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Thread: Four year degree program

  1. #26
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    Nfos

    Kim.
    Look on the National Federation of Opticianry Schools web site (www.nfos.org). There are numerous online programs. Unfortunately California has very weak requirements to become an Optician, but they do have something, which is more than can be said for many states. The good news is you can study anywhere you call home with these online programs. Also, the National Academy of Opticianry (www.nao.org) offers the Career Progression Program that is a home study course for optical dispensing, and a number of other books and reference materials that offer study opportunities in contact lenses and many other topics. The Northern Albeta Institute of Technology in Canada (www.portal.nait.ca/portal/server.pt) has an outstanding distance learning program that you can take from home as well.The Contact Lens Society of American offers their CLSA University with online educational opportunities, and there are others. Pennsylvania College of Optometry and Nova Southeastern even offer graduate degrees online in Clinical Vision Research and Low Vision if you compleg\te your bachelor's degree. There are many places to learn if you just look, and I encourage you to do so. A well-educated Optician can be very valuable in the right environment.

    Good luck!

  2. #27
    opti-tipster harry a saake's Avatar
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    4 years

    Back in 1964 when i started working for B&L, the mandate for becoming a lab manager or optician A was four years, as they figured it would take four years to completely learn the lab, and it did. We had terrific people in those labs in those days, people you could ask a question and actually get an answer, plus the one on one training. It worked for me.

  3. #28
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    Kim,
    Check out the NFOS.org site and you could earn a long distance degree. When I present a seminar, I advocate this as a way to matriculate and become credible. Opticianry, in the office I practice in, requires opticianry to be an art, a science and the ability to balance human personality. It also requires deep analytical ability to satisfy our average age patient whom is 68 and has pathology.

    Opticianry is truly a dying art in the US, because opticianry has evolved to a sales only position with no analytical ability due to lack of education and licensing. I truly feel that a majority of people whom call them selves opticians are not and should be classified as frame stylists or sales associates. In no way these individuals should be classified an optician fully without a standard educational and certification level.

    I am very apalled at the attitudes by people calling themselves opticians out here whom have no formal education of any sort or certification ( the minimal level of ability that is strictly voluntary). My daughter attended a very progressive high school in a very small community( there were 100 in her class) . They told every parent, when these kids where in 8th grade and ready to go to high school, that you will change jobs several times in the 21st Century as many will become obselete. You will be required to continue your education through out your life. A BA or BS is not the end and will require additional learning skills to compete in the next 100 years. You can expect to change careers 5 times in your life time due to technological changes. People today have more access to information than ever before and even senior citizens are embrassing it.

    Luckily, I completed a program in ophthalmic sciences in the late 70's and have found it to be the best thing I have ever done on the recommendation of a Guild optician. Working full time and going to college was no easy task. It helped me to set future goals. Knowing optical theory, surfacing, and refraction allows me to problem solve at an advanced level and earned the respect of many of the three O's.

    Frankly, I am getting tired of seeing the numbers hype and retail guides that are coming out for MD, OD offices. To understand these businesses and what you are facing requires hands on and learning your market. You need both knowledge and skill to reduce remakes, increase sales and that means the more education you have, the better. You also need less people because 2 at a higher price and knowledge level can work better and problem solve more profiently than 4 at lower wagews. Remember though, you get what you pay for. Don't expect a silk purse out of sow's ear.

    Be all that you can be and never stop learning!
    Last edited by Bev Heishman; 05-18-2005 at 09:44 PM.

  4. #29
    Underemployed Genius Jacqui's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bev Heishman

    Be all that you can be and never stop learning!
    I agree, never stop

  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bev Heishman
    I truly feel that a majority of people whom call them selves opticians are not and should be classified as frame stylists or sales associates. In no way these individuals should be classified an optician fully without a standard educational and certification level.

    I am very apalled at the attitudes by people calling themselves opticians out here whom have no formal education of any sort or certification
    I agree it's unfortunate. In Canada, the title "optician" is restricted by law to those who are licensed. In the same way that a person could not claim to be a physician, you can't claim to be an optician unless you are. The U.S. should adopt the same standard.

