Odd that women trust Gays and other women in fashion as most hair dressers are one or the other and we see so many women that we wish we had the nerve to go up and say: "Madam are you aware that your hairdresser must secretly hate women!":hammer:
Chip
Fun thread Barry.:cheers:
Like Andrew I get the ladies of our office to give a "fashion consultation". It's fun and everyone enjoys it. We get honesty points when we pick a less (sometimes considerably) costly frame.
On a side note I am a slave to fashion as you will see this afternoon when my picture avatar is posted.
My dream location is between a Post Office/chain drugstore and a successful Salon.:)Originally Posted by chip anderson
As a woman, even as a married one, I would like to get a man's opinion on how I look in a frame. And I am not sure I would rather listen to what other women think over what a man would think. However, I think most women are quick to spot a compliment that is not true. And even a pink tie and pink shoe laces will not help. So honestly is important. Barry, you are in the opposite situation from a female optician I know who took over for a male, who worked until his death at 72. She is currently still trying to live up to HIS customer's expectations, based on his performance in his vast years of experience. Keep that chin firm, your self confidence in what you know will shine through.
Note to self; Return nifty looking pink tie with matching shoelaces to the Mens Wearhouse....
Women usually trust other women to tell them the truth about how they look, (whether they have any optical knowledge or not). In the same respect, how many women on this site do lab work and repairs on all the equipment and get shrugged off by someone who is looking for the MAN of the lab???
The resemblance is striking . . . ;)
Andrew
"One must remember that at the end of the road, there is a path" --- Fortune Cookie
Barry,
I've come to believe that women are much more "analytical" than men. Women tend to want to massage a topic before they come to a final conclusion. Men tend to be problem solvers. We look at a problem and want to offer a solution. Women look at a problem and want to understand every angle before considering a solution.
I don't think NOT asking you was a direct insult. It could be your patient(s) are simply looking for a "kindred heart" (you know, another analyzer) to help them get the complete picture.
My .02
-Tony
It's all in how you present yourself. You don't have to be a total fashionista to project the impression that you understand what will make a patient look good. You have to strike a balance between being the eyecare professional and the fashion consultant. You don't even have to be super hip and stylish yourself as long as you know the trends and have a confident eye for what works for each person as an individual.
Find out how she wants to look, and then give her flattering frames to try that will help her project that image. That's pretty simple.
Thank you everyone whose has taken the time to offer advice on this thread.
Women of Optiboard, I salute you!
Barry
It could be the locale. And it's not my thoughts on how they think, it's what some have said. Personally I go with the person who has more fashion sense than I. I don't care if it's a man, woman, gay, straight, or even a Cubs fan.
But I'm not the best girl to ask about girl stuff anyway. I've never once dressed to impress the women. I was out to turn the guys' heads.
Been reading the replies and thought I would have a go at it.
While I am not a woman, I guess you can say I have the opposite problem that you have.
Women gravitate towards well dressed gay men that know how to talk their talk.
*** As a side note, I don't have a limp wrist, fancy earrings, nor a ponytail. As someone earlier had suggested, and I find those a dumb cheap shot**
Barry, when I met you (Speaker at VE event) the first thing that went through my mind was you reminded me of my Uncle Wally. A true New Yorker who I could find any friday night at Yankee stadium with a beer in one hand, and the other pumped into the air when "his" team scored. A tall big guy, a mans man. Now there is nothing wrong with that at all, however (most) women will just not relate to you.
I am not suggesting that you play gay by any means, however you may find some of the following helpful. As superficial or odd as some of these might seem, they are coming from the horses mouth, so to speak. I find women pay attention and respond to:
1) Grooming. Hair neatly trimmed and styled. Clean and trimmed nails. I take my toothbrush to work and brush after I eat lunch. My co workers used to laugh until I jokingly told them at least I wasn't going to be the one with bad breath. (Wouldn't you believe the number of tooth brushes that started showing up in our bathroom ;-)
*** Cologne. Women trust men who smell good. It cannot be overpowering. Go to the fragrance counter, tell the sales person that you want to sample a few colognes and spray 3 of the best on you. One on the chest, the other two on the wrist. Wait about 15 minutes and smell yourself. LOL! Thats how the fragrance works on you. Light, crisp, and citrusy always seem to be a winner. Wear something current and up to date. No Old Spice, no Drakkar Noir.
2) Talk shapes, colors, and details. I almost always tell my patients the first step in selecting a frame is finding the shape that "works best with their features." Say this and Bham! Instant Fashion credibility.
3) Phraseology: I *never, ever* say anything in a negative light, ie "That frame doesn't look good" Or "Its ok" or "I don't like that frame on you". I think when women hear statements like these, they start to over analyze why. Don't give them the opportunity. I like to say " Lets try this other frame on for comparison" or "This frame will go better with your hair/skin tone"
One thing I have come to say (too) much, is instead of saying "That frame is too big" I say "Try this frame on for me . . Now see how this frame is sleeker and more proportional on you, I think it looks great." I always tell them these things after they put the frame on and are looking in the mirror.
4) Make it personal. If Kelly is a fair skinned blond, I say this warm tort frame will go great with your hair, or if you want a bold look this XXX frame in black may be just what you're looking for. I try to get a feel for what their style is. Are they conservative, trendy, want something bold, or to blend in. Then I play into that.
5) Apathy. I am surprised at the amount of women who tell me when we go to select a frame "Oh I dont care what it is, I: only wear it to /read/at work/or just at night, and I won't be wearing them much because I wear contacts"
** To this I say "well my number one rule is I won't let you out of the office unless it looks good on you"
If you can do the above, your women patients will have no need to ask for advice elsewhere. The funny thing is, when you get really good at it, they are so convinced that you are the authority (and you are) that they will sometimes need your approval before they get the frame.
I also find it easier to sell this way. It gets the patient involved, so no more "just looking" or I am not sure what I want. It adds to the excitement of purchasing eye wear, people feel good when they have had such a positive experience.
Ok, LOoooonnnggggg post, but have at it!
~Crazy :cheers:
All the time. I even get it when an old guy walks in with a broken frame. "I need a repair" (he is looking around me and past me apparently for a guy). I can help you with that. "Ummmm" No really I can. Geeeez.
Ditto.:cheers:
Thanks, Crazy. I'm gonna be instrospective now about my latent "Uncle Wallyness." Thanks for the thoughtful advice.
I *really* am getting good advice about the predicament from all of you. Thanks!
Barry
aka Uncle Wally:cheers:
Delete.
Last edited by Metronome; 05-18-2009 at 01:46 AM. Reason: Delete.
It seems to be the kiss of death to tell a woman she looks good in the first thing she tries on. When I say, "Oh, I wouldn't let wear that one!;)", it seems to lend credibility to what I'm saying.
You don't get the "Oh, I'll bet you say that to everyone..." attitude when you are truly honest.
I don't try to make anyone think that I know anything about fashion except when it come to eyewear.
I also like to use humor when ever possible. When a 30 year old tries on a Laura Ashley, I'll say things like, "Oh I didn't know you were shopping for your mother!", or "Well, you could get those, but please don't tell anyone you got them here." or "I think that's a good choice for inside, but let's try to find a few pair you can wear out in public ."
When they drag their husbands along, I'll tell them that since they brought their own fashion consultant along, just let us know when you've narrowed it down to 10 pair and then well give them a hand. If the guy looks totally miserable, I might say, "Stand back...I'll take over from here. I'm a highly trained fashion expert!" (And they can obviously see that I'm not by the jeans I'm wearing)
Of course, you've really got to know your clients, and if you don't, you certainly will (one way or another) by the time they leave.
Last edited by Johns; 09-27-2008 at 10:01 PM.
Ophthalmic Optician, Society to Advance Opticianry
What a great thread!
The posts have been very informative and enlightening!
One of the phrases I use to show credibility is:
"Oh...........we can do much better than that!"
Be honest about it!
Another thing that rreally woprks is when deciding-forget about price. Often, the less expensive frame looks and fits better. Tell the patient. They pick up on the fact that you are not trying to force the more expensive frame. Instant credibility!
:cheers::cheers::cheers::cheers:
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