Can We Talk Second Pairs ?

[Framebender]

for your input. You bring up alot of really great points. Do you have any experience in how this might work for an independant Optician? We probably have 70% outside Rx's so we don't have a Dr driving the sales. We currently run about 30% of some sort of second pair sales. Either lenses only in their existing frame, tinting their old lenses or complete second pairs. We've tried working suns sales first, but quit that after recieving a number of complaints from our patients. We settled on 20% to kind of encourage people without being pushy about it. We extended it to 30 days to give our patients a little more flexibilty, since many are on fixed incomes

I don't know if it matters or not, but we are a discount operation. A full 50% of our people are seniors on fixed incomes. We see alot of single mothers with no vision insurance and alot of college students too.

I would appreciate any input you can give us. Thanks in advance.

P.S. Yes Chip, I know I shouldn't be offering exams at all and as soon as the OD's and OMD's in my area quit offering eyewear, I'll quit offering exams!!

[Bowmanconsult]

I appreciate your situation here.

First I have to applaud you...30% second pairs is commendable.

Stepping outside of the box and looking back in your business, it's important to look at the primary reason why your customers don't purchase additional products, and in this case, it sounds like a simple matter of 'lack of funds'.

Whenever this situation occurs, it is important to realize a term called 'Matter of priorities', meaning even if a customer complains about never having enough money, the customer may have driven up with a new vehicle with 'In Transit' stickers on the windshield, having the newest 'Sliver' (tm) cell phone, carrying a Coach purse...then complaining they don't have enough to pay their bills. You get my point here.

Many times it is not because they don't have enough money...they many times feel that it is simply not important enough to invest in it.

So...the first thing that needs to be done is to focus on the 'value' of the investment (and use the word 'investment' as this is what it really is) by explaining the benefits of the second pair. Once this is done, it may be important for you in this situation to offer a simple payment plan for the additional pair.

Many opticians will have the customer write three checks for the additional item...one dated today for 1/3 of the total amount (this covers your cost of goods), the next check dated for a month from now and the third a mpnth from then. Don't send them a statement, but rather have them write out all three checks right then and mark this on your calendar when to enter the remaining checks to your bank. Can't get much simplier than this.

I know of some opticians who will even mention to the customer to wear the second pair for one month and if they don't feel the investment was worth it...they will give them all their money back. In other words the customer gets to try them for a month with no risk whatsoever (minimize the risks...maximize the sales).

What makes this method work is the 'math'. Offer a 10% savings on the second pair. Knowing full well that some of these people will return the second pair after the free month trial...let's say that 25% will exercise this option and you will have to give them their money back (and pay the lab bill, but maybe a lab will give you a savings under the category of non-adapt), but 75% of your customers keep their second pair after the one-month trial period (remember...I still have their 3 checks in an envelope in my cash drawer).

The positives outweigh the negatives and I net more profit. But here's the 'kicker'...once the patient experiences the 'value' of the second pair this year, they will now be coming in next year asking you for 2 pair (one for primary and the other for computer, Rx sunwear, or whatever), so the long-term results can easily be nothing shy of fantastic because you won't have to offer the free trial to the patient ever again.

Please remember that these are only ideas and methods that others have used...not that I am saying you HAVE to do this. As in marketing, 'testing' different methods is the real key to success.

I ran into a patient of mine in a shopping mall quite a while back and he mentioned "You are probably wondering why I have not been back in your dispensary in a long time" (honestly, I wasn't wondering this at all), then he said "A good friend of mine showed me his polarized prescription sunglasses and I really liked them, so I started going to the dispensary where my friend goes ever since." Then he finished the conversation by saying "You guys should start carrying polarized prescription sunglasses in your shop." My reply was "Yea...that's a great idea." Then as I was driving home, I wondered just how many customers that we have lost over the years because we didn't take the time to educate our customers on all the great things we have to offer. Get my point here?

