer reviewed conferences in Europe.
UK government has supported much of our work as have a number of large optical companies.

Papers have already been presented at

World dyslexia Congress
International Dyslexia Conference
British Psychological society national education psychologists confernce
International dyspraxia foundation professionals conference (keynote)
ADO (british opticians national conference 3 times)
IADO (Irish opticians national conference twice)
European Neurological conference
Institute of neurophysiological psychology european conference (twice)

Later this year we are presenting at
Royal College of Ophthalmologists national conference
International Special Education Congress (symposium)
The Ergonomics society (keynote)

In addition instrumentation and lenses has already won medical and innovation awards
Books available in UK.
Happy to send papers that are under review on modelling of neurological mapping etc.
A number of other clinical trials are in progress, educational and psychological trials also underway + lots more
for some news articles see www.monoptica.com and search using Orthoscopics

[Jimbob]

oh wow, no one has actually answered the first question, so Mr Jordan, what i ask of you is why is there such a stupidly high cost associated with the lenses? after all they are uncoated CR-39 lenses with a tint.... an i've trained monkeys to tint, and colour match, it ain't brain surgery


sorry if i sound a bit off key, but well i am :p :hammer:

[Jimbob]

wow talk about grave digging, this thread is only from the 18th of May 2001

hmm took 4 years and still no answer... damn... i havn't been on here for a while either

[Ian Jordan]

I have no interest in pricing of lenses.
However, the clinical lenses we use are not normal cr39 broad spectrum filters and have very different optical properties. Unfortunately "normal" lenses can only address a relatively small area of colour space before saturation becomes a significant problem. As far as I am aware other lenses used for dyslexia are broad spectrum filters although they may be manufactured to a higher tolerance level in some cases. In addition tolerance levels of lenses I designed cannot be determined by "eye" but by only matching of CIE colour space coordinates. We use a specialist triangulation of colour space coordinates to achieve this. This is significantly more difficult (and acccurate) than eye. When prescribing a filter we therefore give an absolute measure of coordinates that can be used to determine the filter providing the coordinates of the ambient lighting is known or can be worked out. Complex mathematics requires a computer to determine the optimum lenses.

However when a broad spectrum filter is adequate (about 20% of the time in dyslexia) I see no reason why it should be any more expensive than normal lenses.

Assessment costs are determined by the complexity of the condition we are treating. Visual perceptual anomalies are found in many conditions not just dyslexia, and can make a massive difference to prescribing - if you know how to address the problems

[Jimbob]

aha, and i have no interest in assesment costs.. i know it costs a bomb, and you have to be able to pay the bills in your practice....

what i don't understand is why i send uncoated CR-39 to be dip coated, and it still costs a fortune... i get the feeling that your not too familiar with the "filters"??


when i was working in the lab we computer matched tints, once they were good enough by eye, by mesuring the red, blue and yellow light absorbtion.... from what you way this very much concurs with what you have previously stated....

filters almost implies something is stuck onto the lenses, when they as dyed, and osmosis lets dye into the lens structure

Feel free to post a new thread telling people how ignorant they are. Don't expect a warm welcome though. ;)

wouldn't of seen that would ya?

[Ian Jordan]

I only designed the filters because CR39 filters were nowhere near adequate.
Filters denotes attenuation - correct term used.
Get to understand metamerism, it will help you with the subject, because it is clear that whilst you may be experienced in a workshop, you have little real knowledge of colour and its effects.
Send me an e mail and I will send you an e book introduction to what is achievable.