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Thread: Attention Opticians: Please stop blaming organizations for our failings.

  1. #176
    Ophthalmic Optician
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roy R. Ferguson View Post
    We recently analyzed two years of practical exam results for dispensing opticians.

    64% could not measure the distance between horizontal prism reference points.
    60% could not calculate vertical imbalance in an eyeglass prescription.
    57% could not determine which lens to slab-off.
    53% could not measure prism thinning in a progressive lens.
    50% could not determine the add power for a visible bifocal.
    t

    Yeah, yeah...whatever.

    The important question is, "Can you combine the Buy One Get One Free with insurance?"

  2. #177
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter Barry Santini's Avatar
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    Roy:

    Determining the add for a visible bifocal is not nearly as useful a skill as knowing whether the add needs to be adjusted up or down 0.25D for patient comfort, acuity and utility.

    B

  3. #178
    Rising Star
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    I agree. Now, where can I locate that in an opticianry text or ANSI standards? Subject skills are necessary, but how do you measure them? The items I listed are from an opticianry licensing test.

  4. #179
    OptiWizard anthonyf1509's Avatar
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    What I don't understand in all the back and forth is:
    More education and more knowledge DOES guarantee more money (if you're not a moron).
    Maybe not at your exact location and job but it opens more doors you just have to do the leg work. You can't just get xyz degree, license, certification, etc. and say "here, now where's my raise?!"
    But, you can find a way to use your more knowledge to get more somewhere.
    So I guess I'm asking why is it even an argument?

  5. #180
    bilateral peripheral scotoma LandLord's Avatar
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    Ontario opticians complete either a 2-year or 4-year program followed by an internship before they can apply to be licensed. Exams are comprehensive and challenging. To maintain the license requires 30 con ed credits every 3 year cycle. There are not likely many higher standards anywhere in the world for opticianry. Yet opticians here make about $20/hour give or take. Not exactly conclusive proof that education and knowledge make for a richer optician.
    Sent from my BlackBerry® wireless device

  6. #181
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    Quote Originally Posted by LandLord View Post
    The education debate never ends.

    To all the pro-education opticians:

    What I don't understand is why do you need everyone else to get educated if they don't want to?

    Let's be realistic. Even IF you could convince all American opticians to get a degree (fat chance).
    THEN you have to convince all states to regulate opticians (fatter chance).
    THEN you have to convince the government to restrict the sale of eyeglasses to licensed opticians only (obese chance).
    THEN you have to get all the online retailers to close down (hahahaha).
    IF you can achieve all of the above then yes, you will make more money.

    Guess what. There is an easier way... go to optometry school !!!!!!!!!!!
    Actually, we are judged as field by our least effective or most incompetent person who calls themselves an "Optician". I walked into a practice in California, and the "Optician" didn't even know what a PD stick was, she referred me to the bathroom! When I asked her how she measures lenses, she said she puts "dots" on them, and the Dr. does the rest!

    This person is sending a message to every patient she interacts with that all opticians are as incompetent as her. It lowers our entire field. For the same reason franchises require cleanliness standards (you walk into one dirty McDonalds, you could begin to avoid all McDonalds, assuming they are the same) we need to require competency standards.

  7. #182
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darryl Meister View Post
    If you could really care less about the profession of opticianry, and are just in this to make a quick buck, I can assure you that there are far more lucrative sales industries out there.

    Best regards,
    Darryl
    Hmmm, maybe like writing technical articles and white papers for a big name lens company? Consulting? Writing for trade magazines? Running an optical education website? Teaching opticianry?

    Darryl, you are not an "optician" any more than I am.

    I appreciate your passion but I do so wish you could see through to the core of what I am trying to say.

    As to the, "why don't you go somewhere else" folks - I have www.opticianworks.com where I teach that opticianry is a BUSINESS profession not a medical profession! There is no shame in that...

  8. #183
    OptiWizard
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    Love the arguments, but these have all been posed before. The one thing this thread is demonstrating, in my opinion, is the disconnect between peoples positions within the same field. Higher educational standards? You can hold a cd up to your head and order glases online. Don't care about standards? God help you when you get a complaint. Could it be the lack of organization and a unified message that handicaps us all?

