Can Zeiss Blue Protect and Photo Fusion be used in combination?

[tachyon4]

Hello

I had recently come across these Zeiss Lenses which have both Blue Protect and Photo Fusion in them , it is mentioned that Blue Protect is meant for indoor usage only and Photo Fusion is both indoors and outdoors . I was wondering if both of them can be used in combination will it cause any vision damage or affect vision in any way since in a earlier thread there was a discussion of blue light being reflected back in to the eye from the backward light source when used outdoors and also that Photo Fusion already has UV & Blue Light protection.

Thanks

[Robert_S]

Zeiss would say yes. Some posters on here would say no (well maybe just one).

Personally I've dispensed many sets of lenses which had both Photofusion and Blue Protect.

[ThatOneGuy]

I am wearing them. Works great.

[lensgrinder]

Hello

I had recently come across these Zeiss Lenses which have both Blue Protect and Photo Fusion in them , it is mentioned that Blue Protect is meant for indoor usage only and Photo Fusion is both indoors and outdoors . I was wondering if both of them can be used in combination will it cause any vision damage or affect vision in any way since in a earlier thread there was a discussion of blue light being reflected back in to the eye from the backward light source when used outdoors and also that Photo Fusion already has UV & Blue Light protection.

Thanks

DuraVision BlueProtect is meant to reduce HEV light indoors, a PhotoFusion will do the same, however, a PhotoFusion will reduce HEV light outdoors as well. A DuraVision BlueProtect in combination with a PhotoFusion will not increase attenuation of HEV light, so it is rather pointless to put any blue protect on any variable tinting lens as the protection is the same.

[Dr. Bill Stacy]

DuraVision BlueProtect is meant to reduce HEV light indoors, a PhotoFusion will do the same, however, a PhotoFusion will reduce HEV light outdoors as well. A DuraVision BlueProtect in combination with a PhotoFusion will not increase attenuation of HEV light, so it is rather pointless to put any blue protect on any variable tinting lens as the protection is the same.

I agree with that, another example of people adding useless things to lenses. But I'd take it a step farther. Why refelect ambient UV and blue towards other people when outdoors? It's a nasty thing to do, that second hand blue... Oooh, I'm a poet. Will try that on my sig. line...



It's a nasty thing to do, that second hand blue...

[Robert_S]

I just tested a lens and the blue filter did reduce blue light more than transitions...

[Dr. Bill Stacy]

I just tested a lens and the blue filter did reduce blue light more than transitions...

Do you really mean a blue filter, or a blue reflector?

[Robert_S]

Yes a blue reflective coating (from Hoya), sorry.

[Dr. Bill Stacy]

Yes a blue reflective coating (from Hoya), sorry.

Then unless the underlying lens has very strong blue filtering built in, you will get additional blue reduction through the lens. Unfortunately, with the Recharge you will also be directing blue and UV towards people facing you (second hand blue), and are at risk of reflecting concentrated blue and UV off the back side into your own eyes. A dangerous situation unless you have huge hair or are wearing a huge hat.

[Robert_S]

I have huge hair.

[Dr. Bill Stacy]

I have huge hair.

Great, if your 'do is large enough and thick enough to block most all sunlight from behind and above you from impinging on the BACK surfaces of your lenses, you are safe. Just be kind to others and when the sun is to their backs, don't look at them through your blue reflectors. You'll be irradiating them with your dreaded second hand blue (and UV) when you are within a couple of feet from them.

[Paul Smith LDO]

Hello

I had recently come across these Zeiss Lenses which have both Blue Protect and Photo Fusion in them , it is mentioned that Blue Protect is meant for indoor usage only and Photo Fusion is both indoors and outdoors . I was wondering if both of them can be used in combination will it cause any vision damage or affect vision in any way since in a earlier thread there was a discussion of blue light being reflected back in to the eye from the backward light source when used outdoors and also that Photo Fusion already has UV & Blue Light protection.

Thanks

I am currently wearing mine. I hear no activity from the drusens advancement at this time. One if by land two if by sea.

P.S. I do have hair more gray than brown but I try to keep it trimmed, hope this helps.

[ThatOneGuy]

BlueProtect filters blue/violet light, period. Varying degrees, depending on the part of the spectrum, but it simply filters blue light.

It is not "just for indoors." The marketing machines of the big 3 have been targeting the specific concern of blue/violet light due to screens, but the concern exists beyond that (though to a lesser degree because of distance of light source).

BlueProtect works great as a full time AR because it also adds to sharpness/clarity by eliminating haze caused by the blue/violet spectrum (that the eye can't focus well). Photofusion is still a great accessory from a light control standpoint. Photofusion reduces the amount of light getting in to the eye during bright sun exposure, therefore helping to protect photoreceptors from being overwhelmed.

What is with all of the hate regarding Blue light AR? The marketing may be off point, but the effectiveness of the products is not.

[lensgrinder]

It is not "just for indoors." The marketing machines of the big 3 have been targeting the specific concern of blue/violet light due to screens, but the concern exists beyond that (though to a lesser degree because of distance of light source).

