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Thread: Why I dropped Zeiss for Essilor.

  1. #1
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    Why I dropped Zeiss for Essilor.

    Please don't read this - it's not a good use of your time.

    I love zeiss product... however...

    1. Outstanding credits from July (to present)
    2. Being charged edge/drill fees on uncuts
    3. Full price VSP redos
    4. Mixed ARC on jobs (one teflon, one carat advantage)
    5. No rep contact for 3mos (rep lives in town)
    6. Prices change on redos
    7. $20/day in shipping for local courier
    8. Never a credit memo without asking
    9. "Everyone is having slippage errors"
    10. SunRx jobs with gapping
    11. Lab response to LAB issues: "talk to your rep"
    12. Credit promised by phone reps never came through
    13. 3 phone calls get three answers on a particular lens availability
    14. A patient requested Crizal Alize (vsp) and was shipped with Teflon without comment
    15. Silhouette drill job recently came back with the reading area decentered out (PAL dots made a "V") after taking 14 days.


    We're not a huge account, but I'm sure someone is willing to work for out $30-$35k/yr account. [/rant]

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    interesting

    was it a real Zeiss lab or someone only carries Zeiss lenses or licensed by Zeiss?

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    SOLA International purchased the lab in 2002.

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    Master OptiBoarder TLG's Avatar
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    So why Essilor rather than an independent lab (I mean, if there are still any left)? Because you're right, someone would love to have your 30-35k so why not shop it around? That way you may be able to find a great lab and still use the products you 'love'.

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    ATO Member HarryChiling's Avatar
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    I hate to say it but Essilor labs have the process engineering down. I get consistent results from Essilor owned labs.
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    Hoya never told me I couldn't get their stuff from an Essilor lab, but Varilux\Essilor did tell me I couldn't get their stuff from my chosen lab (independent at that time, now Hoya). Nobody tells me I have to use the lab THEY choose for me. Now I don't use any Varilux product, but I manage somehow.

  7. #7
    ATO Member HarryChiling's Avatar
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    We use two labs an independently owned lab and an essilor owned lab, it's getting harder to just have one lab that can do everything for you at a reasonable cost. I like both Zeiss and Varilux prodcuts, but they aren't the only game in town. I use Younger lenses alot from blended, to FT45, to the image in all it's materials available, it's a great go to lens since you can get it in almost every maetrial and the fact that many premium sun manufacturers use the image helps with our patients (especially the MJ patients that are pleased when their everyday pair is similar to their suns through MJ). IN the Zeiss I loke the brevity and find myself useing it more and more, patients that have been fit in the brevity tend to LOVE not like their brevity's and I found that out the hard way. As far as Varilux goes I find they are the easiest to replace especially the comfort. I have changed many a comfort wearer into many different designs and find that often they are happy with the results more so then other designs. I don't know if that's a good or bad thing but it helps me with my bottom line so I'm happy if my patient is happy.
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    We use a fair bit of Hoya and Zeiss still. SuperHiVision slips constantly in my edger, and at 60-80% AR, it was delaying jobs way too often for me. When we cut our volume with Hoya, they cut our discount. Full price futher killed them out of our office (plus the rep won't return an email or phone call if she her job depended on it)

    We will still use Zeiss for the occsional Individual or HDV (I'm not a "360" fan). As for independents, I like supporting local labs. My local indies are really iffy.

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    ATO Member HarryChiling's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by allanon View Post
    My local indies are really iffy.
    Ours too and it seems when tehy get their act together they just sell to Essilor anyway's so darned if you do darned if you don't.
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    12 business days out on a -3.00sph spazio.. no word from the lab.

    1st time vsp redo came in today at 100% charge.

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    Master OptiBoarder OptiBoard Gold Supporter DragonLensmanWV's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by allanon View Post
    12 business days out on a -3.00sph spazio.. no word from the lab.

    1st time vsp redo came in today at 100% charge.
    You need to master the use of the Wishsong.:bbg:
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    Must be the Zeiss lab in Hebron Ky. We just dropped them for almost the same reasons.