  9. #184
    Forever Liz's Dad Steve Machol's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John@OWDC View Post
    Hmmm, maybe like writing technical articles and white papers for a big name lens company? Consulting? Writing for trade magazines? Running an optical education website? Teaching opticianry?

    Darryl, you are not an "optician" any more than I am.

    I appreciate your passion but I do so wish you could see through to the core of what I am trying to say.

    As to the, "why don't you go somewhere else" folks - I have www.opticianworks.com where I teach that opticianry is a BUSINESS profession not a medical profession! There is no shame in that...
    Just wondering if it's possible for you to express a difference of opinion without diminishing someone else? Your comments about Darryl being an 'optician' actually weaken the point you are trying to make.

    Personally I don't see any problem with viewing this as both a business profession AND a health related one. After all, Doctors are usually business people too.


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  10. #185
    Eyes eastward... Uilleann's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason H View Post
    ...Could it be the lack of organization and a unified message that handicaps us all?
    Hit square on the head. And one of the biggest reasons we SHOULD blame the do-nothing-but-take-your-money organizations. And hence this entire calamity of a thread was born.

    Pass the popcorn.

  11. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Machol View Post
    Your comments about Darryl being an 'optician' actually weaken the point you are trying to make.

    Personally I don't see any problem with viewing this as both a business profession AND a health related one. After all, Doctors are usually business people too.
    I agree on both points.

    A surgeon that moves on to a teach med students is still considered to be a doctor. Just because you don't carry a pd stick all day (although Darryl might) does not make you less of an optician. That is pure nonsense.

    Secondly, ALL professions are business professions, but if you don't know your trade, inside and out, the business side will suffer.

    Healthcare? Fashion? Business? Much more? Yes.

  12. #187
    Master OptiBoarder Darryl Meister's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John@OWDC
    Hmmm, maybe like writing technical articles and white papers for a big name lens company? Consulting? Writing for trade magazines? Running an optical education website? Teaching opticianry... Darryl, you are not an "optician" any more than I am.
    If your point is that I don't even get paid to be an optician, yet still continue to do my best to advance the profession of opticianry, then I'm afraid that I really don't understand your point.

    As far as the distinction between profitability and professionalism, I am encouraging the elevation of the entire profession, which would also naturally result in higher median wages for all opticians, not just the relatively small number of opticians who actually run their own dispensary. Not that I have anything against making profit.

    Best regards,
    Darryl
    Darryl J. Meister, ABOM

  13. #188
    ABOM Wes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darryl Meister View Post
    If your point is that I don't even get paid to be an optician, yet still continue to do my best to advance the profession of opticianry, then I'm afraid that I really don't understand your point.

    As far as the distinction between profitability and professionalism, I am encouraging the elevation of the entire profession, which would also naturally result in higher median wages for all opticians, not just the relatively small number of opticians who actually run their own dispensary. Not that I have anything against making profit.

    Best regards,
    Darryl
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  14. #189
    OptiWizard
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    I visit optiboard less and less these days. Between the peacocks and the infighting it gets difficult to click the link. There are some brilliant optical minds here,(certanly smarter than myself) but they can't see the forest because the trees are in the way. Forgive me for the brashness and I mean to insult no one. But this thread is a clinic on how our profession needs no enemies - we are quite content to fight amongst ourselves.

  15. #190
    Master OptiBoarder MakeOptics's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darryl Meister View Post
    If your point is that I don't even get paid to be an optician, yet still continue to do my best to advance the profession of opticianry, then I'm afraid that I really don't understand your point.

    As far as the distinction between profitability and professionalism, I am encouraging the elevation of the entire profession, which would also naturally result in higher median wages for all opticians, not just the relatively small number of opticians who actually run their own dispensary. Not that I have anything against making profit.

    Best regards,
    Darryl
    Darryl,

    Respect the hell out of you and admire your many many accomplishments, but your really not an optician. That's not an insult, it's actually the other way around. It diminishes the profession when every sales rep, every frame rep, every lens rep, and every PD jockey calls themselves an optician. In your case I consider you much more than the rag tag group I have described, but all the same you're not an optician.

