Lenscrafters employee moral conundrum

[Jubilee]

At the time this all went down, and even in 2003 when I had the first round with them, I made sure I was in contact with Steve Machol. He informed the moderators at the time what had occured, and I pm'd the LC employees I knew of on the board to be careful and shared my experience.

Steve wanted to make a post, and publicly show his support of me at that time. I on the other hand was a still a bit apprehensive, and my hubby was even more so. So I declined at the time.

What I was told at that point, was that any participation on this forum can be contrued as a violation of the company confidentiality agreement. They more actively look for negative information, but I was told on the 4 seperate occasions that I asked, that it didn't matter what I said, it was my participation that caused my termination. When I inquired about the fate of the other LC participants, I was told their day would come. That it always start with one person...

Now whether that is true or not.. well I certainly know the same opticians I forewarned then are alive and well and to my knowledge still at the LC. Which I would rather that be the case than not, unless it was their decision to move on.

Cassandra

[rbaker]

Cassandra,

Sorry to hear your story, but, ye Gods girl, what were you thinking! I mean did it not ever occur to you that anything you said could be used against you in a management action. Did your employer have any policy regarding employee conduct in any public forum. Now you know why Zorro wore a mask.

I am now going to read you your work place “Miranda” rights:

• Anything that you say, write, or imply to anyone can be used against you as sufficient cause for your dismissal or legal or civil action.

• Every stroke on any of our computer keyboards is recorded, stored for eternity and can be used against you as sufficient cause for your dismissal or legal or civil action.

• In any of the above situations we are right and you are wrong. If you want to take a “Whistle Blowers” action be aware that you and your Danny Donut lawyer will be facing the finest legal team that our unlimited resources can bring to bear.

I hope your story will help some other individuals on this board to realize that they may someday be held accountable for their posts.

I am glad that all worked out for the best for you.

[CME4SPECS]

I am so happy to be self-employed!

[Aarlan]

I happened to enjoy my time at LC immensely...

Back to the original thread, I find another aspect of this person's story somewhat troubling. This person owned up to doing something wrong and expected a pat on the back. When did it become an expectation of someone who has done something wrong that if the person admitted their wrongdoing they were magically exempt from the consequences.?

AA

[QDO1]

perhaps this is the answer to Chris Rysers comment in another thread about why people use psudonyms

[QDO1]

some advice.

• Use a psudonym on the internet
• never mention your own town name, or comany name, or your own name
• never mention a coleagues name
• never discuss your companies sensitive policies, or financial data, whlie (or after) you work for them
• you are a indididual, not a corporate cog
• if you decide to ignore the above, then be forthright with your association with a company, and then never offer a negative or positive comment about your comanys, or any other companies products or policies, and stick to the known facts. Also, in this respect, be forthright with your company, and tell them you decide to repersent the name of "Acme Lens Co" on the internet
• if you must air a view on a company policy, open a new username, and use your home PC
• do not use your work PC without permission, and know that your emails, and browsing history, and posts might as well be common knowlege to a clued up IT dept

[Jubilee]

Cassandra,

Sorry to hear your story, but, ye Gods girl, what were you thinking! I mean did it not ever occur to you that anything you said could be used against you in a management action. Did your employer have any policy regarding employee conduct in any public forum. Now you know why Zorro wore a mask.

NO.. the company does not state in their associate handbook, in the Policies and Procedures manual, or in their ethics policy that it is against company policy to post or participate on any public forum, online or otherwise.

It did occur to me that the company could take action against me. Considering that 99% of my posts were in support of the company, and I shared knowledge I learned here about products, tips on dispensing and such to increase our customer satisfaction and was told many times that my optical knowledge and product knowledge was exceptional.. and appreciated. I thought of this forum as being a positive .. to both me and the company as well.

