Frame manufacturers and online retailing

[drk]

One reason (dumb) ODs find online optical affiliation attractive is that they can have a larger "virtual inventory".

Let's say Dr. V wants her patients to have access to "Amerigo Vespucci" eyewear, but Dr. V doesn't have the inventory nor wish to buy in 24 pieces.

If Dr. V can get it online, then she thinks it's a big win.

Question: What are the disadvantages vs. the advantages for frame manufacturers to drop the opening minimum requirements and minimum sales requirements to stay open?

This policy can potentially fuel the online optical fire. Do they care about that?

The frame sales reps should care, and they probably don't like minimums already.

Thoughts?

[LENNY]

Sales Reps love minimums!
If the line is any good!

[uncut]

I have mixed feelings about this.......I do resent that Doc Joe/Jane down the street can buy a single piece of what I carry, when my investment has been in the 10000.'s, and usually the product has been viewed in my dispensary. On the other hand, I also aim to please! and would try the same. I wouldn't attempt to buy it from an onliner/not distribution source, however.
I would try to buy it from a peer source.

[opticianbart]

Sales Reps love minimums!

I always figured a lot of the minimums were the Sales Rep not wanting to bother with an account that is going to do small quantities - I mean if the sales don't justify the gas spent to get to the shop.....

[edKENdance]

It's only just recently become a pain in my side again. Customer wanted the same frame he purchased last time. It was still current stock but he could shop it online for just over cost from numerous online retailers.

[vintagetie]

Clearly, current optical dispensing is structured around garnering profit from retail sales to cover virtually all business expenses including; building rent/loan, materials, utilities, and employment to name a few. Online retailers avoid these expenses at the sacrifice of ability to ensure things like proper fit, comfort, and ease of vision yet continue to demonstrate the profitability of this model with great success. If the majority of value continues to shift to product rather than service in the mind of the consumer we will eventually fail to keep our doors open. Unfortunately many of the free or cheapened services optical dispensers provide will disappear if the trend continues. Alternatives include charging higher fees for service work or refusing to offer them to non-current clients but have obvious drawbacks in terms of marketing beyond existing clientele and hurting relationships with patients who received these services in the past. Do we have any proven models for a viable alternative, especially in a recessive market where cheapness is becoming a bigger priority than quality? I would hate to see opticianry go the way of the dodo and want to explore working models of how to shift the pay structure of optical services to reflect their costs. Vsp dispensing fees anyone?

[drk]

There are costs involved with having "sales help", a shopping experience, and a real (not virtual) inventory, let alone technical supervision.

People will continue to do business the traditional way, but many will shop internet.

If it's a clothing store, sure--have it both ways. Abercrombie in the mall and Abercrombie.net.

But Lenscrafters.com? Would that fly?

[Jubilee]

You also have to think about volume. The way I perceive a lot of these places are like the bargain basement "BOGO! 2pair for $69!" shops. Or even warehouse clubs..

Even if you only make a fraction of the usual mark up, if you sell sufficient quantities, you can still make a ton of money. Then by limiting the warranties on them.. say for 30 days.. most people don't get bent out of joint because they look as if they didn't have a lot of money invested to begin with. Or you can sell them the added warranty.. and recoup any replacement costs through the money from the sales of the warranty itself.

[optical24/7]

One reason (dumb) ODs find online optical affiliation attractive is that they can have a larger "virtual inventory".

Let's say Dr. V wants her patients to have access to "Amerigo Vespucci" eyewear, but Dr. V doesn't have the inventory nor wish to buy in 24 pieces.

If Dr. V can get it online, then she thinks it's a big win.

Question: What are the disadvantages vs. the advantages for frame manufacturers to drop the opening minimum requirements and minimum sales requirements to stay open?

This policy can potentially fuel the online optical fire. Do they care about that?

The frame sales reps should care, and they probably don't like minimums already.

Thoughts?

So, what does the brilliant Dr. V do? Patient *thinks* he wants a "Amerigo Vespucci" frame, so she directs him to *her* virtual inventory online to look at them? Let's look at possible outcomes...

1. The doctor is endorsing online sales. "If the doc says it's ok, it must be ok so I'll just order the whole thing online some place cheaper."

2. Doc lets patient pick out a frame from their virtual inventory, orders it, patient tries it on and decides they don't want it. Now doc has a purple and pink polka-dot "Amerigo Vespucci" frame in her *real* inventory, and likely may not sell it. Pretty soon she finds herself with a real (and paid for) inventory of frames that she really didn't want or need. Or, return it for credit and eat the postage both ways..Smart.

3. Can you buy parts online? How about warranties?


This is a recipe for a failed practice. I can turn almost any patient off from any given designer. I've lost virtually zero patients because I don't carry a certain line of frames. I've always got something *better*. It's ridiculous to order frames for "patient approval" when you've got 1000 choices already in stock. When the patient says "What other colors does this come in?" you tell them the only other colors are putrid yellow and puke green. Show what you've got in stock. If you've got a diverse inventory, you'll have something they like.


Dr V should worry more about her *real* competition down the road and create a pleasant atmosphere that encourages browsing and buying than try to compete for the 2% of un-loyal cheapskates that shop eyewear on the net.

[drk]

I'm going to print out that post and read it over and over.

[opticalcathy]

You have several issues here:
1.) Do you want to support your competition ie. framedirect by putting in their back end program, just to get a few frames?
2.) What is the point of minimum orders? Which contrary to what some believe are not at the reps discretion, although can be depending on rep, size of territory.
3.) Why would you only carry a few frames from a company? What is the point of that? That is not good merchandising or should I say that is TJ Maxx and Marshalls merchandising or 99cent store merchandising.
4.) If like particular frames ie. Oakley or even want some exclusive frames, many of them have affiiliate programs where you don't have to stock the frames and you can still make money selling online. or if they want a particular frame, you can probably buy it online cheaper on ebay or Amazon,

theopticalvisionsite.com/marketing/eye-care-profitability-affiliate-marketing/

[Johns]

So, what does the brilliant Dr. V do? Patient *thinks* he wants a "Amerigo Vespucci" frame, so she directs him to *her* virtual inventory online to look at them? Let's look at possible outcomes...

1. The doctor is endorsing online sales. "If the doc says it's ok, it must be ok so I'll just order the whole thing online some place cheaper."

2. Doc lets patient pick out a frame from their virtual inventory, orders it, patient tries it on and decides they don't want it. Now doc has a purple and pink polka-dot "Amerigo Vespucci" frame in her *real* inventory, and likely may not sell it. Pretty soon she finds herself with a real (and paid for) inventory of frames that she really didn't want or need. Or, return it for credit and eat the postage both ways..Smart.

3. Can you buy parts online? How about warranties?


This is a recipe for a failed practice. I can turn almost any patient off from any given designer. I've lost virtually zero patients because I don't carry a certain line of frames. I've always got something *better*. It's ridiculous to order frames for "patient approval" when you've got 1000 choices already in stock. When the patient says "What other colors does this come in?" you tell them the only other colors are putrid yellow and puke green. Show what you've got in stock. If you've got a diverse inventory, you'll have something they like.


Dr V should worry more about her *real* competition down the road and create a pleasant atmosphere that encourages browsing and buying than try to compete for the 2% of un-loyal cheapskates that shop eyewear on the net.

Did I write that in my sleep??

[drk]

duplicate

[drk]

In light of all that, what ARE frame manufacturers' preferences? Would they prefer their inventory go direct to consumer, or would they prefer it go through optical channels?

I'm thinking sales reps are on the opticals' side, but the head-honchos probably feel they can get more volume sales by cutting out the middle man.

Of course, they are selling higher to us and lower to big groups like online companies, I would suppose.

However, without their "sales force" of sales reps and the opticians that embellish, maintain, and promote their brands, don't they run the risk of commoditizing their frames in a big way?

Shouldn't frame companies take a leadership position on this issue, and shouldn't we demand it? Shouldn't I demand that my professional organization take a stand?

[Johns]

Shouldn't frame companies take a leadership position on this issue, and shouldn't we demand it? Shouldn't I demand that my professional organization take a stand?

They will sell to whomever buys the most, regardless of what channel they use.

Professional organizations don't buy anything, therefore, they have no power over manufacturers/suppliers. As retailers (those of us that admit that we are) the less we buy, the less power we have.

They will serve the source of their revenue. We can demand all we want, but in the end, they, like us, will follow the dollar.

[uncut]

I couldn't help but notice that not one frame manufacturer has cared to post a response to this thread,.... so far.

[drk]

Short-term gain > long term?

Not all companies are like that, but probably most are.

I'd like to see a head count of how they stand.

[Johns]

I couldn't help but notice that not one frame manufacturer has cared to post a response to this thread,.... so far.

Not surprising. The big boys are all lurkers. (and they are distributors, not manufacturers).

[engnenk]

I couldn't help but notice that not one frame manufacturer has cared to post a response to this thread,.... so far.

I'll take the bait. We don't sell online to consumers. None, zero, zip, zilch, null, nada. We are an independent that offers a finely made, handcrafted product. Our preferred business partners are the same, independents that are looking for high quality at a fair price. We let the retailer decide on the price they will charge the consumer. Once you get into online sales, it becomes a "race to the bottom".

It also prompts the question of why any retailer would stock items that are readily available online. By doing so, retailers are no more than uncompensated showrooms for the online retailers. As people become more and more web-savvy, I expect that it will become common for people to jot down models and then seek them out online.

[Johns]

I'll take the bait. We don't sell online to consumers. None, zero, zip, zilch, null, nada.

Ok, fair enough. But let's be truthful...if, say after 2 years of knocking on ECP's doors, you are coming up shorter than you espected, AND you were almost certain to sell 3 times more online, would you give it a shot?

[engnenk]

Ok, fair enough. But let's be truthful...if, say after 2 years of knocking on ECP's doors, you are coming up shorter than you expected, AND you were almost certain to sell 3 times more online, would you give it a shot?

Why wait 2 years. I have already figured out that I could multiply my sales many times over by selling online. However, once you start down that road, there is probably no turning back so before doing so, one had better be serious about it. Perhaps there is a degree of idealism that keeps independents out of the online marketplace. There is the realistic issue that online shoppers search for brand names they know. Unless your product carries a household name on its label, online sales would probably be a bit tougher.

My guess is that the best way to keep independents in shops and off of the internet is for independent shops to try to work with independent frame manufacturers and to shun the lines that are sold online.

[Johns]

My guess is that the best way to keep independents in shops and off of the internet is for independent shops to try to work with independent frame manufacturers and to shun the lines that are sold online.

No need to guess on that one. Brother Fezz, I, and the others having been preaching that for years. It's the truth.

[Fezz]

no need to guess on that one. Brother fezz, i, and the others having been preaching that for years. It's the truth.

amen!

[DragonLensmanWV]

And the congregation says.....

[opticianbart]

And the congregation says.....

Amen again?