    I would like to call you a different kind of optician but until that distinction exists I think you diminish your worth and the worth of the profession with that title. My reasoning is that you are providing your value to the lower life forms called opticians while you gain nothing in return, hence the reason for no educational movement in the industry, currently you can wear the title optician without having to do anything while great minds (Darryl, yourself included) also call themselves an optician while working hard to further their pursuit of knowledge. The disparity widens when we consider the number of ancillary professions that seem to want to call themselves opticians.

    Here is your new title (Ophthalmic Engineer).

  16. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by MakeOptics View Post
    Darryl,

    Respect the hell out of you and admire your many many accomplishments, but your really not an optician. That's not an insult, it's actually the other way around. It diminishes the profession when every sales rep, every frame rep, every lens rep, and every PD jockey calls themselves an optician. In your case I consider you much more than the rag tag group I have described, but all the same you're not an optician.

    I would like to call you a different kind of optician but until that distinction exists I think you diminish your worth and the worth of the profession with that title. My reasoning is that you are providing your value to the lower life forms called opticians while you gain nothing in return, hence the reason for no educational movement in the industry, currently you can wear the title optician without having to do anything while great minds (Darryl, yourself included) also call themselves an optician while working hard to further their pursuit of knowledge. The disparity widens when we consider the number of ancillary professions that seem to want to call themselves opticians.

    Here is your new title (Ophthalmic Engineer).
    Ah, at least someone gets my point...

  17. #192
    Master OptiBoarder Darryl Meister's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MakeOptics
    Respect the hell out of you and admire your many many accomplishments, but your really not an optician... That's not an insult, it's actually the other way around.
    I don't really take it as an insult. My last point was only that, whether or not I call myself an optician, I am very concerned about the state of the profession of opticianry. And I would like very much to see the status of the profession improved.

    Best regards,
    Darryl
    Darryl J. Meister, ABOM

  18. #193
    Master OptiBoarder MakeOptics's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darryl Meister View Post
    I don't really take it as an insult. My last point was only that, whether or not I call myself an optician, I am very concerned about the state of the profession of opticianry. And I would like very much to see the status of the profession improved.

    Best regards,
    Darryl
    Agree with that statement 100%, I hope and feel as though John does too. Just different approaches I guess, either way I enjoy your opinion and enjoy John's opinion as well.

  19. #194
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Gold Supporter Judy Canty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John@OWDC View Post
    Hmmm, maybe like writing technical articles and white papers for a big name lens company? Consulting? Writing for trade magazines? Running an optical education website? Teaching opticianry?

    Darryl, you are not an "optician" any more than I am.
    I appreciate your passion but I do so wish you could see through to the core of what I am trying to say.

    As to the, "why don't you go somewhere else" folks - I have www.opticianworks.com where I teach that opticianry is a BUSINESS profession not a medical profession! There is no shame in that...
    The arrogance in this thread is mind-boggling.

    John Seegers


    John has been a licensed Optician for over eighteen years and he has been with Ryan Vision for over eight years.

    John has a MEd. degree from Virginia Commonwealth University. John has taught opticianry for J Seargeant Reynolds Community College, is a frequent contributor to optical trade magazines and owns the website www.OpticianWorks.com.

  20. #195
    Master OptiBoarder MakeOptics's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John@OWDC View Post
    Ah, at least someone gets my point...
    Very much so and I agree, the approach of a medical based profession has not worked out well, a business approach can help the current and future optician acquire the skills that are valued by our clients the ones we serve and service.

  21. #196
    Master OptiBoarder MakeOptics's Avatar
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    Darryl,

    I used this as my qualifier: http://www.onetonline.org/link/summary/29-2081.00 I am sure you are familiar with o*net, and my reference to Ophthalmic Engineer: http://www.onetonline.org/link/summary/17-2199.07. Unfortuantely you don't do any of the things that an optician does, I think it would be more accurate to say you were an optician, but again I see you as much more and did not mean to be arrogant towards you please accept my apology for the misunderstanding.

  22. #197
    Master OptiBoarder Darryl Meister's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MakeOptics
    I see you as much more and did not mean to be arrogant towards you please accept my apology for the misunderstanding
    No worries, I took no offense.

    Best regards,
    Darryl
    Darryl J. Meister, ABOM

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