Rep,Originally Posted by rep
What was your source for 50,000 stores in the US?
Rep,
What was your source for 50,000 stores in the US?
I was unaware that Hoya went through indy labs. Hoya has some amazing lens materials, and I understand the Summit CD is really good.
Most lens materials come from the same very few sources.............and are used by different lens manufacturers but they sell them under their own brand names.
What you can get fom one you can get from another.
About a week ago I received samples of some generic progressives from the Far East, the published map and what I could tell from examining them looked just like GP wides, hmmmmm.
I still argue that there are only grades of lenses.
For instance, Panamic's, Sola Ones, Gradal Tops are at the top.
VIP's, Adapters, Naturals are below.
There are a difference between the grades, but minor differences between the products in each grade.
Well the vast majority of those lines are in a different category and you're right they are cheaper.Safilo, Marchon, Viva, Tura, Europa, Aspex, Lawrence, Kenmark, Revolution, Hart Specialties, Value Eyewear, Windsor, Zimco, Silver Dollar, Nouveau, Shane Michael, CharmontCapri, Clear Vision, Elite Optik, Zyloware.
The one I was looking for is your first choice. Great product, great names but price wise much higher. Also just curious as to why its OK for Safilo to own retail establishments and not OK for Lux. :idea:
Probably because Safilo is not in his backyard. In truth Safilo should receive the same bashing but for now, their threat seems to be less of an issue.
Actually bashing the Tiger is more successfull and effective in cases like these, before the animal is fully grown and become a real threat.
There are new and modern ways of copying lens surfaces to new molds. A generic today can be an exaxt replica of the original brand name and more or most expensive type lens. You can now purchase progressive lens molds in the far east for a fraction of the price they cost in this part of the globe.
Now that the large companies like Essilor et al have diverted all their manufacturing to the far east, your most expensive brand names also come from there and are made by chinese machines and hands.
So what the heck is the problem.................they all come from that part of the world...........are the same...............look the same.........are made in the same place by the same fingers.............but:
They do not have the sweet, heavy duty brainwash advertising for which you pay with every pair of lenses you purchase, and dispense to the public !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Is is not time to reflect and think a little further than your nose. In every field the smart companies dealing with the far east have made it big. Look at the Wal-Mart and others selling brand name items that are made better (and in the far east) than 15 years ago for half the price they used to cost and they are making the same profit margin as they would have 15 to 20 years go, but more people can afford to purchase them. Therefore their income is not reduced in comparison but has probably increased manifold.
It is time to stop bashing the far east and the chinese made products because even in our field it now looks like a fact that just about 90% of the finished products are made there and you buy and sell them every day believing you are still selling the good old brand names.
I just run across a chinese made lens engraving machine you can purchase for a few hundred dollars and engrave the lens, even a generic one with any fancy name or brand yourself.
Conclusion:
Opticians are a very conservative crowd resisting changes to modern times, and haveen forever, and take a long time to adapt. Times have changed and not every good brain is working for the large corporations, which are banking on this mentality.
There plenty others left that can come up with new ideas all the time, but in general only become valid when the large corporations adopt them.
The generic progressives might be exact copies, but how could you convince people without the heavy duty advertising? Furthermore, who has time to hire a team of scientists to continuously examine and test every lens? The easier way is just to buy the lens that everyone else is buying because, if everyone is buying it, it must be the best, right?
Well, I just had to turn away my first patient this morning because I am not an Eyemed provider. Drove away in her Jag...
Check out this tidbit from Eyemed's website (cut and paste):
Choice The freedom to choose from an extensive network of private practice
optometrists, ophthalmologists, opticians or from the nation’s leading
optical retailers including:
And check this tidbit out:
Our Customers
EyeMed Vision Care administers vision care programs for over 120 million members nationwide. Some of our clients include:
And get this!:
New! Replacement Contact Lens By Mail Service
Effective January 1, 2004, all EyeMed Vision Care and ECPA members will have the option to purchase replacement contact lenses for great prices via the Internet, and have the lenses mailed directly to their homes.
Benefits of This New Service For All EyeMed and ECPA members:
Please Note: If you have a contact lens allowance with your core in-network benefit, it is not applicable to the replacement lens service. You should always receive a comprehensive contact lens exam and your initial pair of lenses from your EyeMed or ECPA professional provider for proper fit and follow-up care.
- This service will provide a quick and easy option for ordering replacement contact lenses
- Great pricing for replacement contact lenses
- The convenience of having lenses mailed directly to your home
Here's how it works...
Click HERE to go to eyemedcontacts.com.
- You must be an active EyeMed Vision Care or ECPA member to order replacement lenses.
- You must have a valid contact lens prescription to order lenses from the site. The prescription details will be requested for release from your EyeMed or ECPA Vision Care provider. Orders will not be processed without the release of the contact lens prescription from your eye care provider.
- You will be asked to select the name of your vision care provider, enter in the brand and quantity of lenses you wish to purchase to meet your needs until your prescription expires, as well as requested billing and shipping information. This service is not part of your core in-network benefit, so you will be responsible for all expenses incurred from utilizing the service. The cost of your order will display on the screen. There is a standard $5.95 shipping charge for all orders, however, if the manufacturer is offering any type of special offer or free shipping at the time of your order, you will be able to take advantage of the special offer.
