Page 1 of 4 1234 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 94

Thread: Varilux Physio comments & feedback please

  1. #1
    Rising Star Bezza's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Plymouth UK
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    70

    Varilux Physio comments & feedback please

    I recently attended the launch for Varilux Physio here in the UK and during 2 days of being thoroughly looked after by Essilor, enjoying, fine food, entertainment, drunkeness and horse racing at cheltenham festival somehwere in there they mangaed to fit in a presentation regarding this new lens technology.:cheers:
    I have to say that it does look pretty special, mapping wavefronts through both surfaces and surfacing both surfaces to reduce coma and other high order abberations etc....all very clever stuff. All the Essilor staff at the event were saying that this was just the tip of the iceberg and that they have only just begun to understand the capabilities of this new technology, which they have 5 seperate patents for.
    Anyways I was just wondering what sort of reception this lens has received elsewhere as im sure that other countries have already been using it before us. Are you getting good responses from PXs using the lens and is it really as good as they say it is?
    Anything else I ought to know before I start dispensing them to all our Panamic wearers?

  2. #2
    Master OptiBoarder rinselberg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Sunnyvale, CA 94086
    Occupation
    Other Eyecare-Related Field
    Posts
    2,287
    Information is my game, not optics (per se); but I have a suggestion: Use the OptiBoard Search option. Search by Key Word physio and be sure to select Search Entire Posts and not Search Titles Only. Select "Search All Open Forums" and "Show Results as Posts". Execute your search with the Search Now button. I retrieved 193 posts in reverse chronological order. It's a good way to zero in on which OptiBoarders have actually dispensed any of these lenses, and what some of them had to say.

    The answers are out there ...



    nsofar as one can define existentialism, it is a movement from the abstract and the general to the particular and the concrete ... http://mythosandlogos.com/

  3. #3
    Manuf. Lens Surface Treatments OptiBoard Gold Supporter
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Back in the at work mode.
    Occupation
    Other Optical Manufacturer or Vendor
    Posts
    17,690
    Blog Entries
    3

    Redhot Jumper by Essilor, enjoying, fine food, entertainment, drunkeness

    Quote Originally Posted by Bezza
    I recently attended the launch for Varilux Physio here in the UK and during 2 days of being thoroughly looked after by Essilor, enjoying, fine food, entertainment, drunkeness and horse racing at cheltenham festival somehwere in there they mangaed to fit in a presentation regarding this new lens technology
    If a company can still do product launch parties of that kind.........in the UK and how many other countries.................they for sure will price the product accordingly and count on major sales figures.

    The customer will always have to pay back advertising cost and original R&D in the price of the product.
    Chris Ryser
    ________________________________________
    DLO. NA.IC.I.T.PO

    http://optochemicals.com............................. http://arcoatings.com

  4. #4
    Rising Star Bezza's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Plymouth UK
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    70
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Ryser
    If a company can still do product launch parties of that kind.........in the UK and how many other countries.................they for sure will price the product accordingly and count on major sales figures.

    The customer will always have to pay back advertising cost and original R&D in the price of the product.
    apparently its gonna be priced the same as the panamic

  5. #5
    Optician Extraordinaire
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Somewhere warm
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    2,901
    I have a pair of regular Physios in poly with AR. I have also worn Panamics with no problems. My distance correction is -2.00-.50 and -2.50 sphere with a +2.00 add.

    The Physios are wonderful. The distance is excellent and so is the intermediate. The reading is good, I can see the width of a page of a book. Compared to my Sola Ones which I also like a lot the distance area is wider.

    My husband has the Physio 360, his distance is about a +.75 -.50 and his add is +2.50. He also likes the lens a lot though he thinks his previous pair of Sola Ones have a wider reading area. I don't notice any difference with mine. Perhaps it has to do with the difference in the rx.

    So far I have had no non adapts with the Physio. Several patients told me they could see very clearly. One patient told me she noticed no difference in the width of the distance area but her add did increase several steps.

    I have one patient that I fit with the Physio 360 that hasn't been happy with progressives in the past but didn't want to try a lined bifocal yet. I checked her glasses in yesterday so I don't know what she thinks of them yet.

