Has anyone ever had a patient or customer have any kind of emergency while in the office?
Mabe a bad fall or seizure or stroke. Something of that nature. If so, what happened and how did the staff handle the situation.
Is it best not to help because of liability issues?
Thanks.
Our staff are all CPR certified... so we are covered there.
Once had a man pass out in the exam room chair during his exam. When he came around we gave him some water and called 911.
Jana Lewis
ABOC , NCLE
A fine quotation is a diamond on the finger of a man of wit, and a pebble in the hand of a fool.
Joseph Roux
The fact that this question has to be asked indicates that there is something severly wrong in our society.Originally Posted by gogetter
There are rules. Knowing those are easy. There are exceptions to the rules. Knowing those are easy. Knowing when to use them is slightly less easy. There are exceptions to the exceptions. Knowing those is a little more tricky, and know when to use those is even more so. Our industry is FULL of all of the above.
That's a pretty rough exam you give there.
I'm Andrew Hamm and I approve this message.
unfortunately true, however, it is still a question that has to be asked.
its my understanding that if someone, for example, were to require on the spot treatment like CPR or a defibrillator and you or your dr. administer the procedure and the person dies, its possible to have a law suite on your hands. its sad but its true.
Last edited by gogetter; 12-17-2010 at 02:41 PM.
:shiner: "I said!! 1 OR 2"!!!!
DragonlensmanWV N.A.O.L.
"There is nothing patriotic about hating your government or pretending you can hate your government but love your country."
"... However, if the victim is conscious and can respond, a person should ask their permission to help them first.
Some states offer immunity to good samaritans, but sometimes negligence could result in a claim of negligent care if the injuries or illness were made worse by the volunteer's negligence..."
so basically if the person dies then its your word against someone elses weather you "ASKED" them or not. It seems in a case where the worst happens (death) you could possibly have lots of trouble on your hands when all you wanted to do was help.
It seems this alone can influence someone not to get involved. I know the last thing i needs is legal troubles that could potentially cost a fortune. Sad but true.
Just drag 'em outside and shrug.
DragonlensmanWV N.A.O.L.
"There is nothing patriotic about hating your government or pretending you can hate your government but love your country."
My great aunt (82) had a stroke while at her ophthamalogist (in the middle of the exam) about 6 months ago. The doc watched as her pupil blew and hit the emergency button. Receptionist called 911, ambulance was there in less than 3 minutes, in the ER in 5, and they had her on blood thinners in another 5. She recovered almost completely with only minor aphasia (memory loss).
wow! so within approx 13 min of the stroke she was in the ER and being treated. thats fast medical attention. and good to hear shes recovering well.
it seems in this case the solution was simply to call 911 and let the medical responders do their thing with out any office intervention.
You know, we have a Duty to Warn, you'd think we'd have a Duty to Help as well....
If it's a choice between getting into legal trouble for helping and getting into legal trouble for failing to help, I'm going to help. For me it goes beyond "legal" into the simple realm of what's "right."
There are rules. Knowing those are easy. There are exceptions to the rules. Knowing those are easy. Knowing when to use them is slightly less easy. There are exceptions to the exceptions. Knowing those is a little more tricky, and know when to use those is even more so. Our industry is FULL of all of the above.
Well there's not exactly anything you can do for a stroke outside of the ER.... unless you want to risk giving anti-coagulants to someone that may be having a hemorrhagic stroke..:finger:
...and last year, I rushed my dad to the hospital (about 5 miles away) with a heart attack - fortunately not a massive one. I wanted to call 911, but he insisted on being driven over.
When I was about 20, my family was eating out and an older man suddenly stood up and keeled over. Our first thought was that he was choking - he was turning blue - but it was a heart attack. Everyone but me and dad just turned and looked to see what happened. Dad and I got up and administered CPR, but unfortunately when the paramedics got there, he'd passed. I was pretty messed up about it and I've since gotten first aid and CPR training. I'm not up to first responder level by any means, but I can help. I do a lot of driving and ALWAYS stop to help someone who appears to be in distress. I've been first or second on the scene of car accidents and I believe the assistance I've rendered has saved the lives of more than one person. I'd far rather stand up in court, holding my head up high and say "I did my best" than keep on walking/driving. My conscience would not allow me to sleep at night.