Make education your primary focus, top it off with a way to help the patient afford it (consider even at the risk of offering a free month-long 'test-drive'), and you 'led the horse to water'...hopefully they will take a drink.

My goodness...can I ramble, or what?

Just more to ponder,


Tom

[High_Abbe]

I think anything more than 10 or 20 % off on second pairs is BAD for the optical professions. It makes it harder to remain viable, and cheapens the value of the product and service that we render.

If you buy two TVs, do they give you the second one for free?? or 50% off?

Bullsh*t, if you were to offer a patient a free second pair (from select frames of course), rather than give a discount on the first pair, this would increase your net profit, and for those of you who don't realize this, you should take some math classes.........for instance take a $300 sale with a 20% discount =$240, now take the same $300 sale and give them a free pair that costs you about $6, you just increased you sale by $54.

[Jubilee]

Yes, but if you are aiming towards them purchasing quality goods, our cost is a lot more than $6. Heck, I can not get polarized sv, nor uv/tinted for that matter for the price you are saying. Even if you are buying dirt cheap goods and have an in house lab, you are still utilizing somebodies time and additional materials to make those glasses.

Plus what about value to the patient as well? Is it right to charge them an inflated price for the one pair, to give them crap for a second? Isn't this what America's Best, and Eyeglass World do? And I am not sure what kind of reputation they have, but in our area.. they are places where even people on Medicaid don't want to deal with.

Cassandra

[chip anderson]

We offer second pairs with a free frame provided the frame comes from our discontinued stuff we got stuck with and the patient purchases as a complete pair. Why? Many people want a pair they can work on thier care, paint the garage with and generally do stuff that they would not want to endanger thier go-to-meetins in. We offer no warranty on these frames other than I will weld, and bend back into shape as much as possible if they are damaged. Patient's love this and I make a few bucks. But then, I will also put new lenses in thier old frames at a discount if they don't appear as they are near death in the immeadiate future.
True I could donate my and thier old frames to the Lions club for whatever they do with them. But I am in business to make money, and I would rather take care of my friends as opposed to the third world. If I have a frame I can't even give away or the patient wishes for me to donate thier old frame, I do.
Many don't want to spend money for a second pair of frames to make a pair for fishing shades that will probably some day end up at the bottom of the lake, but they will spring for good polarized lenses.
Of course if they want new Versace's to lounge around on the boat on we are more than willing to help.

Chip:cheers:

[Jubilee]

I do have a clearance section of frames that are 50% off, or free when used for a second set of lenses. I agree that is a great way to clear off product and get them thinking about it. I just don't see the rational behind the BOGO offers.

Cassandra

[High_Abbe]

I do have a clearance section of frames that are 50% off, or free when used for a second set of lenses. I agree that is a great way to clear off product and get them thinking about it. I just don't see the rational behind the BOGO offers.

Cassandra

You should take some business classes.

[Framebender]

We've got a staff breakfast coming up next saturday. I think we're going to try a couple of your suggestions!! I'll let you know what we decide on and the results. Would it be alright if I picked your brain from time to time? We're just a bunch of old geezers to poor to pay attention. However, should you ever end up in our neck of the woods we'd be proud to buy you dinner ad drinks. ;)

I'm telling you, you haven't lived until you've seen Howie take a drink of beer and blow a beer bubble out of his nose!! We'll take you to only the classiest of places!! Hw do you feel about Furr's?!? :cheers:

I hope you're having fun and making money!! :D

[Jubilee]

You should take some business classes.

It is amazing you said that since I do graduate with my MBA at the end of this year.

Please highlight how your BOGO works.

The places here locally that offer these are ones with a limited selection of frames and uncoated Cr-39.

They charge out the wahzoo for the initial product. This frame is $xx. Going with these lenses and adding this coating in this material brings costs up to several hundred dollars, and any coating/material changes are charged onto the cost of the "free" pair as well. In the end that patient spent more money on their BOGO then what they would have bought at full price for both pairs in my office.