  6. #6
    Master OptiBoarder
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    new york
    Occupation
    Optometrist
    Posts
    3,286
    I have always had difficulty wearing any progressive over my monovision Acuvue contact lenses. For the most part, I see fine both distance and near with the CLs alone. Now that I'm 51, there are occasions where I could use a little help with fine print and night driving. (Although the real reason I got them is that my opticians on staff think should wear spectacles to boost sales.)

    So, I thought I would try physios, OD -.25sph, OS -1.00, 2.00 add OU. The distance and intermediate areas are truly wider and much more distortion free (IMHO). The near zone is clear and seemingly wide enough...lateral head positioning for reading seems less critical. The one weakness I think I have found is there seems to be more distortion in the inferior peripheral areas of the lens. I guess you gotta put it somewhere.

  7. #7
    Allen Weatherby OptiBoard Gold Supporter
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Florida
    Occupation
    Other Optical Manufacturer or Vendor
    Posts
    1,285

    Remember there are two Physio's - Regular and 360

    The regular is produced just like the Panamic.

    The 360 uses a point file produced surface.

    I do not understand the logic in calling these both a Physio but it is not my company.

  8. #8
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Location
    Only City in the World built over a Volcano
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    13,002
    AWTech:

    The 2 hour "instruction course" (translantion: Sales pitch) I sat through yesterday had a computerised chisel poiint (Kind of reminded me of the old manual Levin Lathe I made contact lenses on in my early days) doing the front surface only on the Physio. It had same doing the surfaces on both sides for the 360 or whatever they called the delux model.

    Sorry to disagree, but be of good heart.
    I paid your bill today.

    Chip

  9. #9
    Rising Star Bezza's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Plymouth UK
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    70
    Quote Originally Posted by AWTECH
    The regular is produced just like the Panamic.

    The 360 uses a point file produced surface.

    I do not understand the logic in calling these both a Physio but it is not my company.
    From what I understand the physio has the front surface adjusted and surfaced by their wavefront management software and back surface produced in the normal fashion, while panamic is merely a well designed back surface progressive.
    The 360 on the other hand has both surfaces compensated and is surfaced using their point by point twinning surfacing technology, in other words both surfaces have the wavefronts mapped and compensated to reduce high order abberrations and unwanted astigmatism.

  10. #10
    Allen Weatherby OptiBoard Gold Supporter
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Florida
    Occupation
    Other Optical Manufacturer or Vendor
    Posts
    1,285

    How does Physio do all of this customization?

    Bezza:
    From what I understand the physio has the front surface adjusted and surfaced by their wavefront management software and back surface produced in the normal fashion, while panamic is merely a well designed back surface progressive.
    The 360 on the other hand has both surfaces compensated and is surfaced using their point by point twinning surfacing technology, in other words both surfaces have the wavefronts mapped and compensated to reduce high order abberrations and unwanted astigmatism.
    http://www.lasikinstitute.org/Wavefront_Technology.html Eye Surgery Education Council:
    Wavefront-guided LASIK is a promising new technology that provides an advanced method for measuring optical distortions in the eye. Measuring and treating these distortions goes beyond nearsighted, farsighted, and astigmatism determinations that have been used for centuries. As a result, physicians can now customize the LASIK procedure according to each individual patient’s unique vision correction needs. The treatment is unique to each eye, just as a fingerprint is unique. Wavefront systems work by measuring how light is distorted as it passes into the eye and then is reflected back. This creates an optical map of the eye, highlighting individual imperfections.
    If wavefront technology measures the human eye to develop a custom lens, then how can this be done for each patient using prescription eyewear where the know input for the custom lens is limited to Sphere, Cylinder, Axis and Prism, plus frame dimensions for alignment?

    I know the limits to customizing lenses using front molded lenses like Panamic is the limitation of traditional surfacing cutting only spherical cuts. The Physio 360 and the Seiko Succeed Internal PAL a cut by point files. I don't know the number of possiblities for the 360 but not counting prisim there are over 2,000,000 customized lenses available using the Seiko Succeed Internal PAL. Each prescription is individually mapped to the available information. Physio 360 does not have access to a map of the cornea for each patient and therefore can not be custom made to match each patients cornea, which is what most eyecare professionals have come to understand Wavefront technology does. It is my opinion the some cleaver marketing is going on with the use ot the term W.A.V.E. Technology. Notice the periods in the marketing material after the W.A.V.E.