If a patient is concerned about HEV light indoors than they should be concerned when they go outdoors as well. HEV light is 33 times worse outdoors.
An HEV coating does not help you when you are outdoors like a pair of sunglasses, PhotoFusion, or any variable tinted lens.
If we(optical people) tell a patient that they are protected outdoors than this is false, well slightly false. You are more protected, but full protectection requires sunglasses, etc.
You mention the "big 3", I work for Zeiss and I am curious where we have missed the concern that you refer too.

BlueProtect works great as a full time AR because it also adds to sharpness/clarity by eliminating haze caused by the blue/violet spectrum (that the eye can't focus well). Photofusion is still a great accessory from a light control standpoint. Photofusion reduces the amount of light getting in to the eye during bright sun exposure, therefore helping to protect photoreceptors from being overwhelmed.

You are correct, placing BlueProtect on a lens will increase transmission over a non coated lens.
I am not sure about the term "accessory". If your concern is to protect the patient at all times and they insist on one pair a PhotoFusion will be the best protection. Indoors it will give equal protection(or roughly equal there are slight variations at different wavelengths and colors) when compared to BlueProtect and a PF has 6 times greater protection outdoors.

What is with all of the hate regarding Blue light AR? The marketing may be off point, but the effectiveness of the products is not.

I don't think it is hate, there is not proof that and HEV coating will reduce macular degeneration. The science is mixed as to whether it will. If you do not have proof than why add cost to something. On the other hand if it does help than why not?
IF everyone is so concerned and they want to help the patient offer a variable tinted lens that will help them all day, indoors and out.

[golfnut]

One thing I noticed is when the transitions activate the blue at looks like a flash blue mirror...

[ThatOneGuy]

If a patient is concerned about HEV light indoors than they should be concerned when they go outdoors as well. HEV light is 33 times worse outdoors.
An HEV coating does not help you when you are outdoors like a pair of sunglasses, PhotoFusion, or any variable tinted lens.
If we(optical people) tell a patient that they are protected outdoors than this is false, well slightly false. You are more protected, but full protectection requires sunglasses, etc.
You mention the "big 3", I work for Zeiss and I am curious where we have missed the concern that you refer too.

I don't know how long you've worked for Zeiss, but you may recall when Carat came out that it had a green/blue residual color (much like the new Duravision product lineup). At the time, Zeiss marketed this as advantageous, albeit more expensive to produce because of the particular consumables required, because filtering out blue light helped increase sharpness and clarity for the patient because their eye couldn't focus blue light.

The same principal applies with BlueProtect. I was not criticizing the product or use of the product in any way, but rather saying that the product still proves effective at providing better quality of vision when outdoors (such as night time driving). What you have missed in your marketing is the fact that Blue Protect is beneficial for broad reasons, not just macular degeneration.

You are correct, placing BlueProtect on a lens will increase transmission over a non coated lens.
I am not sure about the term "accessory". If your concern is to protect the patient at all times and they insist on one pair a PhotoFusion will be the best protection. Indoors it will give equal protection(or roughly equal there are slight variations at different wavelengths and colors) when compared to BlueProtect and a PF has 6 times greater protection outdoors.

The term "accessory" is to try and word my statements in a way that they are understood and accepted by people still operating in the stone age.

I don't think it is hate, there is not proof that and HEV coating will reduce macular degeneration. The science is mixed as to whether it will. If you do not have proof than why add cost to something. On the other hand if it does help than why not?
IF everyone is so concerned and they want to help the patient offer a variable tinted lens that will help them all day, indoors and out.

I agree, except where variable tint lenses create a hazard.

[lensgrinder]

I don't know how long you've worked for Zeiss, but you may recall when Carat came out that it had a green/blue residual color (much like the new Duravision product lineup). At the time, Zeiss marketed this as advantageous, albeit more expensive to produce because of the particular consumables required, because filtering out blue light helped increase sharpness and clarity for the patient because their eye couldn't focus blue light.

It was not that Carat or our DuraVision Platinum filter more blue light, it is that they have a blue reflectance(or blue green for carat) where most have a green reflectance. The peek sensitivity lies in the 550 nm range, which is the green area of the spectrum. The lowest sensitivity lies at the blue end. Because of this we have a very high transmittance which increases sharpness and clarity.

In regards to the DuraVision BlueProtect the idea is to reflect HEV light which means that less light will be transmitted, although we still have a high transmission rate for the BlueProtect.

The same principal applies with BlueProtect. I was not criticizing the product or use of the product in any way, but rather saying that the product still proves effective at providing better quality of vision when outdoors (such as night time driving). What you have missed in your marketing is the fact that Blue Protect is beneficial for broad reasons, not just macular degeneration.

I did not mean to imply that you were criticizing the product. I did not think that at all. You are correct, it does help at night to attenuate the oncoming blue head lights.
This is why we came out with our DriveSafe coating as well to help drivers at night. Along with the coating it is a different design philosophy.
Normally a lens designer will trace a single ray through a series of points on the lens to determine the amount of aberrations that need to corrected, with the Individual 2 and DriveSafe lens we use a 4.5 mm beam to perform our ray trace. This allows for overlapping of the rays which allows for better correction