  6. #31
    Manuf. Lens Surface Treatments
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    Out of touch...............

    Quote Originally Posted by drk
    Yeah, and they probably get paid a "pretty deutschmark", too. In the US/Canada, maybe not!
    drk.........you are out of touch

    There is just about swiss francs and english pounds left in Europe................most of the other countries that have joined the European Union now work with EURO's (which accidentally is about 20% higher than the US Dollar)

  7. #32
    35yroldguy
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    You are young. In your state join your optical society. Ask them what you can do to help. If you really want to become a professional optician it just takes people working for a common goal with a goal in mind. But as with many occupations too many people want someone else to do it for them.

    " President Kennedy said so many years ago, "Ask what you can do for your country, not what your country can do for you!"


    Quote Originally Posted by Kim
    It seems obvious that most opticians who take pride in their profession would approve of a 4 year education opportunity, yet the fact remains that today such a program is not available. How can new opicians who genuinely want opticianry to be their career improve on what education they do have? I am new to the field, with only about 6 months experience under my belt. There are no formal education programs in my area, and the optician who was training me recently changed jobs. How do I improve? What do I teach myself? If no formal education is available, how does a new optician advance in their knowledge?

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    Naster optician

    What would it take for one of the COA colleges to offer academic course work suitable for preparation for the ABO/NCLE AC an AAS+ certificate? Many of us are AAS grads and this could be an additional certificate on top of our degree It could be limited to opticians holding an AAS degree as well

    Ed

  9. #34
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    They already do that...

    and do it very well. The COA-accredited colleges offer didactic instruction in all phases of Opticianry and prepare students well to take the certification exams at the advanced level.

  10. #35
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    4 year degree

    We can go about this by going through te back door. Keep the 2 year degree for the moment and add two additional academic certificate programs. The first one would lead to both ABO-AC and NCLC-AC. The other would do the same for ABO-M and NCLC-M. By doing this we have created a "graduate" program leaving the basic education as it is for the moment and giving us time to create a full BS program in a 4 year timeframe and allow current opticians to upgrade their education as well

    Ed

  11. #36
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    4 year program

    I forgot one other thing I would appeal to the ABO/NCLE to permit graduates of these certificate programs totake the exams as soon as they complete the certificate instead of 3 years one renewal cycle after passing the ABO/NCLE

    Ed

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    Redhot Jumper educational requirements

    I'm all for requiring education for Opticians. I was trained on the job. I started off as a lab technician in 1989 while attending college. I worked my way up the ladder as a Frame Stylist, Apprentice Optician and finally to Certified Optician. I became certified in 1995. I learned a lot on the job and through continuing education. Although I have a B.S and an A.S. in Biology and Biotechnology, I feel that there is still a whole lot more about Optics I haven't learned yet. I think of myself as a health professional and I believe this field requires some smarts. I don't think of myself as being on the same level as a hair stylist. I'd like to become a Master Optician, teach, and refract in the future. I would also like to be able to converse with an Optometrist or Ophthalmologist about optics and know what I'm talking about. So I have decided to go for the 2 yr on line Opticianry degree program. And I also would like to mention that my customers always ask me where and how I got my training. I say that I have a biology degree, but the general public does not understand how that relates to Opticianry. I get mixed reactions when I say I was trained on the job. They usually perk up when I say I'm board certified. So I think having an Opticianry degree would elevate the Optician in the eyes of the general public.

  13. #38
    Master OptiBoarder Snitgirl's Avatar
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    which 2 year online Optnry Degree?


    And congrats on wanting to advance in the field and making this your career vs just a job.... :D
    Last edited by Snitgirl; 05-22-2005 at 11:22 AM.

  14. #39
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    Big Smile jacqui

    You go girl!

