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Thread: Where were you 40 years ago When President Kennedy was shot?

  1. #51
    Master OptiBoarder chm2023's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chip anderson

    End of story
    Well I guess that's it.

  2. #52
    Is it November yet? Jana Lewis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jediron1
    I agree Spexvet. Chip I worry about you. You have all that hate and vemon
    over forty years and you still have not gotten over Kennedy? This is too unbelievale! This maybe your opinion as others have pointed out, but it sure seems to be a very narrow one. Even a narrow opinion at times needs to broaden itself to a wide opinion on some topics and I believe this is one. One last thing, your facts are a little off on the boat(Pueblo) incident and others!:hammer:
    Well... Chip has admitted that he gets really angry while reading these threads you know.....
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    Quote Originally Posted by chip anderson
    End of story
    I think what Chip meant was that he's spun a nice yarn (tall tale or fish story if you prefer) and was letting us know that he'd reached the end of the story.

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    Master OptiBoarder chm2023's Avatar
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    The more things change.....

    Quote Originally Posted by chip anderson
    Never forget John Kennedy brought us Vietnam. Would have been a small short affair if he had the cahonies to demand the return of the Pueblo and back up his demands. Kruschev laughed at him for the silly way he handled that crisis.

    We would never have lost Florida to the Cubans if he had the cahonies to back up the Freedom fighters at the Bay of Pigs. He sent them off and and then was too much of a weenie to back them up. He should never have deserted those poor souls. He should not have sent them or he should have backed them up with everything we had.

    As to P.T. 109. His was the only P.T. boat lost in that way during the entire war. There are still rumors of the playboy and his crew partying so much they didn't hear/see a ship (which they could have easily out manuvered or outrun) coming.

    Kennedy was elected and would have been re-elected because he (and Jackie) were prettier than thier oponents. And they bought black votes with give away programs.

    End of story
    Mississippi state fair opens in a week; one exhibitor is the National Movement, a group with ties to the KKK; their big attraction is Edgar Killen, the "acquitted" man who is widely believed to have led the group who killed the 3 civil rights workers in Mississippi back in the 60's.

    And that's what I love about the south.......

  5. #55
    Just An Optician jediron1's Avatar
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    Smilie

    Pardon my english, but what the HE>> are you talking about CHM2023? Sounds like monkey cra*.:hammer:

  6. #56
    Master OptiBoarder Joann Raytar's Avatar
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    Group With White Supremacist Ties To Set Up Booth At State Fair
    http://www.thejacksonchannel.com/new...65/detail.html

    Plans for White Supremacist Booth at Mississippi State Fair Temporarily Halted
    http://ap.tbo.com/ap/breaking/MGB0S0UBOZD.html

  7. #57
    Master OptiBoarder chm2023's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jediron1
    Pardon my english, but what the HE>> are you talking about CHM2023? Sounds like monkey cra*.:hammer:
    I can't say I know what monkey **** sounds like, but see Jo's message above.

  8. #58
    Just An Optician jediron1's Avatar
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    chm2023. If that is what you meant by what Jo said you sure went out of your way to get there. But I see your point, I think! I just think you could have gotten your point across a little better. It did not seem to blend in with the whole topic of: where were you 40 years ago when Kennedy was shot. Thats all.:bbg:

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    Jo: The idiot running the booth at the state fair used to be a patient of mine. Is a complete fool. Used to never show up for his appointments saying later he was so busy with the campaign (for Govenor, which he ran for a lot). I would see him later giving the "speach" on T.V. with a audience of 3 supporters and five T.V. People.

    However if you want to make some quick money, come down here for the fair and sell clain robes on one side of the booth an hippie outfits on the other.

    Chip

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    Quote Originally Posted by chip anderson

    However if you want to make some quick money, come down here for the fair and sell clain robes on one side of the booth an hippie outfits on the other.
    Thanks Chip, now my keyboard is full of nose coffee.

