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Thread: Can you give me my PD?

  1. #26
    Master OptiBoarder
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    Attn: Opti-board "old-dogs". Due to new members, such as myself, there will be a few tired topics to your eyesbut please be gentle to the ones who are enjoying the new (to them) topic. Maybe just IGNORE all these loathesome posts that you are clearly OVER.
    Having a pleasant atmosphere here will only serve to gain more memberships.

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Wagner View Post

    Thought some of you may want to read someones office policy on this matter.




    CAN YOU GIVE ME MY PD?
    There are a number of facial measurements that are required to purchase properly fitting glasses. Some of them include the DBL, the temple length, the vertex distance, seg height, monocular PD of the major reference point for each eye, as well as the interpupillary distance (PD). Measuring a PD is not part of an eye exam and this measurement has not been made by the Doctor during the course of the eye exam. It is not part of his/her prescription.


    All of the above facial measurements are determined at the time of purchasing glasses by the seller of those glasses. In many cases, these measurements are unique to the frame size and style, type of bifocal, and differing facial asymmetries including dissimilar monocular pupillary distances. Each provider of eye glasses is responsible for accurately making these facial measurements in the process of fabricating the glasses that are to be purchased. Different providers arrive at different facial measurement numbers, and often can measure different pupillary distances for the same person using different measurement techniques. Since each eyeglass provider is responsible for the final outcome of the eyewear in meeting the visual needs of the individual patient, if any error is made in determining any of the above facial measurements, the provider of the glasses is responsible for correcting the error.


    Insuring that these measurements are actually properly incorporated into the final fabricated glasses and aligned properly to the wearers face are integral components to the patient’s final satisfaction. We do not provide these services for glasses purchased elsewhere. We also do not troubleshoot facial measurement problems or alignment problems with the hardware of glasses purchased elsewhere, but we do service glasses purchased from us for the lifetime of the glasses.


    Consequently, any facial measurements taken by our opticians during the purchase of glasses here remain our proprietary information. This information is not for release to the public or other eyeglass providers. Other providers are required to take their own measurements and ultimately be responsible for the accuracy of any glasses they fabricate based on their unique measurements and their final verification and alignment.


    +1
    I wouldn't change/delete a word... just bBlow it up and frame it as is.

  3. #28
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    Wes. nobody expects service for free. but if I walked into an optical shop, with sphere, cylinder and axis, in hand. and I said that I want that pair of glasses, and I also said I wanted my PD. and was told 'no'. I would walk, as would most people.

  4. #29
    ABOM Wes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by trifoil View Post
    Wes. nobody expects service for free. but if I walked into an optical shop, with sphere, cylinder and axis, in hand. and I said that I want that pair of glasses, and I also said I wanted my PD. and was told 'no'. I would walk, as would most people.
    Many people DO expect service for free. A good many people seem to feel entitled to GLASSES for free. They expect free cleaning, adjustments, nosepads and repairs on glasses bought elsewhere. Cleaning and adjustments I don't mind, as it gives me time to talk to the patient and make him comfortable with my skills. We charge for nosepads and repairs on glasses bought elsewhere.

    I dont know what to make of the second part of that statement. You seem to be insinuating that happens often and that I regularly run these folks off. I am not incapable of nuance, or reading intentions, thank you.
    If your statement is true based on observations you've made in Texas, I'm moving to Texas.
    Wesley S. Scott, MBA, MIS, ABOM, NCLE-AC, LDO - SC & GA

    “As our circle of knowledge expands, so does the circumference of darkness surrounding it.” -Albert Einstein

  5. #30
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Gold Supporter Judy Canty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SeaU2020 View Post
    Attn: Opti-board "old-dogs". Due to new members, such as myself, there will be a few tired topics to your eyesbut please be gentle to the ones who are enjoying the new (to them) topic. Maybe just IGNORE all these loathesome posts that you are clearly OVER.
    Having a pleasant atmosphere here will only serve to gain more memberships.
    The "Search" function works well and might save some time and eliminate snark-iness.

  6. #31
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    I think we have a problem, as a profession, and that a collective of smart thinkers can solve it now.

    I think part of the problem is that we have been selling our optical services bundled with fees for products, and behaving as if the services are freely given. Patients have been trained to expect free services. When patients buy eye wear online, they are pleased with the lower price and continue to expect our fitting and dispensing services for free.

    And don’t forget this is not true in all cases. How many times has an out of town visitor asked for help, which we gave for free, and they sincerely wanted to pay us? Good, decent people understand paying for professional services.

    Now is the time to calculate what we need to charge for unbundled optical services to at least tread water. Define our services. Calculate what we need to charge. Then begin the trial and error process of developing persuasive patient education strategies - so that those who need optical services will pay for optical services. AND we must deliver service that is worth every penny!

    Robert Wagner has generously shared a policy for discussion.

    I have two strategies to share. The first is a free (downloadable) Spreadsheet Calculator you can use to Unbundle Optical Service Fees. http://www.practicemanagementdepot.c...Calculator.php Be warned, it opens as a web page with a video explaining how to use it.

    The second is a modifiable draft of a Limited Dispensing Service Agreement. (see Attachments)
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Let’s continue to share strategies. I’m thinking of optical service packages. The unbundled limited fitting service is on the front end, what Robert Wagner addressed. I’m sharing a limited dispensing service - when patients ask for free adjustments or come in complaining that they don’t see right with their eye wear purchased from a competitor. Use service opportunities to increase sales, teach the value of optician services - charge for the services patients do need - and win new patients for your business.
    Renee Kathleen Jacobs O.D., M.A.
    Director Practice Management Depot
    www.PracticeManagementDepot.com

  7. #32
    ABOM Wes's Avatar
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    Thanks, Dr. Jacobs. Unbundling is where it's at!
    http://www.ecpmag.com/1webmagazine/2...n-bundling.asp
    Wesley S. Scott, MBA, MIS, ABOM, NCLE-AC, LDO - SC & GA

    “As our circle of knowledge expands, so does the circumference of darkness surrounding it.” -Albert Einstein

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Santini View Post
    I really whoeeartedly disagree with this. The best way, IMHO, to help clients see that your eyewear is more than an Rx and a PD is to let them experience it for themselves, firsthand.