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    Wave to snitgirl

    I'm referring to the Hillsborough Community College in Florida. I'm choosing this program because they offer refractometry courses. There are some other schools that have this program. You can find them at www.nfos.org.

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    standards

    speaking from a UK perspective

    What surprises me is the knowledge levels that are necessary to dispense specialist lenses competently and handle potential problems with Rx, visual optics, eye movement, aberrations and distortions, filters, ambient lighting, disease etc. Contact lens fitting and usage, LVAs, prosthetics, sensory integration, praxis, life style are all relevant. Medical conditions may be a factor.

    Most new UK opticians will have a degree + further training (continuing education is compulsary), pity help the person who goes to the salesman with little or no training. I am surprised that the optometrists / ophthalmologists are happy to let their prescriptions be dispensed by those without training. (cynically it may make them more fees in trying to sort out incompetency).

    There is more than sufficient theory for a four year course.
    Good luck in achieving change

  17. #42
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    To much politics...................

    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Jordan
    speaking from a UK perspective

    There is more than sufficient theory for a four year course.
    Good luck in achieving change
    Ian, I am all with you and you put it very neatly on the table.

    However US optics will never achieve it. There will never be an accord throughout the country. My hat off to the ones that are doing the work and wish them nothing less than success..

    A barber who cuts your hair will need a license in just about every corner of the US.

    In order to be licensed you have to convince local, state and federal authorities to create the laws to require the education before you can get licensed in a way it is done in most countries.

    You need a lot of lobbying and that is politics. When it comes to politics it also gets into the money that has to come from somewhere. In the optical trade the larger corporations are out to dominate the trade and will not be helpfull to the cause which would slow down their progress.

  18. #43
    35yroldguy
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    Well said.....In smaller countries perhaps it is easier to have the government make sure the professions are accredited!

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Ryser
    Ian, I am all with you and you put it very neatly on the table.

    However US optics will never achieve it. There will never be an accord throughout the country. My hat off to the ones that are doing the work and wish them nothing less than success..

    A barber who cuts your hair will need a license in just about every corner of the US.

    In order to be licensed you have to convince local, state and federal authorities to create the laws to require the education before you can get licensed in a way it is done in most countries.

    You need a lot of lobbying and that is politics. When it comes to politics it also gets into the money that has to come from somewhere. In the optical trade the larger corporations are out to dominate the trade and will not be helpfull to the cause which would slow down their progress.

  19. #44
    35yroldguy
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    I have a question... If you get a two or four year degree in opticianry why would it be necessary to get ABO/NCLE. Most opticians only have on the job training and they are the ones that would need a test to make sure they are competent. Depending where you want to hang your shingle you would need just a license. A degree should have more value than just a certificate.



    Quote Originally Posted by Ed_Optician
    I forgot one other thing I would appeal to the ABO/NCLE to permit graduates of these certificate programs totake the exams as soon as they complete the certificate instead of 3 years one renewal cycle after passing the ABO/NCLE

    Ed

  20. #45
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    Certification

    Having a degree from an institution does not give a person the right to practice what they havel earned. The written examination as in ABO is in many states proof of competant entry level skills in this field. This exam is the basis for licesure in California and serves as the written exam in a number of other states including NY
    My proposal was to offer 2 post AAS programs to opticians who wish to enhance their skills and be recognized for it academically as well. I was suggesting these certificates in lieu of a Masters level and Phd level programs that we do not have because we do not offer a BS level program to begin with.
    I am just trying to offer ways of raising the bar in our profession without raising too many eyebrows among te ODs and Mds

    Ed

  21. #46
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    Ed

    I have a four degree in political science as a major. I have a 2 year degree in Health Optics. I took the ABO and passed.

    I think to upgrade opticianry we need to stop handing out ABO/Ncle certificates to just anyone that wants to take a test that gives them the credentials to practice as an optician.

    The OD's were and I do not remember when but they were once opticians. They got the education in place grandfathered all the so called refractionists in and they became the modern day OD.