  11. #61
    Master OptiBoarder chm2023's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jediron1
    chm2023. If that is what you meant by what Jo said you sure went out of your way to get there. But I see your point, I think! I just think you could have gotten your point across a little better. It did not seem to blend in with the whole topic of: where were you 40 years ago when Kennedy was shot. Thats all.:bbg:
    My point (obviously ill made!:p ) was that hate has a long half life, and there is a line connecting the people who reacted happily to JFK's death to the people who keep the Klan and it's ilk in business. It's all hate.

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    Never Let the Facts Get in the Way of a Good Story

    The Conspiracy Theorists have told half-truths and blatantly left out relevant information in efforts to perpetuate their agenda. If all of the rumors and innuendo are discarded, a strict study of the FACTS OF THE CASE leave no doubt that Lee Harvey Oswald was the killer. Their may have been some conspiracy to kill JFK, but the overwhelming evidence points to Oswald as the trigger man. As a former NCO in the U.S. Army, I can tell you that there is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING UNUSUAL about a target jolting backwards after being hit from behind. I don't want to get into the technicalities of ballistics, but it is true. I personally believe that there was a conspiracy, but that Oswald was either the hitman for the conspiracy team, or that he simply got to Kennedy before the conspirators did. Don't forget, there is almost always some level of a conspiracy on the part of some people somewhere to kill the President of the United States.

  13. #63
    Pomposity! Spexvet's Avatar
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    No conspiracy? Now what fun is that?
    ...Just ask me...

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    Just An Optician jediron1's Avatar
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    Spexvet said:What Difference does it make to the dead, the orphans and the homeless, whether the mad destruction is wrought under the name of totalitarianism or the holy name of liberty or democracy? Victory attained by violence is tantamount to defeat, for it is momentary. - Mahatma Gandhi

    So during WW11 we should have left Hilter in power because violence is tantatmount to defeat.
    What kind of poppy **** is this? Tell that to the 55 million that died in WW11 to keep feedom
    and democracy.:hammer:

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    Off topic

    Quote Originally Posted by jediron1
    Spexvet said:What Difference does it make to the dead, the orphans and the homeless, whether the mad destruction is wrought under the name of totalitarianism or the holy name of liberty or democracy? Victory attained by violence is tantamount to defeat, for it is momentary. - Mahatma Gandhi

    So during WW11 we should have left Hilter in power because violence is tantatmount to defeat.
    What kind of poppy **** is this? Tell that to the 55 million that died in WW11 to keep feedom
    and democracy.:hammer:
    Although I have no idea whether Gandhi perceived any difference whatsoever between the initiation of violence vs. self-defense, there is a bit of irony to be found in that you have alluded to a statistic to which his question begs an answer. Only a very small portion of that 55 million died "to keep freedom and democracy". The vast majority of them died for other causes... or just plain died.

  16. #66
    Just An Optician jediron1's Avatar
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    1968 said:Although I have no idea whether Gandhi perceived any difference whatsoever between the initiation of violence vs. self-defense, there is a bit of irony to be found in that you have alluded to a statistic to which his question begs an answer. Only a very small portion of that 55 million died "to keep freedom and democracy". The vast majority of them died for other causes... or just plain died.

    So you figure that if say 5 or 6 million (just) died fighting for freedom and democracy that it meant nothing? 5 or 6 million is still a lot of people dying and the fact that it was WAR where the primary action is to kill people and blow things up was missed. I m just pointing out that when there is war people will get killed and they will fight especially if they are fighting for freedoms. That was not mentioned in the quote and I realize it was only a quote.

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    Pomposity! Spexvet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jediron1
    Spexvet said:What Difference does it make to the dead, the orphans and the homeless, whether the mad destruction is wrought under the name of totalitarianism or the holy name of liberty or democracy? Victory attained by violence is tantamount to defeat, for it is momentary. - Mahatma Gandhi

    So during WW11 we should have left Hilter in power because violence is tantatmount to defeat.
    What kind of poppy **** is this? Tell that to the 55 million that died in WW11 to keep feedom
    and democracy.:hammer:
    Peace was, in fact momentary. US military involvement in Korea was initiated June 27, 1950.
    ...Just ask me...