I never revealled any numbers (breakage, sales, OI, etc.) and I never said anything out right bad about the company. The one thing I did do was ask about the chemicals I was exposed to, and what possible reprocussions were since none of the doctors in this area were familiar with handling someone who had "industrial bronchitis" due to acute exposure to lab chemicals. I was being accused of "faking" it and taking the company for a ride by my GM. At first I was discrete in my inquiry, but after seeing other posts made asking about health risks in the optical, and not getting any information from my employer on whether I was going to be able to return to lab work, or if I should indeed take the advice I was given by store management and "perhaps I should look for a new employer." (given to me before I had even had a chance to see someone familiar with industrial bronchitis, or any doctor besides the "urgent care" facility...) I decided to heck with it, and try to get as much knowledge and info as possible. I figured if I gave them almost a month to respond to me, caused me several of hundreds of dollars in lost wages (workman's comp only pays 60%) and was being told I either needed to transfer to a dead end store, or leave the company.. I gave them long enough to respond and I needed answers.

Do I think that I was 100% right in my actions? I admitted that I was to blame for part of the situation. It was only when I was being told I was completely at fault and even accused of causing the situation to begin with that I got irked and fought back. It may have cost me my job.. but their loss, not mine.

I don't hate LensCrafters, and I still have friends and family who work and shop there. I don't blame the entire company, only a few individuals. I never used their computers for anything other than company use.. all posts were made at my own home.

I was given the opportunity to leave via the backdoor. I declined. I gathered my stuff, told my fellow associates goodbye and goodluck, and walked out the door head held high.

Cassandra

[Hawthrn]

I have to commend you Cassandra on your actions. It seems that you followed the right course of action. You were given a bad rap, and in the time that I spent at LC thats not the first horror story of this calliber that I've heard. You did the right thing, and im sure that you and your familly are much happier for it.

In response to another thread, Im not looking for a pat on the back for doing the wrong thing. Yes, I was mislead and should have followed my own morals and concience. If I had done that, life in the lab would have become very difficult.

Fist, I would like to clarify that I am not a licensed optician. I beleive that someone mentioned that I was. I went through the earn as you learn program. The ALM was slow to promote, and was drunk (by his own admission) most of the time, but I acheived certified tech. Oh, yeah, the GM knew that the ALM was a dirty boy but they were very close friends and he was very good at kissing up to the right people......namly the RQC. The GM did nothing even after REPEATED written complaints from the employees about the ALM. The turn over rate in the lab was terrible because the ALM would not train the new employees. At one point, we had no lab staff, the Lead tech had just been fired, and the ALM was on vacation leaving me to work open to close in the lab for two weeks. Im not making any of this up, it's all documented.

As Cassandra pointed out, there are good people working at LC. But, again, I was not working with them. To bad I guess, I probably would have learned more about how good managers and leaders should act in a corprate setting. I did, however, learn a very valuable and important lesson from all of this: How managers and leaders should'nt act.

[Bev Heishman]

I understand what you are saying. You were working for a large corporation which has specific policies. I work for a smaller organization which has over 40 employees plus providers. Regardless of your personal feeilngs there are policies that need to be followed regardless of a superiors inadverdance to follow them. You are a direct reflection of the corporation when you are employed and receiving a salary & benefits, on and off the clock. Much of this is covered in an employment manual which is received early on. Ethics in business reveal how you are perceived and should always be considered.

[Hawthrn]

Yes, My Gm did direct me to take frames out of GOS. :(

[Spexvet]

Cassandra,

IMHO, you were not terminated for posting on OB. You were terminated for questioning the safety procedures regarding chemical disposal. I remember the thread. I posted:

Cassandra,
Do not, I repeat, DO NOT voice any concerns about chemical safety to a superior, if you want to be "in good standing" at LC.

You are not the first person to "leave LC" (voluntarily or involuntarily), after opposing the "we'll just blow a fan on the aluminum pie plate containing the coating refuse, and it'll just go away". I'm looking forward to the class action suit that someone will eventually initiate.

Bottom line: LC doesn't like opposition. Don't ask questions. If they tell you the emporer is wearing new clothes, don't point out his nakedness.

BTW, your manager telling you that you might want to find work elsewhere is called "constructive dismissal". You may very well be elligible for compensation just for that, not to mention wrongful termination. Do you feel that you were working in a hostile environment? If you feel that you've been wronged, give LC human resources a call and rattle them a little. There's nothing better than seeing a regional manager, who thinks he's important, quiver at the thought of a law suit. :D

"Guard your words and actions" is a phrase that I learned while at LC. What kind of corporate philosophy is that?