- Eyemedcontacts.com will do the rest! Upon release of your contact lens prescription by your eye care provider, your lenses will be mailed directly to your home.
They almost had me going for awhile, but that replacement CL scheme is just about the lowest form of life I've seen in awhile...
Did the 3 O's really need big brother to step in to prevent the "downmarketing" of frames from the proliferation of low-rent vision-care plans?
Do we need Luxottica's "brand advertising media blitz" to raise brand and quality awareness to the general consumer? (One which I've yet to experience. BTW, didn't Lux claim they bought LC "for it's advertising budget"? They've had plenty of time to Prada and Rayban the public, but I've yet to see it...)
No, I've come to the conclusion over and over that Lux, OF COURSE, is covering their exposure to 3rd party by joining them.
And I've maintained the reason, OF COURSE, that Luxottica purchased LC is for a retail outlet for their frames.
'Nuff said.
I spoke to an optometrist yesterday who use to work in Manhattan. The SAG (screen actors guild) has their member benefits tied to Davis. She relates that all of the sag members would come to their practice and get only what Davis paid for when they could afford anything. It's human nature.
I am sure there are many others that have never graced your door because you choose not to be a member. Look for lots more to leave your store in the future. When it really begins to hurt is when your own patients leave. They will leave in a heartbeat, if their company changes plans, without even batting an eye.
I see nothing outrageous regarding the contact lens replacement program. It's nothing new and almost every big managed care provider is doing the same.
In conclusion, by going all out to "hurt" Luxottica the reality is you hurt yourself.
Rep
Not only can you purchase the lens molds you can have your surface lens work made in China and delivered to your office within a few days. Korea, Taiwan, Hong Kong, Japan and China all have companies offering this service.
I can confirm this to be true. Additionally, I can confirm Safilo and Lux are manufacturing in my province.
Chris, I truly enjoy reading your posts. You have an excellent perspective of our field. Hopefully your experience and advice will open the eyes of others in our field.
On a different note, can you send me the details about the chinese made lens engraving machine. I have some customers that would like the lenses they buy to have their own logo.
How can you say that they priced higher - they don't sell the same products?
I still blame all of the independents for not creating their own vision care plans to offer to these companies.
You selectively took one sentence and placed it out of context. Go back and read it again.
Point 1: Totally agree. That's when it hurts. I'll kiss butt as a conquered vassal then, but not until.
Point 2: Unless you're saying that the practitioner gets the money, then you're competing all over again against the practioner.
I am wrong?
Last edited by drk; 06-03-2005 at 09:57 AM.
Jason, I hope you don't dream in colours if you think that the big time advertisers use teams of scientist's to check every lens made. Once the mould exist's lenses are moulded in it day and night and no further ckecking is necessary than to see that it is cured properly. The scientists are there to develop the curves and not to check finished lenses.
Being an optician and licensed in Ontario you have a pretty good optical background and education as they are all supposed to have in that corner of North America.
Sales psychology can also be learned and is very helpful in order to convince a customer that the only difference between a heavily advertised product and the same thing under a generic label will be as good but less expensive.
I bet you that you know when you go to Loblaws (largest supermarket in Canada) and look at the "President's Choice" products you can tell that they are exactly the same as brand name products that sell for 15-20% more. Very often they are identical brand name product....only re-packaged. Even optical lens manufacturers do the same thing and sell prime products in generic packages.
When you are sick............you probably ask the phamacist to give you the doctors Rx in a generic product at half price, knowing it is the same chemical formula than the original brand name.
For life you nailed.... if we want to compete in the future we will need to start our own direct marketing to companies... however it is difficult to do because most companies want a national plan with thousands of providers... it would require a monumental effort on the part of independents to agree on it and put forth the effort required...
Ask yourself, who else has a big stake in keeping the independent part of the market robust? Seems to me the independent labs and lab networks--i.e. Lightbenders, OSI, even the OLA. They also have the critical mass.
Chris:
You make good points and your logic is impeccable. But you are applying it to individuals. Individuals are smart enough to know the generics are just as good. But markets do not behave the same as individuals. Markets purchase the leading brands. Presidents Choice will make some money but President's Choice cola will never sell more than a fraction of Coca-Cola.
The same is true in the optical business. You're right, sales psychology can help you sell a generic lens to an individual. But it will never gain acceptance in the market at large.
Sorry to burst the bubble, but the cost of developing, marketing, selling, administrating such a plan would be astronomical. Who has that kind of money? Nobody!
currently the only insurance that is keeping the independents in the game is VSP... I am not a huge fan of vsp because they do not allow independent opticians to join their panel... which is unfair... however i do appreciate that they are the ones keeping us independent folks afloat
Don't agree. It's a matter of re-directing resources, utilizing existing strengths. There are 20,000 plus independents out there. That's a huge base over which to spread cost. Of course it would require some vision. On the other hand, if you are convinced the glass is always half empty, then by all means go buy yourself a nice white flag.
How can you say that they priced higher - they don't sell the same products?
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