We get lots of people walk through our doors because we are close to such a place. They go there once, and that is it. They loose and I gain many patients because I charge them fairly whether it is 1 or 10 pairs. A BOGO is a great way to get them in, but not to keep them there. I hear at least 10 times a week "I went to "insert crappy BOGO optical here" and spent $400-500 or more on something that was junk. They took me for a ride and I won't go there again."

I have actually taken patients through the numbers and have proven many times where we beat the local BOGO places not only on service and quality, but on price as well.

BOGO do devalue the services we provide. Many people will want to know why we can afford to give them a second for free, but can't do 30, 40 or 50% just one pair. Certainly you can't say the lab cuts you a deal so there is NO CHARGES. It still takes time to select frames, measurements, paperwork, job verification, lab time, etc. Most patients are smart enough to know that and know you are taking them for a ride on that first pair. It is a matter of in the end if the pricing is in line with what they orginally were willing to spend. OR ends with a case of Buyers Remorse

Where I work it isn't just a numbers game. We establish relationships with our patients, and we are known to give honest and fair service and pricing. That is why our book is filled every exam day, and have patients who continue to deal with us after 20 years, insurance changes, life changes etc. I love it when I have patients call me up, say I tried XYZ because of insurance or a BOGO deal, and really missed the level of service I received from the Dr. and his staff. Or the patients who even with their new insurance paid more. You can't buy good word of mouth advertising and referrals.

Cassandra

[High_Abbe]

It is amazing you said that since I do graduate with my MBA at the end of this year.

Please highlight how your BOGO works.

The places here locally that offer these are ones with a limited selection of frames and uncoated Cr-39.

They charge out the wahzoo for the initial product. This frame is $xx. Going with these lenses and adding this coating in this material brings costs up to several hundred dollars, and any coating/material changes are charged onto the cost of the "free" pair as well. In the end that patient spent more money on their BOGO then what they would have bought at full price for both pairs in my office.

We get lots of people walk through our doors because we are close to such a place. They go there once, and that is it. They loose and I gain many patients because I charge them fairly whether it is 1 or 10 pairs. A BOGO is a great way to get them in, but not to keep them there. I hear at least 10 times a week "I went to "insert crappy BOGO optical here" and spent $400-500 or more on something that was junk. They took me for a ride and I won't go there again."

I have actually taken patients through the numbers and have proven many times where we beat the local BOGO places not only on service and quality, but on price as well.

BOGO do devalue the services we provide. Many people will want to know why we can afford to give them a second for free, but can't do 30, 40 or 50% just one pair. Certainly you can't say the lab cuts you a deal so there is NO CHARGES. It still takes time to select frames, measurements, paperwork, job verification, lab time, etc. Most patients are smart enough to know that and know you are taking them for a ride on that first pair. It is a matter of in the end if the pricing is in line with what they orginally were willing to spend. OR ends with a case of Buyers Remorse

Where I work it isn't just a numbers game. We establish relationships with our patients, and we are known to give honest and fair service and pricing. That is why our book is filled every exam day, and have patients who continue to deal with us after 20 years, insurance changes, life changes etc. I love it when I have patients call me up, say I tried XYZ because of insurance or a BOGO deal, and really missed the level of service I received from the Dr. and his staff. Or the patients who even with their new insurance paid more. You can't buy good word of mouth advertising and referrals.

Cassandra

This is why opticians can't afford to lobby. Whether you like it or not, someone owns the business you work for and they're in it to make money .....so, if you almost have your MBA then maybe you should implement some of what you have learned in school, and stop worrying about what your customers can afford.

[Jubilee]

Yes, my doctor owner is in it to make some money. Though he isn't out to be the wealthiest by any means. If that was the case he wouldn't donate his services for charities, church, etc. He wants to make money and sleep at night.