    It is too bad we have to ask permission from OD's and MD's to try to further our education! It would be in their best benefit to get us educated.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ed_Optician
    Having a degree from an institution does not give a person the right to practice what they havel earned. The written examination as in ABO is in many states proof of competant entry level skills in this field. This exam is the basis for licesure in California and serves as the written exam in a number of other states including NY
    My proposal was to offer 2 post AAS programs to opticians who wish to enhance their skills and be recognized for it academically as well. I was suggesting these certificates in lieu of a Masters level and Phd level programs that we do not have because we do not offer a BS level program to begin with.
    I am just trying to offer ways of raising the bar in our profession without raising too many eyebrows among te ODs and Mds

    Ed

  22. #47
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    Education

    It would be in the best interest of consumers if all opticians were required to have an AAS in order to get certified
    It would be in the best interest of the ODs and MDs to have better educated opticians
    It would be in the best interest of al opticians to have mandatory education.

    Currently opticians dont want to do anything more than they now do. You should have heard NY opticians scream when 18 hours of NY approved CEs were required every 3 years. NY opticians still want to have an apprenticeship option rather than formal education not as good as even the distance learning programs

    ODs and MDs dont want educated opticians....they cost too much

    Large chain stores Pearle, Cole National, Lenscrafters really do not want educated opticians and strong licenses because again costs will go up. Some years ago there was an organization formed by Pearle Cole and Lenscrafters supposedly an opticians and optometrists organization but instead was a PAC designed to take the teeth out of opticianary laws in states that had them and to lobby other states against licensing opticians. I think the organization was known as NAOO National Association of opticians and optometrists

    If we do not take care of ourselves, we wont be here in a few years

    Ed

  23. #48
    Master OptiBoarder Darryl Meister's Avatar
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    I think the easiest way to encourage education (since we won't be legislating it anytime soon) would be to incease the level of difficulty of the ABO exam. By bringing it back up to standards, so that it truly serves as the measure of competency it claims to be, prospective exam candidates will actually need education to earn it -- not just a little review book of questions and answers. The board of directors of the ABO undoubtedly comprises many individuals who have been involved with advancing opticianry for years... So why isn't it advancing opticianry?

    And I have to agree with the New Yorkers regarding continuing education. Why would an ABO renewal require any more education than it took to earn the actual certification in the first place? Most people could learn to pass the current version of the exam, itself, with less than 18 hours of training. Is the motivation really continued education or the business of continued education?

    Best regards,
    Darryl

  24. #49
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    Apprenticeship and Education

    Ed,
    NY is a state in which 95% of Opticians go through an academic program. It is one of the best states. I wish others were as accomplished and demanding. I just completed a study that indicates that Opticians want to continue with apprenticeship, but add a formal educational compnent to assure theoretical competence (at least at the basic level). The study population was very much in favor of an increase in the scope of practice of Opticians, but with a concurrent upgrading in the level of education. It is not the at-large population of Opticians that are against education, but a few in the vocal minoroty, the chains and some (not all) of the ODs. We must continue to fight for the betterment of Opticianry to make it happen.

    Warren

  25. #50
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    Continuing Education

    Darryl
    New York revised its licensing requirements in the late 80s 89 I think ABO replaced the state written exam with the state administering the practical only. The law never stated that you needed to maintain your ABO certification to retain your state license. Some years later 1995 or so NY implemented mandatory CEs not ABO approved CE but NY approved primarily technical in nature. The old time opticians were not enthralled wiht the idea of having to take courses to retain their license. Two gentlemen I worked for *****ed and moaned loudly about it. They only had to go 1/2 mile from their office to one of the schools in NYCto get their CEs 6 hours in one day at very reasonable cost. 18 hours in 3 years is not unreasonable to keep current
    Those of us in ABO only states 12 CEs in 3 years of 21 CEs in 3 for dual certified are not doing badly especially because most of ours can be done by mail or on line at $0 cost or very low cost to us. If I do one CE per month I am not working very hard to maintain my license/certification

    Ed

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