I am not a lawyer, or in human resources, and I don't play one on television.

[Spexvet]

Yes, My Gm did direct me to take frames out of GOS. :(

Dude, that needs to be reported.

[GOS_Queen]

Dude, that needs to be reported.

I agree.

[Chris Ryser]

some advice.

• Use a psudonym on the internet
• never mention your own town name, or comany name, or your own name
• never mention a coleagues name
• never discuss your companies sensitive policies, or financial data, whlie (or after) you work for them
• you are a indididual, not a corporate cog

I would agree that above advice is valid for postings on a forum if it concerns protection of your personal privacy as a corporate or other employee, specially when you do your postings on employers time.

However the validity of your postings might be strongly reduced by hiding behind a pseudonym. And if you are of the believe that nobody could find out who you are and from where you do your postings, you still believe in fairytales. I an case of need you could be placed and verified in minutes.

I have my own reasons to post under my proper name and try not to offend anybody personally and so far it has worked fine.

I know that many of the optiboarders, that are hiding behind the mask are in higher positions in corporations or in their own business and are watching the action like hawks to react when they get concerned.

[QDO1]

I would agree that above advice is valid for postings on a forum if it concerns protection of your personal privacy as a corporate or other employee, specially when you do your postings on employers time.

However the validity of your postings might be strongly reduced by hiding behind a pseudonym. And if you are of the believe that nobody could find out who you are and from where you do your postings, you still believe in fairytales. I an case of need you could be placed and verified in minutes.

I have my own reasons to post under my proper name and try not to offend anybody personally and so far it has worked fine.

I know that many of the optiboarders, that are hiding behind the mask are in higher positions in corporations or in their own business and are watching the action like hawks to react when they get concerned.

well the choice is quite blunt - are you here to repersent yourself, and your company - and some clearly are - and in that case, it is absoloutley fine to say hey my name is Joe Blogs, and my Co. is Acme Trading and our position is... ON the otherhand, if you work for a large corporate, or a big lens company, but you are not in the postion to repersent your companies views, then post under a psudonym.

I am an internet expert/professional (in terms of servers and networking and internet security) Trust me, if I wanted to have a different IP address for each log on, or posting, or just after each 30 seconds that elapsed... I could have that set up in 10 miniutes. If you had access to the server log files, and I wanted to be anonomous, I could do it, you really wouldnt be able to pin me down to a ISP, server or country. I could mask the page I leave the site too, and the page I come to the site from. My computer could broadcast different browser and OS details each time etc.. So being anonomous on the internet is possible. I choose not to, but I could.

the thing about public posting, is that your boss, or his boss could be reading and contributing to the same debate or post. this is what you have to bear in mind

The thing about using your work PC is to remember your companies IT Dept is much more boned up on being deviant, than you ever be. IT geeks are born deviant, and know all of the tricks, before you even think about them. THey can probrably look at your desktop while you are using it, without you ever knowing

[Jubilee]

Cassandra,

IMHO, you were not terminated for posting on OB. You were terminated for questioning the safety procedures regarding chemical disposal. I remember the thread. I posted:



You are not the first person to "leave LC" (voluntarily or involuntarily), after opposing the "we'll just blow a fan on the aluminum pie plate containing the coating refuse, and it'll just go away". I'm looking forward to the class action suit that someone will eventually initiate.

Bottom line: LC doesn't like opposition. Don't ask questions. If they tell you the emporer is wearing new clothes, don't point out his nakedness.

BTW, your manager telling you that you might want to find work elsewhere is called "constructive dismissal". You may very well be elligible for compensation just for that, not to mention wrongful termination. Do you feel that you were working in a hostile environment? If you feel that you've been wronged, give LC human resources a call and rattle them a little. There's nothing better than seeing a regional manager, who thinks he's important, quiver at the thought of a law suit. :D

"Guard your words and actions" is a phrase that I learned while at LC. What kind of corporate philosophy is that?

I am not a lawyer, or in human resources, and I don't play one on television.

