Keeping the Spiff

[cocoisland58]

Just to throw this out to you for opinions. It has come to my attention as the office manager that the boss had signed our dispensors up to participate in a spiff supported by our wholesale lab. They would get a monetary amount per any job that included a specific AR and or Transitions. Well, we sell the heck out of AR around here so it would stand to reason that our staff would be getting a pretty good check every month from the lab. I don't typically agree to spiffs but the boss did sign us up. Apparently however the boss has had the checks sent to the office and has been cashing them but not giving out the cash to the staff. This has been going on for almost a year. One of our dispensors found out about it when talking to the owner of the lab and she is furious at the boss. No one has said anything as of yet. I feel it is kind of sleazy to sign them up for this and then keep the money. We are not sure how to delicately handle the situation. Any suggestions?

[optical24/7]

Sleazy, yes. But he is the owner and is intitled to every penny of income. He only owes the staff the salary they agreed to work for.

[Diane]

Just to throw this out to you for opinions. It has come to my attention as the office manager that the boss had signed our dispensors up to participate in a spiff supported by our wholesale lab. They would get a monetary amount per any job that included a specific AR and or Transitions. Well, we sell the heck out of AR around here so it would stand to reason that our staff would be getting a pretty good check every month from the lab. I don't typically agree to spiffs but the boss did sign us up. Apparently however the boss has had the checks sent to the office and has been cashing them but not giving out the cash to the staff. This has been going on for almost a year. One of our dispensors found out about it when talking to the owner of the lab and she is furious at the boss. No one has said anything as of yet. I feel it is kind of sleazy to sign them up for this and then keep the money. We are not sure how to delicately handle the situation. Any suggestions?

ANY spiffs, gifts, "free" product that comes into ANY office belongs to the person who OWNS the office. After all, they are the one who writes the checks. It's up to that person to make a decision as to how to use them. If they choose to use them to offset expenses, that is their choice. If their choice is to use it for raises, that is their choice. If their choice is to share the "information" with staff that is their choice. Since when was it the employees right to tell the owner how to run their business?

How can you possibly consider the owner's decision to operate his/her business on a level of profitability as sleazy? After all, profitibility is how you get your paycheck. I consider the fact that some frame buyers/managers choose to put in a particular product based on the gratuities that a rep will offer them either openly or under the table as sleazy. The owner pays for that as well. The business owner is the one to make the decision as to how to use any spiffs/gifts/incentives in their office, not the employees.

Now on a note a little more agreeable to you. I also believe that if those working in an office are kept up to speed with some of the offers, that they will work toward that profitibility of the practice. That said, a good idea with these incentives is to use them to reward employees for going above their job requirements.

Well run offices/practices are those where the owner keeps his/her finger on the pulse but doesn't micromanage. But they do pay the bills.

These are my thoughts, and I'm sure they may not be considered friendly by someone who thinks they have a right to run another person's business without the financial risk.

Diane

[Jubilee]

I believe that the majority of us agree, that any spiffs taken in are the owner's.

I was about to ask why he would sign up and not say anything, at least to the office manager..

However, I can see someone doing this if they thought it would prevent people from pushing product they may otherwise not for the sake of the spiff. Especially if there was some sort of profit sharing going on. (cause you would still be benefiting it, and thus potentially biased)


I am assuming that this is a check sent monthly/quarterly that is made to the business and not to individual employees....


Cassandra

[AutumN]

Most spiffs are offered to the owner regardless of the employee. Because there used to be trouble with owners not being aware of a particular spiff and the employee taking the prize on the Q T, now many will only send to the employee if they've had the employer sign off.
In our office, spiffs don't really direct our sales, but something like AR etc. that we do, then yes, were going to take it. As the optical manager, I make sure the Docs are aware of the spiffs and use it to the benefit of the optical itself.

[cocoisland58]

Sleazy, yes. But he is the owner and is intitled to every penny of income. He only owes the staff the salary they agreed to work for.

I agree, however this particular "spiff" was specifically designated to employees only according to the owner of the lab and it was not to be used to offset lab expenses by the owners. Being "up front" about it would have been the right thing to do. The staff never asks for anything extra and works very hard. Selling a specific item to offset our lab bill would have been acceptable to them where as this seems to be very underhanded. They would have preferred not to be signed up for this at all, and they were signed up under their personal names not the name of the company or owner which seems to them also a privacy issue.

[karen]

this is why I hate spiff programs!