    I am naturally open to seeing opposing or additional views on this W.A.V. E. Front technology from Essilor. (I am not saying anything negative about the quality of the Physio lens as I have not done any testing on this lens)

  11. #11
    Master OptiBoarder
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Columbus, Ohio
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    758
    I think it's great that a lot of you like the lens, I however am not sold yet. I have yet to be proven too that it's any better. I think it's just another ploy by essilor to get their lenses sold, even if it's not better. Someone once said awhile back on here...why don't they just improve the lenses we already use instead of creating more and more new lenses. It would make sense you would think. I think most of what all these manufacturers say nowadays is bologna.

  12. #12
    Rising Star Bezza's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Plymouth UK
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    70
    Quote Originally Posted by AWTECH
    Bezza:

    http://www.lasikinstitute.org/Wavefront_Technology.html Eye Surgery Education Council:

    If wavefront technology measures the human eye to develop a custom lens, then how can this be done for each patient using prescription eyewear where the know input for the custom lens is limited to Sphere, Cylinder, Axis and Prism, plus frame dimensions for alignment?

    I know the limits to customizing lenses using front molded lenses like Panamic is the limitation of traditional surfacing cutting only spherical cuts. The Physio 360 and the Seiko Succeed Internal PAL a cut by point files. I don't know the number of possiblities for the 360 but not counting prisim there are over 2,000,000 customized lenses available using the Seiko Succeed Internal PAL. Each prescription is individually mapped to the available information. Physio 360 does not have access to a map of the cornea for each patient and therefore can not be custom made to match each patients cornea, which is what most eyecare professionals have come to understand Wavefront technology does. It is my opinion the some cleaver marketing is going on with the use ot the term W.A.V.E. Technology. Notice the periods in the marketing material after the W.A.V.E.

    I am naturally open to seeing opposing or additional views on this W.A.V. E. Front technology from Essilor. (I am not saying anything negative about the quality of the Physio lens as I have not done any testing on this lens)
    hrm some interesting points there, I don't really know about the Seiko Succeed so I cant really say much about that. Of course you are correct that without a map of the patients cornea the 360 does have some limitation but unless Essilor are being extremely clever about their marketing the fact remains that the 360 does something that no other lens on the market does. Although im sure that other manufacturers use very similar technologies to design their lenses and the wide range of ILDs offer compensated back surfaces but to be able to compensate both surfaces in combination to further optimise the wavefront is something altogether unique. I had some rather lengthy chats with some of the technical guys from Essilor while at the launch and they were really excited at the possibilities offered by this new technology. In theory this means that they now have the ability to put varying amounts of sph, cyl, prism on either/both surfaces and in any fashion they think will help to achieve better acuity, comfort and field of vision.
    Personally I think that the physio 360 is more than just another lens design with a bit of tweaking to the amount and position of unwanted astigmatism like the countless others we have had in the past, but hey suppose I better wait and see what my patients think of it too before i get too excited.

  13. #13
    Allen Weatherby OptiBoard Gold Supporter
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Florida
    Occupation
    Other Optical Manufacturer or Vendor
    Posts
    1,285

    Marketing Marketing Marketing, please some science!

    Bezza:
    Although im sure that other manufacturers use very similar technologies to design their lenses and the wide range of ILDs offer compensated back surfaces but to be able to compensate both surfaces in combination to further optimise the wavefront is something altogether unique. I had some rather lengthy chats with some of the technical guys from Essilor while at the launch and they were really excited at the possibilities offered by this new technology. In theory this means that they now have the ability to put varying amounts of sph, cyl, prism on either/both surfaces and in any fashion they think will help to achieve better acuity, comfort and field of vision.
    Think about the advantage of compensating both surfaces. If designing the lens could be done with a spherical front curve and the light waves are designed to be refracted throught the lens to optimize the vision rather than putting some non spherical surfaces on both sides of the lense, there is a big advantage. The lens can be edged to fit the frame curve without overhange around a portion of the lens.

    Also consider that Essilor does not have access to the patent that allows progressives to be produced on the back surface of a spherical lens. If they could do it this way I would bet they would and all of the marketing material would tell you how much better a backside individualized lens is. The keyhole effect. Stand 10 away from a keyhole in a door. What can you see through the keyhole? Now go up to the door and put you eye up to the keyhole; wow a wide field of vision. This is a simple example of the advantage to a backside design.