IF you read most of what I wrote, you will see that many of OUR PATIENTS HAVE ALL BEEN BITTEN BY THE BOGO! Why do I want to incorporate it in our pracitice, assure them it is different when it isn't and have them leave.

I am not looking to increase sales for a month, or this year alone.. I am looking long term, 5-10 years. Alienating our patients by charging them out the wazhoo for intitial products to give them either a pos or make them pay even more for stuff is not the way to do it.

I don't want to be like Eyeglass World, Dr. Tavel, America's Best, and any other chain or independent practice that has screwed my patients in the past. As I mentioned in my earlier post, I have these places in the same block, and many of those people who went there last year or two years ago.. now come to me because they knew they were taken for a ride.

I have been educating my patients, brought in sun, and increased the sales of coatings and other add ons. Revenue is up 20% compared to the same time frame last year, and it is through our service, quaility and selection. It isn't like the BOGO is the ONLY way to increase 2nd pairs. How do you explain to your patients why you can't discount that first pair, or how you can do the second for free?

You essentially are giving them a straight dollar discount. You just use the term BOGO to make them think they are getting something for free when they aren't. Just be honest and say I will give you x amount off a second pair of glasses.

Cassandra

[jediron1]

I appreciate your situation here.

First I have to applaud you...30% second pairs is commendable.

Stepping outside of the box and looking back in your business, it's important to look at the primary reason why your customers don't purchase additional products, and in this case, it sounds like a simple matter of 'lack of funds'.

Whenever this situation occurs, it is important to realize a term called 'Matter of priorities', meaning even if a customer complains about never having enough money, the customer may have driven up with a new vehicle with 'In Transit' stickers on the windshield, having the newest 'Sliver' (tm) cell phone, carrying a Coach purse...then complaining they don't have enough to pay their bills. You get my point here.

Many times it is not because they don't have enough money...they many times feel that it is simply not important enough to invest in it.

So...the first thing that needs to be done is to focus on the 'value' of the investment (and use the word 'investment' as this is what it really is) by explaining the benefits of the second pair. Once this is done, it may be important for you in this situation to offer a simple payment plan for the additional pair.

Many opticians will have the customer write three checks for the additional item...one dated today for 1/3 of the total amount (this covers your cost of goods), the next check dated for a month from now and the third a mpnth from then. Don't send them a statement, but rather have them write out all three checks right then and mark this on your calendar when to enter the remaining checks to your bank. Can't get much simplier than this.

I know of some opticians who will even mention to the customer to wear the second pair for one month and if they don't feel the investment was worth it...they will give them all their money back. In other words the customer gets to try them for a month with no risk whatsoever (minimize the risks...maximize the sales).

What makes this method work is the 'math'. Offer a 10% savings on the second pair. Knowing full well that some of these people will return the second pair after the free month trial...let's say that 25% will exercise this option and you will have to give them their money back (and pay the lab bill, but maybe a lab will give you a savings under the category of non-adapt), but 75% of your customers keep their second pair after the one-month trial period (remember...I still have their 3 checks in an envelope in my cash drawer).

The positives outweigh the negatives and I net more profit. But here's the 'kicker'...once the patient experiences the 'value' of the second pair this year, they will now be coming in next year asking you for 2 pair (one for primary and the other for computer, Rx sunwear, or whatever), so the long-term results can easily be nothing shy of fantastic because you won't have to offer the free trial to the patient ever again.

Please remember that these are only ideas and methods that others have used...not that I am saying you HAVE to do this. As in marketing, 'testing' different methods is the real key to success.

I ran into a patient of mine in a shopping mall quite a while back and he mentioned "You are probably wondering why I have not been back in your dispensary in a long time" (honestly, I wasn't wondering this at all), then he said "A good friend of mine showed me his polarized prescription sunglasses and I really liked them, so I started going to the dispensary where my friend goes ever since." Then he finished the conversation by saying "You guys should start carrying polarized prescription sunglasses in your shop." My reply was "Yea...that's a great idea." Then as I was driving home, I wondered just how many customers that we have lost over the years because we didn't take the time to educate our customers on all the great things we have to offer. Get my point here?

