Oh quite a zinger. Despite the fact that the personal attacks were supposed to subside there....Originally Posted by Chris Ryser
Must not apply to you Chris.
And it's hardly controversial when many more than myself share the sentiment. This is absolutely relevant and should be discussed as such. On the way into the office this morning, yet another story came up on NPR of just this topic.
Yet another story about graduates with four year degrees with God only knows what majors vs. a career specific two year degree. The relevance is astounding.
I listened to the same broadcast. This is from the link:
Zukin says nearly half of college graduates with full-time work are in jobs that don't require a college degree. And very few respondents say their first job will lead to a career. In fact, one-third of recent college grads say they no longer believe education combined with hard work will necessarily lead to success.
"They don't even see in the foreseeable future a secure job, a comfortable income, starting a family," he says. "And even more — 45 percent — do not see owning a home at any point in the near future."
Moreover, Zukin notes, this survey depicts the "cream of the crop" — the minority of young Americans who go to college. Unemployment is far higher among those who don't.
,,
Last edited by idispense; 07-14-2013 at 09:44 AM.
My 1969 Chevy Nova in Hot Wheel metallic green with a straight six engine is still my favorite car.
BYW...Irish Bag Pipe Person........a "master in starting controversity and probably just loves the outcome"...you are safe...that would be an agent provocateur..and there is only one of those on Optiboard......
"Coimhéad fearg fhear na foighde"
Heh. Optiboard has become the pulpit for more than a few....BYW...Irish Bag Pipe Person...I'm certainly not surprised by the judgement and rash dismissal of dissenting opinions to their own expressed by some posting here - you come to expect it really. Fish swimming against a much larger tide as opticianry marches on...and the distance between required education and the ability to dispense continues to grow, not shrink.
Enjoy a few pints this weekend if you're able - it's more than time!
Sláinte
B~
Here is where you're marching:
From a pair of mounted progressive addition lenses, 36% cannot neutralize the distance portion.
From a pair of mounted progressive addition lenses, 36% cannot the measure fitting cross height.
From a pair of mounted progressive addition lenses, 51% cannot measure the amount of prism thinning.
From a pair of mounted progressive addition lenses, 40% cannot analyze the lenses for unwanted vertical prism
From a pair of mounted bifocal lenses, 51% cannot determine the add power.
From a pair of mounted bifocal lenses, 66% cannot measure the distance between prism reference points.
From a pair of mounted bifocal lenses, 22% cannot identify the seg width.
From a pair of mounted bifocal lenses, 54% cannot analyze the lenses for unwanted vertical prism.
55% cannot calculate vertical imbalance.
41% cannot split prism for best cosmetic effect.
22% cannot transpose a prescription.
,,
Last edited by idispense; 07-14-2013 at 09:42 AM.
Scary numbers, I would have thought though that the 22% transpose numbers would have been higher relative to the others. The 22% who cant identify a seg width might be the scariest number of all.
Cannot split prism for best cosmetic effect=can't divide by 2.
Scary indeed.
What's scarier is that these results are from practical exams given in licensing states. These "apprentices" are failing because apprenticeship is largely a joke.
Wesley S. Scott, MBA, MIS, ABOM, NCLE-AC, LDO - SC & GA
“As our circle of knowledge expands, so does the circumference of darkness surrounding it.” -Albert Einstein
Confirmation that state by state licensure is not effective in developing consistent dispensing opticians either. Could be one reason licensed states are on the decline today.
On the decline?
You've said that before. What do you mean by that?
Wesley S. Scott, MBA, MIS, ABOM, NCLE-AC, LDO - SC & GA
“As our circle of knowledge expands, so does the circumference of darkness surrounding it.” -Albert Einstein
I'm interested in that statement as well. It may be stagnent, but not declining as far as I know.
.... FedEx CEO Fred Smith on ... everythingYou mentioned earlier that investing in education is another key to creating more American jobs.
