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Thread: FF Sucks.

  1. #1
    ATO Member HarryChiling's Avatar
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    FF Sucks.

    Burnt again by a new lab I decided to try out, I sent them a tough job and they have messed it up numerous times and I have said every time I call, that a mistake is OK, just give me a call and a new ETA, and every time they have dropped the ball, the last time around they made up some cokamamy story and then said they would overnight it. My origianl ETA was 3-5 days, it's been almost a month, I knew it would be a more difficult job, so I explained to teh patient that it would probably be more along the lines of 2 weeks and may even be a bit longer. The lack of communication from the lab has put me into a tight situation where if I don't get them in by tommorow the guy wants to cancel the order or he'll accept a $100.00 reduction in price. This is one of those new FF jobs where the lab keeps telling me that if I sent them an easier job it could have been done in 3-5 days, so it's apparentyl my fault for utilizing their services. Anyway last time I use that lab.

    I offered a pair of progressives in his frames gratis as a courtesy since the job has taken too long and to top it all off since it's a FF job theirs barely any profit in it either way and now I am stuck dipping into that profit to make him up a second pair which is better than the alternatives, refund or $100.00 off. For all you FF manufacturers out there heed this warnign you burn your bridges and I don't care if you may think you can make something no one else can, I will never order it and my customers will never get your product.
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  2. #2
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    Been there...done that!

    Harry,

    I am right with you Brother! I started a thread here about the very same thing!


    http://www.optiboard.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27392


    Let me off of the Free-Form Train!

  3. #3
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    We've had good luck and a reasonable turn around time (2 weeks) from Hoya Atlanta. They also have the best customer service of all the labs we deal with. They always call to notify of delays. Good luck.

  4. #4
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    We have never had problems. Actually, in Canada eh, it usually takes up to 2 weeks for lenses to get coated. I have been getting some of the FF lenses in quicker. The only one I have had time lags with was the Ipseo, because it came from France. It took three weeks.

  5. #5
    ATO Member HarryChiling's Avatar
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    I have heard and from a few of my suppliers "send us more of your easy work". I only put my hard to fits in FF, if they were easy I would be doing them in house. I'm just disappointed with this lab because I wanted them to be good.
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    Quote Originally Posted by HarryChiling View Post
    I have heard and from a few of my suppliers "send us more of your easy work". I only put my hard to fits in FF, if they were easy I would be doing them in house. I'm just disappointed with this lab because I wanted them to be good.
    I keep hearing the same thing. My understanding was that the benefits are greater in higher powers. Why would I want to help the lab recoup their free-form investment on -1.25's w/+1.50 adds?

    No thanks. I'll let the sheep follow.

  7. #7
    Master OptiBoarder rbaker's Avatar
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    The most important piece of equipment in an ophthalmic lab is the telephone. If the person on the other end is honest and forthright you will have a good relationship.

  8. #8
    Master OptiBoarder LENNY's Avatar
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    You can also check the status online!

  9. #9
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    If any of the persent "front runners" is dumb enough to have a fine level headed person as VP he/she will be setting himself up for asignation. Would be as dumb as having a Lyndon Johson as VP. JFK should have known Lady Bird would have had him done in soon.
    The present batch can only find someone sorrier and more left wing than they are if they want to live out thier terms.


    Chip

  10. #10
    Master OptiBoarder karen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HarryChiling View Post
    I have heard and from a few of my suppliers "send us more of your easy work". .

    We say that because we think it sucks to only do that hard stuff, especially if it is from one of the manufacturers that only gives us 50% credit on the redo and we give you 100. It offsets the cost and the headache and softens the blow when we get the bill on that Physio 360 w/Avance with Scotch Guard Protector that we only got half credit on because the optician didn't measure the seg height right and we had to redo it to move it up 3mm. We also get yelled at about how long jobs take that we have outsourced that we could have done in a day and a half if it were traditionally surfaced with AR. If they have 3 breakages it makes us look bad and all we are doing is submitting the order and "finishing" it when it comes back in. Sorry.