    Give 'em their freakin' PD already. What are you afraid of?

    B
    I don't disagree wholeheartedly, however, during a VEE panel discussion Mark Johnson, Director of Optical Services at Viginia Eye Institue, shared that he had investigated the legality of withholding a PD. In some states it is legal. In other states it is not legal. I'm not sure how one researches that kind of thing. Certainly though, legality is something to consider.
    Renee Kathleen Jacobs O.D., M.A.
    Director Practice Management Depot
    www.PracticeManagementDepot.com

  9. #34
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    Wow Wes THANK YOU!

    Wes, thank you for this! Judy Canty ABO/NCLE and I were thinking exactly the same thing at about the same time. I posted exactly the calculator she describes, on the PMD website, 2 days before I left for Vision Expo East.

    I tried to find Judy Canty's contact details using Google - and saw lots of publications but not a way to send her an email. Will someone ask her to request an E Newsletter from the Practice Management Depot website. I have her calculator plus support resources to help an office accomplish exactly what she describes, and now I'd like to meet her.

    Cheers,
    Renee Kathleen Jacobs O.D., M.A.
    Director Practice Management Depot
    www.PracticeManagementDepot.com

  10. #35
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Gold Supporter Judy Canty's Avatar
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    I'll let her know.

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by trifoil View Post
    there is a reason that patients think they are entitled to a PD after they are refracted. They are paying for a service. Their PD measurement has already been taken as that is part of adjusting a phoropter.
    So not true.

  12. #37
    What's up? drk's Avatar
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    http://www.ecpmag.com/1webmagazine/2...ns-pricing.asp

    Don't forget about this bum's article!

  13. #38
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    Thanks Curious Cat

    Judy found me. Thank You for making that connection happen!
    Renee Kathleen Jacobs O.D., M.A.
    Director Practice Management Depot
    www.PracticeManagementDepot.com

  14. #39
    Manuf. Lens Surface Treatments
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    Blue Jumper Would you mind to give us some clarification ?.......................

    Quote Originally Posted by drk View Post

    Obviously this bum is a confrere of yours. As you call him a bum you must be in disagreement with Dr.Jeffrie Kiener OD. The pricing practise described in the article has been used by many optometrists over the years.

    Would you mind to give us some clarification ?

  15. #40
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter Barry Santini's Avatar
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    One and the same, Chris.

    B

  16. #41
    Manuf. Lens Surface Treatments
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    Thanks Barry, I actually thought so too...............just wanted him to come up with an excuse.

  17. #42
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    Let me draw an analogy. I go to my MD to get treated for my ailment. My Dr. gives me prescription. Does it make any sense for the Dr. to withhold key information that is needed to get my prescription filled?? If a patient goes to an OD to get an eyewear prescription, they should get the information they need on the prescription such that they can go out and get their prescription filled. Now if the Dr. wants to suggest they go to the optician in the front of the store to get fitted that is fine. Educate the consumer and let them make their own choice.

    Another analogy to a medical prescription. I can go to a local pharmacy and get my prescription filled and pay more for the convenience of getting the medication in person and having the opportunity to ask a question of the pharmacist or I can save a few bucks and buy it online but lose the personal touch. That is my decision as the consumer. And there are many, many other analogies you can make due to the option that purchasing over the internet has created.

    This is a touchy subject as we are talking about the livelihood of opticians. I can certainly understand the feelings the opticians have regarding people walking out to buy elsewhere. However, I just do not think that attempting to obstruct customers from making their own decision is an effective long-term strategy.

  18. #43
    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Silver Supporter Java99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stan Tabor View Post
    Let me draw an analogy. I go to my MD to get treated for my ailment. My Dr. gives me prescription. Does it make any sense for the Dr. to withhold key information that is needed to get my prescription filled?? If a patient goes to an OD to get an eyewear prescription, they should get the information they need on the prescription such that they can go out and get their prescription filled. Now if the Dr. wants to suggest they go to the optician in the front of the store to get fitted that is fine. Educate the consumer and let them make their own choice.

    Another analogy to a medical prescription. I can go to a local pharmacy and get my prescription filled and pay more for the convenience of getting the medication in person and having the opportunity to ask a question of the pharmacist or I can save a few bucks and buy it online but lose the personal touch. That is my decision as the consumer. And there are many, many other analogies you can make due to the option that purchasing over the internet has created.

    This is a touchy subject as we are talking about the livelihood of opticians. I can certainly understand the feelings the opticians have regarding people walking out to buy elsewhere. However, I just do not think that attempting to obstruct customers from making their own decision is an effective long-term strategy.
    The pharmacist does not play a role in selecting any info on the finished product. He fill as written. Opticians most of the time determine lens style. Not an apples to apples analogy, but close.

    And while this is probably not relevant, it should be said that most ODs are not lens experts. Opticians, from a dispensing POV, are.

  19. #44
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    Medical files are the doctors and optical file are not in medical files. If the optician owns the optical shop those files are the optician and not medical. So the fight with hippa and lawyers on pd and seg ht owener is the optician.
    Donald D Price

    Ophthalmic Optician, Society to Advance Opticianry

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