Make education your primary focus, top it off with a way to help the patient afford it (consider even at the risk of offering a free month-long 'test-drive'), and you 'led the horse to water'...hopefully they will take a drink.

My goodness...can I ramble, or what?

Just more to ponder,


Tom

Tom where are you speaking from now until the end of the year?

[Framebender]

Tom Bowman was kind enough to make some suggestions on how we might improve our 2nd pair sales. I decided to get my crew involved in seeing if we could make it work for us.

It was decided that not only would we offer our clients the ability to get their money back within 30 days, but we would allow them to write us 3 checks or leave 3 credit card impressions with us. None of which would be cashed until after the 30 day grace period. We would use this offer instead of the 20% off we normally offer and decided the 2 offers could not be combined. I asked the crew to set a goal and a reward. They chose 20 pair as their goal and a catered lunch as their reward.

To date they have sold an additional 17 pair and raised the 2nd pair average by $90.00 per unit. We have not had anyone bring back their 2nd pair and I expect about a $4,000.00 increase in sales this month!

Thank you Tom!! With a good crew and a little help anything is possible!!

I hope you're all having fun and making money!!
:cheers:

[Uni-Clip]

Tom Bowman was kind enough to make some suggestions on how we might improve our 2nd pair sales. I decided to get my crew involved in seeing if we could make it work for us.

It was decided that not only would we offer our clients the ability to get their money back within 30 days, but we would allow them to write us 3 checks or leave 3 credit card impressions with us. None of which would be cashed until after the 30 day grace period. We would use this offer instead of the 20% off we normally offer and decided the 2 offers could not be combined. I asked the crew to set a goal and a reward. They chose 20 pair as their goal and a catered lunch as their reward.

To date they have sold an additional 17 pair and raised the 2nd pair average by $90.00 per unit. We have not had anyone bring back their 2nd pair and I expect about a $4,000.00 increase in sales this month!

Thank you Tom!! With a good crew and a little help anything is possible!!

I hope you're all having fun and making money!!
:cheers:

Congratulations. Can you also share with us what type of product did you offer for these 2nd pairs and in what price range? Also, what kind of "hit rate" does these 17 pairs represent?

Thanks,

Lak Cheong
www.uni-clip.com

[Framebender]

but we were running at 30% second pair sales. From just looking at the totals I'm betting this will raise the number another 5%.

As for price point, we are a discounter so please take that into consideration. 2nd pair suns have been running at about $120.00 frame and tinted CR39 single vision frame and lens complete. Almost all of the suns sold under this program have been single vision polaroid and the average has jumped to about $210.00 frame and lens complete.

We offer everyone suns, but have only extended this offer to folks that have raised money as the issue. By saturday I expect to have sold an additional 25 pairs company wide that we wouldn't have sold without using this program.

[Karenrp1956]

When you give 30% off, is it on the COMPLETE pair, or just the base cost. With full payment of the add on for polarized? I do not know about the rest of you, but my add on for polarized is pretty hefty.

[Framebender]

with this offer. We were offering 20% off a complete pair and still do if you pay in full now. We started this program to try and capture some extra revenue. We currently run about 30% 2nd pairs and should reach 35% with this program.

The advantage to this program for us, as discounters, is that it allows our folks on fixed incomes the ability to buy a 2nd pair. In our area we are competitive with what we charge for polariod, but we have frames that start at $35.00. That may be the difference.

Anyway, I hope you're having fun and making money!!