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    Quote Originally Posted by jediron1
    So you figure that if say 5 or 6 million (just) died fighting for freedom and democracy that it meant nothing?
    To me, the people who fight, and who have died fighting, for freedom and democracy means a great deal. But in the quote you chose to address, Gandhi asked, “What difference does it make to the dead, the orphans and the homeless…?” For the vast majority of people who died in World War II*, the fight for freedom and democracy meant nothing.

    *The Western Allies suffered less than 1 million battle deaths in World War II, not 5 to 6 million. (There is no dispute in my mind about the worthiness of their cause, so don’t imply again that I trivialize that figure by using the term “just”.) In contrast, there were about 30 million civilian deaths in Asia and Eastern Europe and around 20 million others in the German, Japanese, and Soviet militaries.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spexvet
    Peace was, in fact momentary. US military involvement in Korea was initiated June 27, 1950.
    I know some South Koreans. They tell me that it sure beats living under Communism.

  20. #70
    Pomposity! Spexvet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1968
    I know some South Koreans. They tell me that it sure beats living under Communism.
    That's not the point. The point is that peace did not last long. The statement does not address those who are living, or those who are fighting. What dead people, orphans, or homeless have told you that it makes a difference if the mad destruction was wrought in the name of totalitarianism or the holy name of liberty or democracy? It's great that their life is better. If totalitarianism made their life better (and it can), would there be a difference to them?
    ...Just ask me...

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    Just An Optician jediron1's Avatar
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    Spexvet quoted: Victory attained by violence is tantamount to defeat, for it is momentary. - Mahatma Gandhi

    Try telling that to Alexander the Great or General Patton or General George Washington or General MaCarthur. I believe these gentlemen would have a lot to say about the above statement.
    Last edited by jediron1; 10-30-2004 at 08:00 AM.

  22. #72
    Forever Liz's Dad Steve Machol's Avatar
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    I'm curious about something. What was Ghandi's position regarding WWII? Was he against the War? Does anyone know?

    There are certainly times when non-violence is appropriate, but the fight against Hitler was not one of those times.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Spexvet
    That's not the point. The point is that peace did not last long.
    No, it was your point was that the peace did not last long, but mine was that for some “living in peace” is not synonymous with acquiescing to totalitarianism.

    Quote Originally Posted by Spexvet
    The statement does not address those who are living, or those who are fighting. What dead people, orphans, or homeless have told you that it makes a difference if the mad destruction was wrought in the name of totalitarianism or the holy name of liberty or democracy? It's great that their life is better. If totalitarianism made their life better (and it can), would there be a difference to them?
    I’ll answer you as I would answer anyone who thinks totalitarianism can better their life: If you choose to acquiesce to a totalitarian state, then I won’t stop you. If you attempt to force me to acquiesce to a totalitarian state, then I will stop you… or die trying. The concept of peace existing in a totalitarian state is an oxymoron.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Machol
    I'm curious about something. What was Ghandi's position regarding WWII? Was he against the War? Does anyone know?

    There are certainly times when non-violence is appropriate, but the fight against Hitler was not one of those times.
    Here is a quote for you:

    "I want you to fight Nazism without arms. I would like you to lay down the arms you have as being useless for saving you or humanity. You will invite Herr Hitler and Signor Mussolini to take what they want of the countries you call your possessions. Let them take possession of your beautiful island, with your many beautiful buildings. You will give all these but neither your souls, nor your minds. If these gentlemen choose to occupy your homes, you will vacate them. If they do not give you free passage out, you will allow yourself, man, woman and child, to be slaughtered, but you will refuse to owe allegiance to them"
    -Gandhi, 1940, open letter to Winston Churchill

    There are other quotes in which Gandhi states "I do not consider Hitler to be as bad as he is depicted" and "Roosevelt and Churchill are no less war criminals than Hitler and Mussolini".

  25. #75
    Forever Liz's Dad Steve Machol's Avatar
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    Well I respect Ghandi a lot, but no one is perfect and he was definitely wrong about Hitler.


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