  14. #14
    OptiBoard Apprentice
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Middletown
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    10

    Thumbs up 1st physio dispense...

    Dispensed 1st pair of Physio lenses successfully and the patient had no real pros or cons but did say she could see clearly through all the zones. I will add feedback if I get any. Good Luck.

  15. #15
    OptiBoardaholic
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Indonesia
    Occupation
    Optical Laboratory Technician
    Posts
    250

    Zeiss Individual

    Quote Originally Posted by neo724
    Dispensed 1st pair of Physio lenses successfully and the patient had no real pros or cons but did say she could see clearly through all the zones. I will add feedback if I get any. Good Luck.
    Have you ever compared with Zeiss Individual?

  16. #16
    OptiBoard Apprentice
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Middletown
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    10
    No my office does not use many zeiss products.

  17. #17
    Banned Jim Stone's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Point Barrow
    Occupation
    Lens Manufacturer
    Posts
    340
    Physio=Definity. Same thing.

  18. #18
    Allen Weatherby OptiBoard Gold Supporter
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Florida
    Occupation
    Other Optical Manufacturer or Vendor
    Posts
    1,285

    Same thing?

    Jim Stone said:
    Physio=Definity. Same thing.
    If you mean they are both progressive designs then same is accurate. If you mean they are both the same designs this in not the case. Essilor developed the Physio which is a traditional front side PAL and Definity was developed by Johnson & Johnson. Essilor purchased the J&J lens business while they were about to launch the new Physio product.

    There is also a product called the Physio 360 which is a partial front side progressive and partial backside progressive. This is similar to the J&J Definity approach in that the Definity has a part of the add on the front.

    It is my belief that the only reason both the Physio and the Definity have part on the front and part on the back is because they can not put the progressive all on the back of a sphere because this technology is patented by another company.

  19. #19
    One of the worst people here
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Canada
    Occupation
    Other Eyecare-Related Field
    Posts
    8,330
    Quote Originally Posted by AWTECH
    Jim Stone said:

    If you mean they are both progressive designs then same is accurate. If you mean they are both the same designs this in not the case. Essilor developed the Physio which is a traditional front side PAL and Definity was developed by Johnson & Johnson. Essilor purchased the J&J lens business while they were about to launch the new Physio product.

    There is also a product called the Physio 360 which is a partial front side progressive and partial backside progressive. This is similar to the J&J Definity approach in that the Definity has a part of the add on the front.

    It is my belief that the only reason both the Physio and the Definity have part on the front and part on the back is because they can not put the progressive all on the back of a sphere because this technology is patented by another company.
    Who has the patent

  20. #20
    Allen Weatherby OptiBoard Gold Supporter
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Florida
    Occupation
    Other Optical Manufacturer or Vendor
    Posts
    1,285

    Patent info

    ICE-TECH Advanced Lens Technologies has an agreement that allows us to produce lenses using manufactured undered processes covered by US Patent No. 6,019, 470. This patent is controlled by Seiko Epson Corp.

    We are the first in the US to offer the Seiko Succeed full backside progressive lens, (which is produced using processes covered by this patent). In addition we are developing other progressive designs that will be available ICE-TECH Polarized Lenses.

    We are a smaller niche lens company with unique products produced in our own high tech facility using our own processes. This technology uses freeform lens processing. We do not use any traditional lens production methods.

  21. #21
    OptiBoard Novice
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    canada
    Occupation
    Other Optical Manufacturer or Vendor
    Posts
    2

    Physio360 amoung others...

    Physio 360 (among many others) is an improvement to normal front side progressives. However, they do not surface the front side. It is a cast normal front side progressive that they say is digitally designed (marketing). The distance/intermed/near are all done on the front side (confronted essilor on this and they admitted this -pre-moulded progressive). The backside of the progressive is aspheric/atoric and that is where the freeform component comes it. This asphericity allows for less abberation in the periphery.

    Dont take my word for it. To find out if you have a front side progressive and an aspheric inside curve (physio 360 while physio is just a normal conventional prog) simply use a sag gauge on the front of the progressive in different areas and u will see that all of the progression is on the front of the lens. If you clock the back (on the two meridians) you will see that there is only the slightest amount of asphericity. An improvement or conventional progressives but by no means the holy grail. Fully internal progressive are the real deal.