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    ATO Member HarryChiling's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mwfm View Post
    Must be the Zeiss lab in Hebron Ky. We just dropped them for almost the same reasons.
    They've had recent job listings on the job forum, every lab is susceptable to being short staffed, if they have provided good service in the past they will more than likely be back up to snuff again, options:

    1. Switch labs, build a relationship with a new lab.
    2. Ride it out but let them know you expect some sort of remuneration for every mistake while you stick with them, negotiate.
    3. Hybrid solution, switch your heavy ordering days to another lab and keep lets say fro instance all Monday work with them and when they get their stuff together switch back.
    I tend to go back and forth between two labs and it's usually a result of this very same scenario they are short staffed or they fired their experienced people, when they figure things out you come back, if you like their service or products.
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    Bad address email on file k12311997's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DragonLensmanWV View Post
    You need to master the use of the Wishsong.:bbg:
    is a reference to the series of books by terry brooks and the posters duidic handle?

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    Quote Originally Posted by DragonLensmanWV View Post
    You need to master the use of the Wishsong.:bbg:
    Wow - most people don't get it!!! You get props for that one.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mwfm View Post
    Must be the Zeiss lab in Hebron Ky. We just dropped them for almost the same reasons.
    Negative. The best part ... the rep knows our numbers are falling and still not contact.

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    Quote Originally Posted by k12311997 View Post
    is a reference to the series of books by terry brooks and the posters duidic handle?
    Better than the Lord of the Rings series.. <no boos please>

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    I think it's time to find a new lab.

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    Quote Originally Posted by allanon View Post
    Better than the Lord of the Rings series.. <no boos please>
    Are you reading the "bridging" series between the Word and the Void series and the Shannara series? Two down, one to go.
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    Optical Clairvoyant OptiBoard Bronze Supporter Andrew Weiss's Avatar
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    Back to the thread . . . ;)

    My experience is that it's helpful to have more than one lab on tap. Most labs seem to do some things better than others. One of our VSP-authorized labs has problems with their Altair supplier; the other takes longer to get Shamir progressives. One does a great job with drill-mounts, the other is so-so. I split the work up accordingly.

    It's also my experience that every lab, even the really good ones, go through periods where they seem to blow just about every job. SV CR39 SRC takes 1-1/2 weeks, lenses are 'way off axis or power, etc. When that happens, I agree with Harry -- send the bulk of the work to another lab until the first one gets its act together. I also call the lab manager and tell him/her what's going on, and that when things straighten out they'll get more business. I've only had to discontinue use of one lab because they never really straightened out.

    But: when it comes to sloppy business practices like the ones cited in the first post in this thread: I would just leave the lab. I won't tolerate that kind of stuff. I'd also check around to other Zeiss/Sola labs to find out whether these are the results of Zeiss/Sola policies or whether maybe another lab will work better with you.

    And, if you want Zeiss/Sola and want a good lab to boot, there's always Luzerne or Pech -- both independents, both good quality, both fully authorized by both Zeiss/Sola and Essilor/Varilux.
    Andrew

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  21. #21
    Doh! braheem24's Avatar
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    Try U.S. optical, just opened by the same brothers that owned optigenics before Essilor purchased thier lab, they carry Zeiss and have 1 day turnaround on A/R and had wonderful service when they owned optigenics.

    http://www.usoptical.com

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    no wonder Essilor is gaining more share

    From what you guys are talking, it's no wonder Essilor is gainning more share. at where we are, there are quite a few independent labs so they all try to be nice, some are nicer than others , but not one like the one you guys mentioned.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew Weiss View Post
    And, if you want Zeiss/Sola and want a good lab to boot, there's always Luzerne or Pech -- both independents, both good quality, both fully authorized by both Zeiss/Sola and Essilor/Varilux.
    And in the case of Pech, also authorized by Sillouette, Hoya, Shamir, Rudy Project, Oakley, and Wiley X

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew Weiss View Post
    Back to the thread . . . ;)

    But: when it comes to sloppy business practices like the ones cited in the first post in this thread: I would just leave the lab. I won't tolerate that kind of stuff. I'd also check around to other Zeiss/Sola labs to find out whether these are the results of Zeiss/Sola policies or whether maybe another lab will work better with you.
    I will still use the zeiss lab for my HDV/Gradal-i work. Thankfully Brad Main is back at Hoya and is helping us out with our Hoya issues.

    I did receive a little letter in the mail wishing me good luck with my new lab. There was nothing in the letter about resolving any issues, why are we leaving, can you please come back, call me, etc.

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    Labs

    Have had great luck with Digital Eye Lab in NY, and North Central Ophthalmics (Zeiss) in St. Cloud, MN... Pech is great, but EXPENSIVE!!!

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