[Karenrp1956]

I know we are not suppose to quote $$$$$. But maybe I can ask, do you feel your add on for polarized, specially single vision a little high? If this is not apporated, 4-give me please

[Uni-Clip]

I know we are not suppose to quote $$$$$. But maybe I can ask, do you feel your add on for polarized, specially single vision a little high? If this is not apporated, 4-give me please

This is where custom clip-on (www.uni-clip.com) comes in. We always recommend our ECP's to first offer 2nd pair Rx, preferrably with polarised. Then if it's too hefty for the patient, proceed to offer custom clip-on as an alternative sun protection, with premium plano polarised lenses(preferrably PC material, and not those cheap CAB films) and AR coat.

Lak Cheong
www.uni-clip.com

[SoloMio]

I have offered 20% "savings" on a functional pair, within 30 days. in 2002, it worked great. Since then, I replaced my optician twice and optical sales have slumped. I've renovated my dispensary and added to my office space in the past year. I take exception with Tom Bowman's thesis that once the patient experiences the benefits of a second pair, they will automatically want to update all their glasses in the future. In my city, the consumer often resists doing both pairs the next time around because of the cost. That said, I believe that the key to increasing optical sales is twofold, inreasing second pairs, and maximizing lens options for the patient. When it comes to second prs and lens options, good salesmanship (building the perception of value) by the optical staff makes a huge difference, regardless of the level of savings offered. In this sense, I agree with Tom Bowman, the perception of value will drive the sale, and value depends on finding what the buyer "wants." The incentive to buy is what tips the balance in favor or purchasing. The greater the value, in the patient's eyes, the lesser the push needed to buy. So Tom, I've seen your theory work, but now my team seems unable to sustain the effort needed to continue the past success. Should I look to "change" my optical staff, their methods, or should I test a better offer? Second pairs in 2002 = 30% , in 2003 - 2005 = 10%.

[chip anderson]

You may or may not approve of this approach. We offer a 2nd pair (New frames we got stuck with and now discontinued, or company went away or whatever, we all have them) at no charge (no warranty, no guarantee other than I will try to fix them if they break) and patient pays for lenses only (must be complete pair). We give patient full knowledge of the circumstances and sell these as glasses for back-up, to paint the house, tend the yard, work on the car or whatever). Some times we do this as specialized lenses, (reading only, distance only, shades, quadrafocals for working underneath things, etc.

It get rid of things we would be stuck with and we make a hopefully profitable lens sale.

One could argue that we could have been selling them a current frame for more profit but it's a way to get rid of turkeys and albatrosses, hell we don't even care if they bought the first pair from us. If not it gives us a chance to tell them how much better their current pair could be if it fit, or was made better or the temples weren't too long/short or bent down at 90 degree angles. Subtle hints that will work on the patient and get him to try us next time he has a new Rx.

Chip

[For-Life]

You may or may not approve of this approach. We offer a 2nd pair (New frames we got stuck with and now discontinued, or company went away or whatever, we all have them) at no charge (no warranty, no guarantee other than I will try to fix them if they break) and patient pays for lenses only (must be complete pair). We give patient full knowledge of the circumstances and sell these as glasses for back-up, to paint the house, tend the yard, work on the car or whatever). Some times we do this as specialized lenses, (reading only, distance only, shades, quadrafocals for working underneath things, etc.

It get rid of things we would be stuck with and we make a hopefully profitable lens sale.

One could argue that we could have been selling them a current frame for more profit but it's a way to get rid of turkeys and albatrosses, hell we don't even care if they bought the first pair from us. If not it gives us a chance to tell them how much better their current pair could be if it fit, or was made better or the temples weren't too long/short or bent down at 90 degree angles. Subtle hints that will work on the patient and get him to try us next time he has a new Rx.

Chip

No, Chip that is a good approach. You are increasing the value of the sale by a lot, and still making a little.

I have done reading lenses in old frames as a second pair for no charge. Keeps the client happy.

[Bowmanconsult]

SoloMio,

Do you have a doctor on premises, or are the majority of your patients 'walk-in'?


Tom Bowman

[SoloMio]

I have a Solo O.D. practice. 95%+ of the optical sales are referred by the O.D.