    With respect to essilor claiming their fix higher order abberations well, its a marketing lie. Why? You need to know what you are correcting for. You need an abberometer which measures a persons eye and the higher order abberations therein (opthonics does this). The you can use that mapping to recreate and fix the higher order abberations. However you must ask yourself... if someone adjust their glasses or moves their eyes... that fix is out the door because that fix is at a fixed point only. Marketing is what these big vendors do best. Their staff simply spout what they are told and like to dazzle and wow people with a whole bunch of complexities that are more weighted towards marketing vs truth. That said it is definately an improvement over normal progressives, however i believe fully internal progressive (sag on front reads spherical and full progression on back) is the way to go. Overcomes the inherent weaknesses of having to look through lens material before you can even get to the active curves of the lens (the progression on the front side of progressives)

    Also there are dual patents issued in north america for fully internal progressives. Seiko has one, and so does Zeiss/Sola. This means everytime someone produces any internal progressive (their own included), they have to pay just over $3US each. This is the most probably reason why Essilor has not come out with there own fully internal yet (however i suspect they will because the patents are being fought in court). Keep in mind the Essilors and big vendors are marketing machines that know exactly how to successfully launch products and create buzz.

    Cheers,

    doclabs

  22. #22
    OptiBoard Novice
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    canada
    Occupation
    Other Optical Manufacturer or Vendor
    Posts
    2
    You are correct on all of the above except... FYI Physio360 is simply a front side progressive with an aspheric/atoric backside. There is no splitting of the progression, it is all on the front. The definity is the only one to due this to get around the patent and it is like a 0.25 add on the front (minimal as possibly).

    Cheers,

    Doclabs

  23. #23
    Always learning OptiBoard Bronze Supporter
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Wauwatosa Wi
    Occupation
    Dispensing Optician
    Posts
    3,210
    Quote Originally Posted by doclabs View Post
    You are correct on all of the above except... FYI Physio360 is simply a front side progressive with an aspheric/atoric backside. There is no splitting of the progression, it is all on the front. The definity is the only one to due this to get around the patent and it is like a 0.25 add on the front (minimal as possibly).

    Cheers,

    Doclabs
    Doclabs,

    According to the folks at Essilor (technical, not marketing) the 360 is not atoric.

    The Definity has +.75 on the front, unless Essilor has changed it (fromm the original JJ product).

    Regards,
    Robert Martellaro
    Roberts Optical Ltd.
    Wauwatosa Wi.
    www.roberts-optical.com
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    “Science is a way of trying not to fool yourself"
    -Richard Feynman
    ~~~~~~~~~~~
    A mime-free zone.

  24. #24
    Enjoying the education drk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Ohio
    Occupation
    Optometrist
    Posts
    5,747
    Robert:
    It seems like you've done some "legwork" on these new progressives.

    Would you care to summarize what you've uncovered, if it's in summary form?

    "The Martellaro Report"?

    P.S. Doesn't Pete Hanlin post here, anymore?

  25. #25
    Carl Zeiss Vision OptiBoard Corporate Sponsor
    OptiBoard Gold Supporter
    Darryl Meister's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Kansas City, Kansas, United States
    Occupation
    Lens Manufacturer
    Posts
    3,700
    As stated earlier, Varilux Physio 360 uses a traditional semi-finished front surface with an optimized Rx back surface that is produced using a typical free-form generating and polishing process.
    Darryl J. Meister, ABOM

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Free Uni-Clip for Varilux Physio order at incredible low price
    By Uni-Clip in forum Optical Marketplace
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 03-21-2006, 09:27 PM
  2. Advice on comparing Varilux Physio 360 to Zeiss Gradal Top
    By johnm98 in forum Progressive Lens Discussion Forum
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 02-07-2006, 05:46 AM
  3. Zeiss individual vs varilux physio?
    By nancy1953 in forum Progressive Lens Discussion Forum
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 01-20-2006, 07:32 AM
  4. Essilor Announces Industry Changing Progressive Addition Lens
    By Newsroom in forum Optical Industry News
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 01-13-2006, 02:17 PM
  5. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 06-21-2005, 04:01 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
OptiBoard is proudly sponsored by:
FEA Industries, Identity Optical, Younger Optics, Carl Zeiss Vision, Vision Systems, Inc. and Chemistrie Eyewear