Never have had an emergency involving a patient but we have with a staff member. The receptionist called 911 while I made the person comfortable. If needed I would have administered first aid or CPR. I would do the same for a patient. What should we do stand around and wring our hands while the person expires? I'd take a chance on saving a life and worry about litigation later.
The Commonwealth of Massachusetts will allow one hour of CE credit for a CPR certification. It is a worthwhile thing to know and even if it is only used once to save a life, will be worth the effort of taking the course.
"Always laugh when you can. It is a cheap medicine"
Lord Byron
Take a photo tour of Cape Cod and the Islands!
www.capecodphotoalbum.com
I learned many years ago to carry Nytro in my pocket, and have not been without it for one day. I was told by a doctor that even if I would not use it, it could help save lifes of others.
I am right now recuperating from a six hour double by-pass venture with valve replacements, so I fully qualify to tell anybody how one feels after being let go home by the hospital.
If there is an AED (Auto-ext-defib) unit, and you use it, and the person still dies, you are NOT at fault. Same thing if you administer CPR when there is nobody else or nobody else who is qualified around and the person clearly needs it. Even if you are not qualified. If you try when there is no better option (112 or 911 has been called, you are waiting, person is choking) and the person dies even directly because of your actions, you are not at fault. The only real laws I approve of in these United-States-of-Retards.
Learn good samaritan laws. Do not let a person die because of the mob mentality of apathy. It has happened too often.
From the american heart assocation website
Don’t be afraid. Your actions can only help. http://handsonlycpr.org/
[QUOTE=gogetter;373997
Is it best not to help because of liability issues?
Thanks.[/QUOTE]
You want a lawsuit? Just leave me there on the floor.
Just so I'm clear on your stance....1) You would be so ticked that I saved you, that you'd sue?2) You would be so ticked that you croaked, that you would sue?
About 10 yrs ago, after removing a cl for an 88 yr old aphakic pt, we were chatting while I cleaned the lens. While my back was turned he stopped talking mid-sentence, not a sound. I said "continue, I'm listening"...nothing.....turned to look at him, mouth open, eyes closed. It was as if his plug had been pulled.....his heart just stopped with no warning. Called 911, stuck my head out the door, told the assistant to get the boss STAT, then run upstairs to the cardiologist's & bring her back. My young MD boss came running in, told him no pulse, he said "oh s%$t! We pulled him to the floor, started cpr, other MD came, fire dept also within 5 mins. As a medical office we get rapid response. They worked on him for about 10 mins, took him out with cardiologist astride him, ER is 2 blocks away.
He was in a coma for about 2 mos, then spontaneously emerged, no memory of the event. He lived another 10 yrs in good health, confounding his doctors, no cause found for the original heart stoppage. It aged me some, he & I joked about it over the years.
Not help someone? NEVER!!
WE SEE THINGS NOT AS THEY ARE, BUT AS WE ARE..... Anais Nin
Basically you are protected as long as you are not negligent. Their was a recent Reader's Digest article I believe talking about this. A girl had sued her (former) friend for her injuries after an auto accident. The crux was her friend moved her from the vehicle even after others told her that with a potential head/neck injury she was best left where she was. The friend stated she smelled gas and thought the car might catch fire. Been going back and forth in the courts for some time.
When I was in Washington state you had to have a basic first aid kit and someone certified in CPR on staff/in store at all times. Here in Indy it is a bit more relaxed, but still I have and will continue to lend aid. If you can't get help while in an office of the medical/health community.. where can you expect to get it?
"Some believe in destiny, and some believe in fate. But I believe that happiness is something we create."-Something More by Sugarland
I would rather stand before God and know I'd done the right thing, rather than stand before ANY eartly jury and say, "
I didn't want to get sued.".
I help all the time, and will continue to do so. I will not turn my back on an emergency. When did this world get so messed up, that we worry about helping our fellow man?
Diane
Anything worth doing is worth doing well.
I am a certified EMT and live across the street. I have been called in due to emergencies before. They always call 911 as well, but when I can just book it over and get stuff started, the pt is better off. Honestly, we've generated quite a few extra patients because of this. There really is no liability issue, and honestly, if I am in the office, I am somewhat legally obligated to render aid.
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