I personally think that the federal government -- and you're talking to a liberal arts major here -- should restrict its funding of higher-education grants and loans to science, math, and engineering because that's where most of the value added comes. We put so much emphasis on "college degrees." Well, in Germany students at some point come to a fork in the road, and they either go on to university or they go on to a trade school. Say you're a FedEx airplane mechanic working on one of our Boeing Triple Sevens. That's a $100,000-plus job. You don't have to have a college degree to get that job. You don't have to know Chaucer and The Canterbury Tales. You can go right to West Memphis, Ark., where we have a relationship with the community college, and be trained to be a licensed mechanic. Then you can come to work at FedEx.
http://management.fortune.cnn.com/20...ex-fred-smith/
Related but not I'm not quite sure how. How come I see so many Phd.s and MS.s that tell me they are willing to take almost any job for any amount and say they can't find one because they are "overqualified." Is there some reason someone with a doctorate can't bag groceries?
Chip
problem is, the employer must train anyone to their system, their way of doing business, even a Pin Head Dope. This training takes time, money and energy. Problem is, once economy picks up, Phd is gone, employer is left holding the bag, and training process must start all over again. Heck, even the hiring process is a huge time consumer. No one wants to go thru all this twice.
saw in the Naples News an obituary .............................
Hey Chip...............................saw in the Naples News an obituary with picture of an old guy i remember seeing bagging food at a Publix Supermarket i shop. for the last few years. He had a PHD and was living in a multi million dollar house on the beach of the Gulf of Mexico.
My dental hygienist has a 4-year degree in her field. The well-paid paralegals also have 4-year degrees. And perhaps it takes a 4-year degree to get to the end of the linked article which would appear to repudiate your hypothesis.
1. Not required - though good on them.
2. Again - not required.
3. Despite your blatant attempt at yet another personal attack, the Georgetown report highlights a number of interesting failings of higher ed. Mayor Emanuel's solution might just work for opticianry as well.
Some interesting numbers found as well: "More college graduates doesn't automatically translate into an improved economy. The German economy is doing well; even though their graduation rate is only half of America’s rate. Only 15.4% of Germans aged 25 to 64 are university graduates compared to 30.9% of Americans. Canada’s economy is also doing well; but it also lags behind with a 24.6% completion rate."
I don't suppose you read any of the comments on the article. They are pertinent as well. Trying to get a job in those fields without the proper education and in almost every instance without professional certifications is nearly impossible. Here's my challenge to you: Apply for one of those jobs and let us know how far you get in the process and what your starting salary will be.
The comments are ALWAYS better than the articles!
Ophthalmic Optician, Society to Advance Opticianry
Indeed!
You may want to re-read them yourself actually. I further suggest you re-read the information posted above and take some time to ponder why higher education clearly isn't the only answer every time.
We’ll simply have to agree to disagree on the value of higher education. I believe strongly that education is the foundation of a productive economy. Certainly the lack of or denial of education has been and will always be the tool used to deny the basic rights of any group of people. We have only to look at our own past. I remember “separate but equal”. I’ll hazard a guess that you are not old enough to appreciate the hard won right to a decent education.
As regards the profession of Opticianry, the lack of post-secondary education has worked to keep Opticians at the bottom of the ophthalmic food chain. Certainly, there are exceptions to this fate, but they are just that, exceptions rather than the rule. Opticians will continue to occupy the bottom floor in the optical community as long as they allow other professionals to define who they are and the limits of their scope of practice. After a long and proud history, Opticians have ceded their professional position to others who have had the foresight and commitment to further their own educational and legislative agendas. I challenge any one to identify a profession whose majority so proudly boasts of their lack of education and their disdain for professional regulation.
The writer of the original Huffington Post article, the one that started this lengthy and often ridiculous thread, is himself a college graduate and has a job that we could assume is fairly well-paying. His advice then is disingenuous. College degrees may not guarantee employment, but they will open doors to opportunities that the lack of said degrees cannot.
True professionals appreciate and will reward education, perhaps not with the overblown salaries of the recent past, but certainly at a consistently higher level than a simple high school diploma will demand.
Ask yourself, is the voice that tells you that your college degree has no value, giving you good advice or protecting his or her own position at your expense?
Peace out!
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