    We call on delays though, maybe you should send your work to California!
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  11. #11
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    For the lab folks-

    What powers would you prefer us to send for free-form? What powers to avoid? I think that would help tremendously!

  12. #12
    ATO Member HarryChiling's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by karen View Post
    We say that because we think it sucks to only do that hard stuff, especially if it is from one of the manufacturers that only gives us 50% credit on the redo and we give you 100. It offsets the cost and the headache and softens the blow when we get the bill on that Physio 360 w/Avance with Scotch Guard Protector that we only got half credit on because the optician didn't measure the seg height right and we had to redo it to move it up 3mm. We also get yelled at about how long jobs take that we have outsourced that we could have done in a day and a half if it were traditionally surfaced with AR. If they have 3 breakages it makes us look bad and all we are doing is submitting the order and "finishing" it when it comes back in. Sorry.

    We call on delays though, maybe you should send your work to California!
    Karen,

    The issue here is communication. rbaker got it right when he said that the most important piece of equipment is the phone. I make mistakes all the time, my patients appreciate a call to let them know there will be a delay, otherwise they assume that everything is hunky dory, and before we start making up cute sayings with the word assume, I am this labs customer and if they call me an @ss they could kiss my @ss, I'm gone. I don't measure a lab by the easy work they can do, I measure them by their customer service and the tough jobs and how they handle them. I am paying wholesale what I would be chargeing for progressives, so anything less than excellence is unacceptable. Also keep in mind that this is strike three on the same and only job I have used this lab for. There is no excuse that extends beyond the first mistake and if they wanted my easy work they shouldn't have dropped the ball on the tough job or the first job you take your pick which one you would like to use.
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  13. #13
    What's up? drk's Avatar
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    Hey, this is a common theme.

    Early adopters of new technology get the upside and the downside.

    What's a business to do?

    I think it behooves me to get enough information before taking a plunge.

    Individualized progressives aren't there, yet.

  14. #14
    ATO Member HarryChiling's Avatar
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    Thumbs up I Agree

    Quote Originally Posted by drk View Post
    Hey, this is a common theme.

    Early adopters of new technology get the upside and the downside.

    What's a business to do?

    I think it behooves me to get enough information before taking a plunge.

    Individualized progressives aren't there, yet.
    You know it's been long enough to have gotten all the bugs out and it seems some labs have and some labs haven't.
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    Vision Equipment OptiBoard Corporate Sponsor Leo Hadley Jr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rbaker View Post
    The most important piece of equipment in an ophthalmic lab is the telephone. If the person on the other end is honest and forthright you will have a good relationship.
    I NOMINATE THIS AS POST OF THE MONTH!!!!:D
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  16. #16
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    Idea The water is nice and warm to take the plunge!

    Quote Originally Posted by drk View Post
    Hey, this is a common theme.

    Early adopters of new technology get the upside and the downside.

    What's a business to do?

    I think it behooves me to get enough information before taking a plunge.

    Individualized progressives aren't there, yet.
    We have been using free form full time for over 5 years and continue to use as much as possible. We utilize a few vendors and have no such issues to deal with on a daily basis. This is not a miracle for all lab work but it is the future and we are using as many as we can order.

    Craig

  17. #17
    ATO Member HarryChiling's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OpticLabRat View Post
    I NOMINATE THIS AS POST OF THE MONTH!!!!:D
    I second the nomination. Hey maybe you could do a sunday special $0.99 on that fabulous piece of equipment. :D
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    Underemployed Genius Jacqui's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OpticLabRat View Post
    I NOMINATE THIS AS POST OF THE MONTH!!!!:D
    I third this. (I like Harry's idea too)

  19. #19
    Rising Star slubberdegullian's Avatar
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    hard jobs

    Quote Originally Posted by Jacqui View Post
    I third this. (I like Harry's idea too)
    When i get back into a company if you would like to send me your work and have it done in less than 3 days let me know.I don't care what type of job it is no job should take that long to do.I can do triple gradient facet drill job in less time and not get it back from the dr.My philosophy is you do it right the first time with high quality and your always going to keep the costumer happy and the patient and maybe reel in more costumers:D

  20. #20
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    Good 'Ol days....

    I remember when having a "problem job" meant having a skilled technician take the job and "walk it through" the lab. One person skilled in all areas of the lab to stay with it until it came out complete on the other end perfect! Not handed off from one tasker to a dozen others, each of which can pass the buck onto the next guy hoping they can "save" it. Those jobs even when difficult were done in short order when handled correctly by a professional who cared about his craft. Are those days gone??:finger:

  21. #21
    OptiWizard
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    Quote Originally Posted by FVCCHRIS View Post
    Are those days gone??:finger:
    Yep
    Help Optiboard $5.00 a month through Paypal

  22. #22
    ATO Member HarryChiling's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FVCCHRIS View Post
    Are those days gone??:finger:
    Sadly, I would have to say yes, too. Although there are still some labs that do it that way, more and more of them just put it in a red tray and hope this time it doesn't get messed up through production.

    Sometimes the settings need to be altered for certain jobs, or special attention needs to be given to a job and there is no way of automateing special attention, at the same time special attention jobs are usually lower margin for the labsas it requires time and skilled labor, that's why we get the send us more of your easy jobs. I had a lab once tell me to send them all our work and send other labs my drill work. :hammer: Now I have a lab telling me send us more easy work for FF. It shows a lack of respect for what we do, I know some opticians that have never seen the inside of a lab but would be considered great becuase they know just the right labs and places to send their work to get back an exceptional pair of glasses.

    I'll tell you when I shop for a new lab I send them worst for the first few jobs and if they can handle them then I feel confident sending them more of my other work, but if they can't handle the worst why in heck would I want to send another lab all my worst and them all the easy work? That wouldn't make any sense, freakin earn my business, I don't tell my patients sorry your Rx sucks but you sons is easy we'll take that. :hammer:
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  23. #23
    Vision Equipment OptiBoard Corporate Sponsor Leo Hadley Jr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FVCCHRIS View Post
    I remember when having a "problem job" meant having a skilled technician take the job and "walk it through" the lab. One person skilled in all areas of the lab to stay with it until it came out complete on the other end perfect! Not handed off from one tasker to a dozen others, each of which can pass the buck onto the next guy hoping they can "save" it. Those jobs even when difficult were done in short order when handled correctly by a professional who cared about his craft. Are those days gone??:finger:

    You just took me down memory lane..........

    I was very proud to be that guy in my lab!!! I had to "walk through" the special jobs in special trays. It is human nature to set that "problem" aside while blowing out 50 easy jobs. My day would fly by because I had the great opportunity to be able to walk the specialty jobs through rather than just mount 400 metal jobs a day. Sometimes I really miss my lab days. I wonder if all of my sculpted leap pad dinosaurs are still roaming the lab:D
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  24. #24
    Master OptiBoarder karen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HarryChiling View Post
    Karen,

    There is no excuse that extends beyond the first mistake and if they wanted my easy work they shouldn't have dropped the ball on the tough job or the first job you take your pick which one you would like to use.
    I agree! Ready to send me a tough first one??? :D Oh, and we are still small enough to walk a job through.
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  25. #25
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    Wink

    If the first job you send to an un-tested lab is a "tough" one, it makes me question your concern for your customer. What do you think your customer would say if you told them, "Yours is a difficult prescription. Rather than send it to a lab I know can do the job, I'm going to send it to a lab I know nothing about to 'test' them. I'll gain the benefit of seeing how they handle a tough job without first trying them on normal jobs, and you will get the excitement of not knowing when, if ever, you will get your lenses as ordered."
    Suppose the lab you're complaining about is doing the same thing...What if they hired a new guy and decided to "test" him with the tough jobs, no matter how long it takes for the finished job to get back to you.
    You can't really complain if they're using your own logic.

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