....and I think he should have told you. Not that y'all could have done anything about it but if he is using your names (and I hope not your SS #'s and that you aren't getting 1099'd) then you should know about it. But I also agree that it's his business and therefore his decision.

I hearby call on all manufacturers to quit spiffing, use that money to make the product cost less to us so we can pass that on to the Docs and let's compete on quality of design and stuff, OK?

[shellrob]

So, if they were signed up under their personal names, why aren't the checks made out to them directly? If that is what the lab says,then ask them why they are sending them to the doc and not the employess. Sounds to me like they lied to you to get you guys to sign up for the spiff program.

[Fezz]

this is why I hate spiff programs!


I hearby call on all manufacturers to quit spiffing, use that money to make the product cost less to us so we can pass that on to the Docs and let's compete on quality of design and stuff, OK?

I couldn't agree more! I HATE all of the spiffing. Stop...enough with the stickers and treasure maps, the scratch of thingys, and every other BOGUS "award" fluff.

Lower my cost. Give me a financial incentive(deeper discount) for not having redos. Stupid marketing Wingnuts. I despise them.

:angry::cheers::angry::cheers::angry:

[Diane]

I couldn't agree more! I HATE all of the spiffing. Stop...enough with the stickers and treasure maps, the scratch of thingys, and every other BOGUS "award" fluff.

Lower my cost. Give me a financial incentive(deeper discount) for not having redos. Stupid marketing Wingnuts. I despise them.

:angry::cheers::angry::cheers::angry:

I've been asking for this for almost 30 years. Until everyone on both sides agrees to this, it won't happen. Just like discounts. Offer someone a low price with no discount and they still want a discount. Give them a higher price and offer a discount and the perception is they have gotten a bargain. The higher the starting price with the greatest discount brings em in.

In the perfect world, there would be no spiffs and no discounts...yeah, right.

Oh well....:hammer:

Diane

[cocoisland58]

How can you possibly consider the owner's decision to operate his/her business on a level of profitability as sleazy? Diane

Using your employees names without their permission to sign them up for a promotion and keep quiet about it IS sleazy in my book. I do not like spiffs and such simply because of what usually happens. I do not care one way or the other if the owner wants to keep all the goodies as it is their right to do so but to be dishonest is never good business.

[HarryChiling]

cocoisland58,

What if he decided to have your name printed on more business cards, would that count as using your name without permission. He/She doesn't owe you or anyone a dime from any spiff, also when ever my emplyoyer signs us up for a new lab or signs up for anything lab or lens related she puts me down. If you are key personel to the business than they are going to use your name as a contact in many ways. It would be inefficient to have to ask you every time if he/she was allowed to use yor name. I wold let this one go as it seems like you are making a moutnain out of a mohill.

[Florida Optician]

We have seen spiffs dispersed in countless ways through the years. One of our most successful accounts has this program.The optical manager creates a variety of fun inside promotions that the entire staff ( from receptionists, techs, opticians, etc) is included in.
ANY spiff, no matter the type ( product or cash) is used to fund these promotions and prizes.
Gee what a novel idea-the entire office working towards the same goal !!
And while we are on the subject-no employee of this group is allowed to accept any personal gifts whatsoever-even a birthday present. Harsh maybe, but keeps everyone on the same page.
As long as spiffs remain in our industry, the only answer is to have a clearly understood written policy in place. Otherwise, owners are allowing their employees to determine what is allowed and was is not. This can only lead to problems.

[cocoisland58]

[quote=HarryChiling;190287]cocoisland58,

What if he decided to have your name printed on more business cards, would that count as using your name without permission. He/She doesn't owe you or anyone a dime from any spiff, also when ever my emplyoyer signs us up for a new lab or signs up for anything lab or lens related she puts me down. If you are key personel to the business than they are going to use your name as a contact in many ways. It would be inefficient to have to ask you every time if he/she was allowed to use yor name. I wold let this one go as it seems like you are making a moutnain out of a mohill.[/quote


Actually I wasn't making a mountain out of anything but the dispensors were so i thought I would get opinions since they read this site.

[chip anderson]

If spiffs must be, the employees need all the rewards they can get. Especially if they do all the work and are underpaid.

We give all the spiffs to our employees.


Chip

[HarryChiling]

Actually I wasn't making a mountain out of anything but the dispensors were so i thought I would get opinions since they read this site.

Well then I apoligize.

