TIPS ON DISPENSING

[drk]

I, too, have been struggling with Rx'ing sunwear.

"The problem"

In the old days, a patient got an ophthalmic frame for sunwear, which was better for all of us, and them.

But today, it seems to be more of an expectation that a person picks a sunglass from your inventory and Rx's it. I understand the obvious advantages of sunwear-specific styling, and the ability to visualize the finished product better, and, frankly, it is a lot cooler to wear Oakleys than a tinted old Rx.

But, plano sunwear designers don't even think about Rx-ing when designing, and the vast majority of fashion sunwear right now is just not Rx-able! I wish they'd be a little more sensitive to the Rx-ability, though, and make at least 25% of their collections Rx-friendly. It seems that metal sunwear in the ladies fashion category is mostly limited to rimless/shields. In the men's fashion category, the look is wrap-wrap-wrap, and big, too, making everything worse.

"The proposed solution"

SET RX LIMITS ON ALL SUNWEAR
Essentially, remember that with the proprietary Rx programs of Maui Jim, Oakley, etc., they are very specific as to what Rx range can go into each individual sun frame style, and we should have the guts to do the same with our sunwear with our own "Rx program". We just have to spend time analyzing our individual sunwear styles as to what we think would work, and stick to it. We may need to consult with our labs.

STOCK MORE RX'ABLE SUNWEAR TO EXPAND THE LIMITS
With ladies, it's not as big of a problem to find styles that are Rx-able. Ladies plastic is generally safe to Rx, thank goodness.

For men, since fewer ophthalmic lines have their own sun collection to choose from:

We've been used to the idea of carrying ophthalmic lines and sprinkling in some of their sunwear with the collection, espiecially for ladies. This is sort of the reverse: carrying sunwear brands and sprinkling in their ophthalmic for when we need the standard 6-base frame front.

Examples: Rayban/Rayban Ophthalmic, Oakley/Oakley Ophthalmic, Carrerra, Nike/Nike Ophthalmic

You could "pass off" the ophthalmic lines as "Rx sunwear" lines from the sunwear companies and not be stretching the truth too much. (I don't see much of any other use for a Rayban or Oakley ophthalmic, anyway. Ugh!) I have hundreds of plano sun lenses from jobs I Rx'd that I could cut down and use as sun-demo's in the ophthalmics.

Unfortunately, sunwear dispensing is harder than ophthalmic, with the frame & lens limitations! Why doesn't it pay more than ophthalmic? Oh, well...

[carlee105]

Thanks for your input. I knew I wasn't the only one with this problem.

The RayBan reps say that most of these type (even Wraps) are rx able. Well, .......I'd like to meet with them the next time they come in and have a dummy pair of Minus lens surfaced on an 8 base and say now....... prove it!!

The eye doctor I work for is equipped with a full service lab, with the exception of Ar and BackSide coating. And I'm the only one in the lab.

The girls out front ALWAYS come get me when this happens. They try to steer them away from the wraps, but some people are just set on it. I've worked in a lab since 1978 (whole sale) for 21 years. She fired me in 2000 over "1" job. Actually it was the best thing that could have happened, I just didn't know it at the time.

I don't surface polys, so I have to send them to the lab I used to work for. My former boss and I are on good terms, I even negotiated and got the Doctor to start doing business with her again. Still.....even though I like what I do, down here it doesn't pay and I'm too old to start anything else.

This is probably more info than you wanted, but it's nice to talk to somebody who knows where I'm coming from on various issues.

Thanks Again,
Carolyn:cheers:


PS As for the Doctor I work for and his Wife, they're looking at $$$$$ signs!!

[edKENdance]

This has been a point of contention in our store for a year or two. The first problems arised due to not being able to go 11 in on a sv without leaving traces or more of the hashmarks on the lenses. We've solved that problem now and now it seems that the sun frames are becoming less rx'able. I'm referring specifically to certain newer RayBan styles. It seems as if the groove on some of the plastics(particularly at the temple) are incapable of accepting the most basic rx. Tons of headaches on this one. Even doing a hand customed bevel doesn't seem to work.
As Cass has said, you have to put the foot down.

[carlee105]

Thanks for your input. your right, even though I'm not out there dispensing, I always been told: A good optician STEERS and EDUCATES the patient.

alot of the new girls that have never been in optics have no idea what base curves and the problems putting a -200 on an 8 base.

I help them when I can, but I'm not in the scrubs so I'm not supposed to deal with the patients. It makes me feel like Im the nut in the back, ya know, like IGOR! LOL

have a great day, carolyn;)

[Jubilee]

It is amazing to see how much things have changed in our store. Over and over again we had conversations on this very issue. Talked about finished cosmetics, optics, etc.. Finally I got some of the "offenders" and lead opticians back in the lab to do some cross training, and now they understand the issues that wrap frames raise. They now make sure they verify the rx will work in the wrap frame, whch helps not only to prevent that -4.50 in the 63 eye 9base wrap frame.. but also lets me know what frame is coming back so I can select the best base curve for cosmetics. If the frame doesn't work, I know our stock well enough that I can suggest a good alternative.

For example, a -4.00 won't work well on some of the plastic predator type frames.. I can tell them no, but take a look at the Daddy O styles.. They have a flatter front, but fit close to the face. Some of the metal styles we can make work on a 6 base or even 4 by taking out some of the wrap in the eyewire, and instead bring the temples in, and curve it at the bridge.

My suggestion then I guess is two fold. 1: Bring each sales associate back for a few hours when you can, so they can see what does go into making a pair of glasses. Let them experiment or witness how much base curve, centering, etc.. affect the final product. 2: Know your frame stock. Show them what styles will work for moderate minus or even plus scripts. That way when you or another associate says "Sorry we can't use this frame for your prescription, you can point them to an alternative.

Cassandra

[carlee105]

Cassandra,

Thanks for the input. That's a good idea to get them back in the lab, especially the newer ones and show them, Hands On.

Then, I could get with them on the stock frames. I hadn't really thought of that. I'm supposed to stay in the lab. Since I don't wear the scrubs, I can't deal with the patients directly.

But you give me something to use. And that is appreciated.

Thanks Again, Carolyn

[Occulus Sinister]

Jubilee said:
For example, a -4.00 won't work well on some of the plastic predator type frames.. I can tell them no, but take a look at the Daddy O styles.. They have a flatter front, but fit close to the face. Some of the metal styles we can make work on a 6 base or even 4 by taking out some of the wrap in the eyewire, and instead bring the temples in, and curve it at the bridge.

Try a front bevel as well... just trying to help. I did a
-4.00-3.00x90 for someone who didn't care about seeing, they just wanted that look.

almost anything can be put in a wrap... but who would want it.

[Jubilee]

I realize that the majority of scripts out there are not suitable for a wrap frame. We can caution the patient, we can point out other suggestions, but in the end.. if they want it. Then I will provide it. If I don't, someone else will.

Currently we average around $2500/day in sun alone. 75% of it is in wrap frames. If I turned down most of those jobs, I would be losing at least $10 grand in sales a week. And be working my way out of a job...

At least this way I have some control and am able to compromise.

Cassandra

[chip anderson]

I realize that the majority of scripts out there are not suitable for a wrap frame. We can caution the patient, we can point out other suggestions, but in the end.. if they want it. Then I will provide it. If I don't, someone else will.

Currently we average around $2500/day in sun alone. 75% of it is in wrap frames. If I turned down most of those jobs, I would be losing at least $10 grand in sales a week. And be working my way out of a job...

At least this way I have some control and am able to compromise.

Cassandra

Show hope you is on at least 10% commission.

[carlee105]

I understand that if you don't give the patient what they want, somebody else will. But.... what about the patients who refuse the glasses when they see them (after you have repeatedly cautioned them)?

We've had patients come back after a few days and want another frame because their "high minus" rx didn't fit correctly in the frame that called for an 8 Base?

I'm the lab tech, the girls out front have very little knowledge of base curves and what strength goes with what base curve. I try to help out and explain but they still sell. Mainly because the Doctor sees dollar signs.

But as the lab tech, I think it reflects bad on me. I've always been behind the scenes and have never worked directly with the patients, but I've always been told " a good optician knows how to steer the patient and stay in more control.

Do you guys agree or not?

I'd really like to get some feedback on this, any advice appreciated.

Thanks, Carolyn :cheers:

[Jubilee]

As I metioned before, get to know your frames that are out there on the floor. I am sure you probably recognize some of them as being ones that can work, or ones that are almost impossible. One of the things that I have done in the past is to sort the wrap frames. In one section I put the styles that are able to go to a -4.00, in another the ones that can only go to -2.oo and some I just plain marked non-rxable. If it isn't possible to divide them like that how about making a list of styles in each range for the floor staff, or I've been known to write it on the tag.

As far as a good optician should be able to steer them to what is best.. well I agree to some extent, but it won't work on 100% of people all the time. You can educate, you can explain to the patient how the lens gets thicker, how it will affect vision, etc, but some patients either must keep up with fashion, or have needs that make the wrap desirable...such as bikers, and won't be disuaded. These are patients that I will show an uncut lens to, and explain that all that thickness will be on the edge, etc...but still want to try..

For those patients, maybe you can talk the doctor into carrying some of the Smith or other specialty type products that have an insert that goes behind the sun wrap frame. It might become popular with the non sport enthusiasts as well.

As far as returns, yes we have a few. I work for Lens Crafters, and I also the Gift of Sight captain. All of our returns get recycled for our charity efforts. I can tell you that I have seen only 4 of the wraps that we ran in our Gift of Sight efforts. Two were for the same patient and he was a plus.

Cassandra

[Neena]

hello everyone.... i am an intern optician and i am in the process of preparing for my board examination However i am not sure what will be on the exam is there anyone who can give me hints of clues to what may be asked....i would appreciate your help.:)

[harry a saake]

Something to think about when dispensing. Any time you take a frame and face form it more then the way it was fabricated, you will automatically make the temples longer.

[Andrew Weiss]

Some times ago I had few packets of Point Tipped Screws. You have to press those gently till Pointed end comes out from the threaded side.. then cut it with a cutter and drive the screw as usual!! It saves hell lot of all the procedure you have described..
Presently I haven't seen those, Would anybody like to try if I could procure those again?

In the US, they are available through Hilco and Sadler/Grobet (probably other places, too). I have seen them called "seeker screws", and yes, they make it much easier to put that spring hinge temple onto the front.:bbg:

[chip anderson]

Spring hinge screws work even better than thread seeker screws, available at Hilco and probably other places. Worth the cost just in your time trying to alighn the things.

:cheers:

Chip

[harry a saake]

With so many of the frames today being made of various metals, it is not uncommon to see them move after the adjustment. I suspect a lot of this is to do with these metals such as titaniums, in there different grades, having some memory. This may tend to make the peice of metal move back to where it was. therefore it may be a good idea to completely adjust the frame on the patient, when taking the original order. This is also a good idea from the standpoint of taking accurate measurements for segs and OC placements.
.....When the lenses arrive and you mount them into the frame, you probably will have little or no adjusting to do, plus there is nothing like having a frame fit smoothly right from the start.

[OdTech]

Hello what is the best way to read a glass progressive lens "laser marking" on the lens without PAL-ID?

Appreciated

[For-Life]

I find the best way is if you can get a close light bulb. I also find from looking at the back of the lens it is easier than looking at the front of it.

[chip anderson]

A 7x hand measuring magnifer reading the back surface of the lens with the right light helps a lot. Sometimes flouresent light at strange angles will reveal or at least let you know where "invisible" markings are.


Chip

[harry a saake]

This may seem a bit simple,however i see so much of this. When fitting a metal frame, with metal temples and plastic temple covers, look at where the plastic cover starts. If the cover starts in back of the ear, that temple is too long and needs to be shortened, or ordered in a different length if possible.

[chip anderson]

A problem solved at least this time. As you may recall not too long ago I had a lady that I had made Progressive lenses for in clear and a pair of ST Polarized Sunglasses. The lady despite all the usual adjustment attempts complained of glare off the left lens. I did add AR in an attempt to make the problem go away and ate the cost of the AR. Now I had a pair of expensive AR coated Polarized bifocals that it appeared I was going to either have to replace with some more expensive progressive Polarized lenses or give her money back. Neither prospect did I find too appealing.

What I did that made the problem go away was:
I took some plastic adhesive tape and carefully put two pieces on each lens, one at the seg line above and one on the lower seg ridge. Then I took my cable tool and with a very fine abrasive wheel (pumice rubber in this case) buffed the top of the seg. Now this is a frosted surface (which was not an optical surface in any event) and the glare and the problem went away.

Chip

Kinda makes you wonder why the lens manufactures don't frost this surface in the mold don't it. I can remember when some fused glass segments had dyes on this surface to eliminate glare.

[chip anderson]

Only a very few manufacturers and then only for short periods have offered this:

Keep Lorgnettes with: Plano +1.50 add and Plano +2.00 add (A +2.50 trifocal is a good addition to the set too.)

Then when the first time or the experienced presbyope comes in your office you can hold this over the glassed he is already wearing with his distance Rx and show him nearly exactly what he will get. This eliminated a lot of BS about "technology" and most will say: "Gee! I can see print up close."

Some will say: "There is too much blur out to the sides and I have to move my head or the paper too much." In the latter case you use a line type bifocal from the beginning and probably eliminate your (or your lab's) having to eat non-adapts.

Chip:cheers:

Every Lens Manufacturer/Lab should furnish such Laurenettes to every account free of charge (Are you Listening Essilor, and Sola, etc?) to every account and location. It would sell them a lot more lenses than having a road/detail person come by with a bunch of brochures and a free pair of latest product lenses every six-months.

[Chris Ryser]

Actually most of the time when you have scratches on AR coated lenses they go only as deep as the hard coat which gets marked.

By using an AR strupper you can strip the AR coating and then the hard coat and you are left with the basic lens which most of the times has no scratches whatsover. You have then saved a pair of lenses for further use!

[carlee105]

:cheers: I've been an optical lab tech for 25 years, it wasn't until a few years ago someone showed me the salt pan method of shrinking the string.

But I didn't know it would help in removing the "too tight" lens.

Thanks!

[For-Life]

This is basic knowledge, but if the temples are too long, if you can, take off the temple tips and cut off 5 or 10mm to make them a proper length instead of wrapping them around the ears.

Also, if the temples are too short, you can take off the temple tips and solder 5mm to the end.

I am just tired of seeing new clients come in with temples too long or too short on their old pair.