Athiesm Vs Religion... let battle commence

[drk]

Did Darwin recant his theorys in his last days and proclaim Christ as his saviour.....I thought I read this somewhere. In any case if you all came from monkeys great, I came from GOD.
Cindy

I doubt it. I've read several supposed death-bed accounts of famous anti-Christians, but I really think they are falsehoods. Seriously.

[Chairtime]

Darwin knew that one species could not evolve into another but could only improve itself over time. Therefore a virus could not become a human no matter how many millions of years it evolved.

[QDO1]

Epicurus is stupid. The truth is this:
He is able and He is willing. And that makes him "patient and loving". He's just giving everyone a chance to get it right before He judges. Epicurus should have been thankful that God has stayed His hand from his terrible wrath as long as He has. He's given me, at least, the opportunity to be born, come to Him, and spend eternity with Him.

Don't get it wrong, short-sighted Epicurus. Your day is coming.

Epecurus is dead. Instead of just lambasting his thoughts, read them agin and absorb

[chm2023]

Suprisingly, the liberal bastions of truth we call universities by an large still support evolutionary theory.

I guess that makes evolution true.

I guess all the talk about problems with evolution and the switch to intelligent design is just a bunch of bible-thumping Bob Jones University stuff.

You want to believe in intelligent design (which is wink-wink saying God created the universe), fine. I believe God created the universe. I also believe in evolution. The former is called "faith" and the latter is called "science". Why this is such a conundrum for some people is really beyond me.

And again, I was not aware of the "problems with evolution" you mention. Silly me, thinking universities would be current on science when any fool knows the only "bastion of truth" is the internet. Oh Galileo.

[Spexvet]

No. But that's becoming more popular, as the holes in the theory of evolution are more obvious. Google astrophysicist Fred Hoyle and Chandra Wickirimingshe (spelling is brutal) who have been proponents of this theory.

The thinking is that there hasn't been enough time on earth for all the random mutation to produce life. I've heard of statistical analyses that make it virtually impossible. So, if we suppose life were seeded here, we can buy ourselves more time by supposing some more ancient world than ours.

Now, why or how that would've happened is beyond a lot of people.

No offense, but it's as explainable as "presto".

[Jubilee]

here is a little food for thought from the Greek Philosopher Epicurus



Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing?
Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing?
Then why call him God?

Perhaps the problem is what our purpose for life is. If it is as I believe, to learn and grow, then having someone hand us everything is not going to make it happen.

I do not believe in destiny, or that our life is already planned out for us. I believe that we have free agency. To make our own choices and set our own path. God to me is like a father. Similar to the analogy Pete used earlier. He guides us, tries to give us direction, but has to give us the freedom to make mistakes in order for us to learn and grow.

For me some of the greatest lessons learned came from what would have been called mistakes.

If everything was handed to us on a silver platter, and this life was utopia. No violence, no illness, no hunger, no need for money, etc.. how would we learn about ourselves and experience personal growth.

Another way to look at it is.. if there were no sadness or pain in the world, how would you know what happiness and joy are? There would be nothing to compare them to.

Cassandra

[Spexvet]

... God to me is like a father. Similar to the analogy Pete used earlier. He guides us, tries to give us direction, but has to give us the freedom to make mistakes in order for us to learn and grow.
...
Cassandra

Exactly how does He Guide and give direction, and how does he give freedom?

[chip anderson]

Darwin did not recant his theories but he did express regret at having made them public. Darwin believed in God until and presumably after his death. He expressed that had he not published his theories many would not have adopted it as a reason for not believing in devine creation.

Chip:angry:

[Spexvet]

Did Darwin recant his theorys in his last days and proclaim Christ as his saviour.....I thought I read this somewhere. In any case if you all came from monkeys great, I came from GOD.
Cindy

I don't know that recanting would change anything. If Columbus recanted that he discovered the New World, would it mean there would be no western hemisphere today?

[chip anderson]

Darwin didn't proclaim Christ in his last days any more than he did in his first days. Darwin always believed in God. If any of you heathens ever read E. Stanley Jones he had quite a lot to say on how evolution and devine creation were one and the same. Words something like doesn't it take infinitely more wisdom to start something in progress and watch it progress over the ages that to make the finished product and be done with it...

Chip

Now I've said a lot when I promised myself I wouldn't pitch in with you on this sinceless debate which will convert no one and boil down to lot of wasted time and keystrokes. Those who have convinced themselves that thier liberal arts education has brought them to a higher plain than those ignorant believers in a supernatural God will continue for a time at least to continue in the belief of disblief.... And of course those who know God will not be disuaded.