If spiffs must be, the employees need all the rewards they can get. Especially if they do all the work and are underpaid.

We give all the spiffs to our employees.

That's nice and I agree the employees should be given the spiffs and it's more fun when some sort of goal is attahed to it. It makes sense that way, but the key word in your post is "We give". As long as the owner makes the concious decision then it's fine, IMHO.

[optical24/7]

Spiffs. if done at all, should be something that can motivate all your staff to promote things you think are not being promoted in your shop, such as AR coatings, or, matching flash color mirror with back side ar on poloroid suns....There are a lot of things we all could promote more regularly. Spiffs can be a way to get these services out there with more consistancy.

I do think the only way to do spiffs to employees is to make it benificial to all employees, just like most big restaurants do now. Even the dishwasher gets a cut of tips.

[Jubilee]

The big deal is that this is technically earned income by the employee. If it is being dispersed in their names, and they were unawares.. what would happen if by some fluke audit thing, the associates were penealized by the IRS or some other office for inaccurate reporting? What about how this affects their potential unemployment, ss, etc....

As I said before, I firmly believe and I personally have set up everything to go to the doc in his own name. However, _I_ would be mad to find that I supposedly was earning income (the lab shows the spiff is designated to an employee, not owner) and not aware of this situation. IF I was told upfront what was happening, I wouldn't care less. It is a matter of trust. If 1 thing is going on like this I don't know about, then there might be others...

[AutumN]

What I'm wondering about all of this, is if the lab says the spiffs are in the employee's names, and they've been paying it, then it would stand to reason that any checks etc. are being sent in the name of the employee. If that's the case, then how are the checks getting cashed. Someone's got to be signing them. It makes me wonder that maybe the lab registers the name of the employee so that they can track who gets what, so that it can be distributed appropriately, IF the doc wants to, but in essence is still the practice's spiff so to speak.

If checks are coming in the name of the employee and the doc is forging signatures, I'd have professional ethics issue with the guy beyond worrying about a few bucks in spiffs.

[Chris Ryser]

SPIFF's

...........Is actually a kick back system to entice sellers to push certain products. Very often employees are getting them without the owners knowing about it. Dishonesty practised by the supplier and by the employee.

In this particular case I assume that the lab has offered the boss a quantity discount, repayable in cash to his own pocket (tax free ???).

Employees have no right to be even upset in this case as it is not even a spiff.

[cocoisland58]

...........Is actually a kick back system to entice sellers to push certain products. Very often employees are getting them without the owners knowing about it. Dishonesty practised by the supplier and by the employee.

In this particular case I assume that the lab has offered the boss a quantity discount, repayable in cash to his own pocket (tax free ???).

Employees have no right to be even upset in this case as it is not even a spiff.

Boss already gets a substantial quantity discount. As I found out apparently the lab owner discussed this with the bosses of many accounts about the spiff money going to the boss and then to be split up among dispensors. Since many of the accounts were not doing it that way the lab has now decided to issue checks directly to the employees. I have always had a rule that any "giftees" go to the owner first and passed to us only if they so desire. Starbucks giftcards are a great "whole office" spiff if they must send anything at all.

[chip anderson]

The very least they could do is make the gift certifercates good for Bass Pro Shops.

[Diane]

...that this could go on and on, but if I do business with a lab, vendor, whomever, and they were to bypass me as the owner to give something to my employees without my permission, that would be the end of business.

I'm telling you, that spiffs take away from lower pricing to the owner of the business and they belong the them, NOT the employees.

If a lab is telling you that they sent the checks in employees name, something isn't smelling right, and it's time to move on. I think something smells and it's not the boss.

Diane

[OPTIDONN]

Even though Diane is right about the owner legally being able to take this spiff it is not right. Just STOP selling what you are getting spiffed on. May not be the best idea because he probably aint rollin' in the big bucks from it and it may hurt any commsission you earn but you can remove yourself from this situation and maybe start looking for a new job. An owner like this is just NOT a good person.

[OPTIDONN]

and one more thing while I'm thinking about it. Business owners who act this way are just bad business people. It's stupid treat employees in such a manner! If you do not value your employee's and the work they do for you your heading down a slippery path. If these employee's wish they could hurt business severly! or they could leave, meaning now that the employer would have to re-hire a new optician. High turnover could also really hurt patient satisfaction and hurt the bottom line. An employer who acts and feels like everything is entitled to them is probably no good. I know something smells here and it IS the boss!:finger: