My husband got his Physio 360 lenses today

[Happylady]

He likes them, but not better then his Sola Ones. His Sola Ones have a +2.25 add and the new Physio has a +2.50 add but otherwise they are the same rx. In fact he says the reading is slightly wider in the Sola Ones. The distance is good in both but both get a little blurry on the sides.

He does like it better then the Kodak Precise lenses he had in the frame before.

The Sola Ones are plastic and the Physio is poly.

These lenses weren't cheap, next time I will get him the Sola One again.

Anyone else have feedback on the lenses?

[AWTECH]

I assume the Sola One is not their freeform designed lens and the Physio you ordered is the 360 which is a freeform design.

For each of these lens orders what was the Rx both near and far?

What other information did you have to supply for each order?
Individual PD near? Individual PD far? Frame angle? Panto? etc.

What is the DBL of each frame? and the A and B measurement or are they both in the same frame?

Do you know what the optical center distance difference for the Sola One and the Physio 360 is? That is the distance between the near optical center and the far optical center?

Why the change in the reading addition? New Rx?

I would like to know more so I could make a determination of the differences.

[Happylady]

I assume the Sola One is not their freeform designed lens and the Physio you ordered is the 360 which is a freeform design.

For each of these lens orders what was the Rx both near and far?

What other information did you have to supply for each order?
Individual PD near? Individual PD far? Frame angle? Panto? etc.

What is the DBL of each frame? and the A and B measurement or are they both in the same frame?

Do you know what the optical center distance difference for the Sola One and the Physio 360 is? That is the distance between the near optical center and the far optical center?

Why the change in the reading addition? New Rx?

I would like to know more so I could make a determination of the differences.

I don't have his exact prescription at home, but the distance is

right eye +.75-.75 x ?
left eye +.75 -.50 x ?
Add on the old was +2.25 and the new is +2.50. It is a new rx.

His distance pd is 28/30(yeah, he has close togeather eyes). The new lenses are right on. I don't know how much the lenses decenter for close.

Frames are both 47-19 eye size but the Sola Ones are in a slightly deeper frame. The fitting height for the Physio is 19, I don't remember what the Sola Ones are but not more then 20.

I just gave the lab mono Pds and fitting heights. I sent the frame and they did the job. The Sola Ones are cr-39(not freeform) and the Physio's are poly, both with AR. The new lenses are thinner and lighter.

[AWTECH]

If these are Physio 360, I am surprised that they accepted the job without knowing more information.

If his eyes are close together the seperation of the near and far I would think can be compensated for in the "customized lens design". To make the best lens the A and B measurements could also be used. I am not sure what the Physio 360 requirements are to place an order, but if this is all of the information provided, then the production of this lens would result in a similar design to front progressive with the back spherically surfaced.

Please confirm that you ordered the Physio 360 Freeform lens design?

THE ABOVE MISSED THE FACT THAT YOU SENT THE FRAME. Sorry I did not see this when I first read your reply.

[Happylady]

Yes, the are the Physio 360's. I got a certificate of authenticity plus I have the invoice.

[AWTECH]

I was hoping that I could tell what information was needed for the Physio 360 lens production, but since you sent the frame they may or may not use any wrap or panto information in the lens design.

Based on the information provided I would think the freeform design, (which I admit that I do not have any actual knowledge of the elements used to create each design), should produce a slightly better lens viewing area than the Sola One.

Let me know his thoughts on the Physio 360 after wearing them for about three days. I would like to know how he then thinks they compare to the previous Sola One lens.

[Jubilee]

When I had my Varilux rep in, she told me that for either the Physio or the Physio 360, that only standard measurements were needed. IE.. the Seg height and PDs. It is meant to be a option between standard lenses and true Freeform, without the extra hassle or equipment needed.

Cassandra

[AWTECH]

So this Physio 360 can be produced with standard Rx information.

Can it also be produced with compensation for wrap and tilt?

Can it be produced with different near/far distances? such as a 13mm distance between the near and far? or in a larger frame a 15mm distance between the near and far?

I know as new freeform designs become available a better understanding of what can be made with different levels of custom fitting, however at the present time I am curious as to what Essilor is offering and how well have they been able to communicate what they have to offer.

I have read their announcements and I can not figure out what information is taken into account. I also do not understand how a technology that measures multilple beams of light for eye correction can be used to produce a lens that has any individualization to it. I could understand measuring the patients eye as an individualizied bases for producing a custom individualized lens but I don't understand how the laser technology for the eye related to a mass produced lens. Can anyone explain or do I just need to believe.

[HarryChiling]

They take into account the average frame tilt and the average vertex distance and they compensate the curves to eliminate distortion. The physio has an average freeform design on the front surface to eliminate most of the aberations that would occur for the specific range of Rx's that would be ground into that base curve. The 360 does the same however the remainder of the abberation is eliminated by the freeform process on the back side. Almost like ordering an aspheric blank to surface, you would get a different aspheric coefficient depending on the base curve you ordered and it would be optimized for the average Rx that would fit into that base lens.

[AWTECH]

Harry;

I have seen with the information on the standard Physio the word freeform used to produce these surfaces. They are talking about the front of the lens. In the case of a poly this would be the front mold used to inject the poly into that is cut using freeform technology. Correct? If so this the way mold for progressive poly lenses have been made for years.

The physio has an average freeform design on the front surface to eliminate most of the aberations that would occur for the specific range of Rx's that would be ground into that base curve.

This term Freeform, which has become a high tech optical buzz word (that you used also), is now being used in a very unique marketing stance by Essilor, this seems to imply that this new lens of theirs, the Physio, is somehow molded using a different process than their Panamic or the Ovation made with the same lens material. I would doubt this is the case however.

[HarryChiling]

I haven't actually worked on the lens or even seen one yet. I understand the design behind the lens, although like you I am slightly sceptical of the advantages the lens would offer. Only time will tell.

[Happylady]

I checked on the fitting height of my husband's Sola Ones and they are at 18.5 which is 1/2 mm lower then the Physios.

[Andrew Weiss]

I'm finding this very interesting reading, especially in light of the dialogue going on in drk's thread on progressive lens design and some of the conclusions people are reaching. Physio may be better than Comfort and Panamic, but maybe it's not always better than everything else? ;)

[drk]

Harry, I think you make a semantic mistake when you say that the regular Physio has free-form front surfaces. I think it's molded..."digitally molded" (whatever), but how they cut the molds may resemble a three-axis generator, for all I know. I think the Physio is really, really close to a conventional progressive with a lot of hype and a little tweaking of the front surface curves. I think it's "Panamic II".

I think the 360 is a lot more sophisticated.

I think we should reserve the term "free form" to a lens manufacturing process only, not a mold manufacturing process.

[AWTECH]

Freeform has generally been used to describe the manufacture of individual lenses using equipment that can cut a lens to a data point file, not a three axis spherical cutting generator.

Now Essilor is trying to associate the word "Freeform to describe the way the mold is produced for the Physio. This is probably the same way the molds were produced for the Panamic.

If someone from Essilor can explain this in a different manner than I am understanding it please do so.

I think before this move by Essilor the word "Freeform" has been used to describe the production of a lens cut to a data file. "Freeform" was starting to take on a different meaning than what it actually is. Like "Aspheric" in the opticians world means a specific type of lens, when to any knowledgeable engineer or machinist it means non-spherical, (which covers any shape that is not spherical).

[Pete Hanlin]

Physio may be better than Comfort and Panamic, but maybe it's not always better than everything else?
The experience of HappyLady's husband notwithstanding, several hundred wearers were fit in identical frame/Rx/fit between SOLAOne and Varilux Physio in a double blind study, and the results were quite encouraging. Essilor believes wearer experience is the final determination, so if the SOLAOne lenses result in better vision, then that's the better lens for him. We fit 100 ODs and Opticians in the lens following a pre-launch seminar in California, and I've heard some very positive comments from them as well.

The production methods used for Varilux Physio (360 Digital Surfacing- which incorporates a freeform manufacturing process, and a wavefront guided design) has been explained in a couple threads on the General Discussion forum.

As for wrap, panto, vertex, etc.- a lot has been made regarding the importance of incorporating these measurements into the design. I think it is informative that some of the manufacturers customizing their design to these parameters now allow dispensers to order the lenses using the "default" values for these parameters to be informative/interesting/indicative/etc of the real importance of these measurements.

HappyLady- while I can't / won't offer to remake everyone who posts to OptiBoard with a report that their lenses didn't perform to their expectations, I will extend this offer to you. If your husband has an old frame with accurate measurements (perhaps his third pair with the Kodak lenses which are now third on his list), I will be happy to have some 1.67 Varilux Physio lenses made for him in the R&D laboratory- just out of personal curiosity.

If he is interested, just email me at phanlin@essilorusa.com, and I'll be happy to get the necessary frame/Rx/fitting information from you and supply you with the address to send the frame to for processing.

[Happylady]

Pete, I sent you an e-mail.

I'm sorry if I seem to be putting down your new lens, I have used Varilux lenses many times over the years and find them to be great progressives. I guess I was just expecting more from this lens.

I find it interesting they did a double blind study against the Sola One. Did they do a double blind study against many other lenses too? If you can, tell me how many people perfered the Physio? Did the prescription seem to make a difference?

I think it is very kind of you to offer to make him a new pair, but the Physio lenses he has are fit correctly. The fiiting crosses are right over his pupils. Would the 1.67 Physio be better then the poly Physio 360s?
Again, I am sorry if it seems like I am putting down your newest lens.

[lensgeek]

Dr. K,

In a nutshell, Free-form technology is when xyz points are applied at the same time the Rx is applied to the lens.....this would eliminate initial production molds completely.....
Digitally applying a progressive design to production molds has been around for the past 4-5 years....Physio/ Physio-360 and Definity lenses do not fall into the catagory of "Free-form technology"
Full customization of a progressive lens can only be acheived if we are starting from scratch (SV lens blank) while placing all lens parameters closest to the eye.
Thanks for "getting it"

[drk]

Thanks for posting, and welcome.