[QDO1]

Would everyone agree.. The god of Islam (Allah) and the god of Christianity (Jehovah) share a common origin... in the god of Judaism (Yahweh)?

[chip anderson]

Odie:
Would everyone agree that God and allah are one and the same? No they and I would not.

[QDO1]

Odie:
Would everyone agree that God and allah are one and the same? No they and I would not.

so they dont share the same origin - are you sure?

[chip anderson]

Only to you heathens and moslems who would like to abate the war by putting a little guilt factor in the Christians.

[Chairtime]

There is only one God. Allah is what the moslems call Him. If all you athiests would read "Darwins Dangerous Idea" you might have a new opinion on Darwin.

[Jubilee]

Exactly how does He Guide and give direction, and how does he give freedom?

He gives freedom by allowing us to make our own choices.. We have a mind of our own. He doesn't control all our thoughts and actions, like some movie being played out...

He gives us guidance through His teachings, the Scriptues, and through the Gift of the Holy Ghost, our concience if you will. That gut feeling you get that you should or shouldn't do something. Like the time I was asked to stay late at work, and while I really didn't want to, I did because something told me I should. At the time I would have been leaving, another girl from the parking lot was abducted and raped.

Then there is prayer. I believe He really does answer our prayers. Sometimes it is hard waiting on an answer, or hard not to try and put my own desires in there, but I can testify that I certainly have had experiences that can't be explained by pure and simple science or coincidences.

Cassandra

[Spexvet]

Only to you heathens and moslems who would like to abate the war by putting a little guilt factor in the Christians.

While there is not total agreement on this:

For the Muslims, Allah is the name of the One and Only God, Compassionate and Merciful. The Gracious, The Creator, The Sustainer, The Healer, The All-Knowing, The All-Wise, The Lord of the Universe, The First, The Last, and others. He is the Creator of all human beings. He is the God for the Christians, the Jews, the Muslims, the Buddhists, the Hindus, the atheists, and others. Muslims worship God whose name is Allah. They put their trust in Him and they seek His help and His guidance

http://religion-cults.com/allah.htm

Maybe Pete can enlighten us some more.

[Spexvet]

He gives freedom by allowing us to make our own choices.. We have a mind of our own. He doesn't control all our thoughts and actions, like some movie being played out...

Does He ever not allow you to make your own choices?

He doesn't control all our thoughts and actions, like some movie being played out...

Then what impact does He actually have in your life?

He gives us guidance through His teachings, the Scriptues, and through the Gift of the Holy Ghost, our concience if you will. That gut feeling you get that you should or shouldn't do something.

Are you sure that it's not just you making those decisions? How can He both allow you to make your own choices and give you a gut feeling?

Like the time I was asked to stay late at work, and while I really didn't want to, I did because something told me I should. At the time I would have been leaving, another girl from the parking lot was abducted and raped.
...
Cassandra

I wasn't in the World Trade Center on Sept. 11, 2001. Was it God that kept me away?

[chip anderson]

Spexvet:

Yes, at final judgement you are not allowed to make your own choice. You are probably not even allowed to debate your own case. The choices you have made will have already determined the outcome of this.

Chip

[Chairtime]

Think of it as "influence." You can be influenced to make a decision, while still making it on your own. If I tell you to jump off a bridge, and you do it, I'm not the one who made the decision for you, you did.

[drk]

Epecurus is dead. Instead of just lambasting his thoughts, read them agin and absorb

Geez, I know who Epicurus was. I did read them. He was tautologically trying to make a point, but there was a major flaw in his reasoning. NEVERMIND.

[drk]

You want to believe in intelligent design (which is wink-wink saying God created the universe), fine. I believe God created the universe. I also believe in evolution. The former is called "faith" and the latter is called "science". Why this is such a conundrum for some people is really beyond me.

And again, I was not aware of the "problems with evolution" you mention. Silly me, thinking universities would be current on science when any fool knows the only "bastion of truth" is the internet. Oh Galileo.

You assume too much. You should read up on stuff.

[drk]

Would everyone agree.. The god of Islam (Allah) and the god of Christianity (Jehovah) share a common origin... in the god of Judaism (Yahweh)?

No, No, and No. Allah is Satan.

[Chairtime]

Allah is Satan.

Thanks, I didn't know that. I thought it was Santa Claus. (Satan Claws?)

[Chairtime]

Does He ever not allow you to make your own choices?

NO

Then what impact does He actually have in your life?

Only what you let Him.

How can He both allow you to make your own choices and give you a gut feeling?

Influence.

I wasn't in the World Trade Center on Sept. 11, 2001. Was it God that kept me away?

No that was you.