In the letter I wrote to my upper management and corporate about the situation I indeed used the terms hostile environment, and simply stated that I knew there are ways to get rid of people if you want to bad enough.

I did seek counsel on the situation and I was advised that while certainly there was enough there to make a case in most states, that since Indiana is an AT WILL state, they could have fired me for not liking my shoes, and it was ok. Not ethical, but certainly legal.

But according to my official termination notice, "Violating the company confidentiality agreement by participating in discussions on the Optiboard" was the reason for termination.

[Hawthrn]

Dude, that needs to be reported.

Yeah, I did report that, but it was far to late. The RQC told me at the time that it seems like I was being vengfull and vindictive. I told him absolutly everything, Right down to them flushing the poly waste down the toilet on occasion because the ALM had'nt cured it for a week or two before an RQC lab visit. I don't think he beleived me.

[Jubilee]

As I posted before.. call 1-800- Lux Help. Or send me the information about the store, and I will have one of the other Lux associates I know report it.


Cassandra

[DPalmer]

I would definately report everything you saw or have claimed to the people at LC . I mean really what do you have to lose just be warned it probably won't make a difference it will probably come off as oh well he was fired so he may not be telling the truth unless you have documented anything . Which I'm guessing is the case but hey go rattle their cages and see what happens you already don't have a job there any longer so why not .
Good Luck

[Judy Canty]

Having watched this thread unfold, I will offer my advice for what it's worth. Stealing is wrong, even with a wink and a nod from your management team. As Cassandra can tell you, LC monitors what's posted here, so telling them again won't make a bit of difference. Involving other parties to make your point is, well...pointless. Don't look back. Focusing on the negatives, however numerous they are, only impedes your forward progress. It's time to move on.

[drk]

A quick story:

When I was in Opt college (WHICH SHALL REMAIN NAMELESS, MIND YOU) we had something like GOS. We'd volunteer to go through countless boxes and "twist" lenses, looking to eliminate those that had a cylindrical component, and possibly multifocals, IIRC. (At that time, the protocol that was used in the program was to do a best sphere retinoscopy, and provide best-sphere corrections.) Needless to say, three of four glasses got thrown into the trash.

Now at this time (WHICH SHALL REMAIN UNSPECIFIED, MIND YOU), vintage/retro was coming into vogue, and there were surely some cool Ronsirs/Shurons/etc. going into the trash. These were often-times made into Rx or sunwear as a "fringe benefit" by the Opt students. This was not wrong, IMO, but I'm not so sure that all the "cool" frames were hand neutralized before becoming private property.

Not good, but not uncommon, I'm sure.

[Judy Canty]

Lions Clubs International has collected and recycled eyewear of any Rx for many years. We recognize that something is better than nothing. What a shame that no one thought to donate the "unuseable" eyewear to the local Lions Clubs.

[Ed_Optician]

While working at a Community College We recieved boxes and boxes of glasses from New Eyes For The Needy. Our students neutralized the unknown glasses as part of their lab work. As Lab Technician, I pulled out things of interest for the dispensing instructor....cemented bifocal segments etc. Glasses with slab-off etc. Students needed those to practice on and we could not afford to order lenses to make up a neutralization kit forspecialty items such as this. However I had students make simple spheres in frames both + and - based on lenses in house to replace the few frames that were reappropriated for educational purposes
Taking these donations and using them for academic purposes I believe was proper use of some of these glasses. It was not for personal use of for financial gain of anyone

Ed

[Ed_Optician]

Cassandra you were wrongly terminated. Your health was affected by their failure to provide you with proper safety gear for handling the chemical spill you were expected to clean up. THey spent more time looking for how to get rid of you than they did trying to fix the problem with the coating machinery, hazardous waste, and lack of proper protective gear. The manufactureer of the equipment should have had a drip pan with a drain so that spills could be safely collected and safely disposed of. The manufacturer/provider of the chemicals should have been hung up to dry for their crreative writing assignment called a MSDS
Hawthrn you were hung out to dry because you were the low man on the totem pole. The good ole boy network took care of themselves by firing you for doing the same thing they were guilty of. By all rights the whole lot should have been canned.
I knew a lead lab tech at LC in my days there great lab tech/apprentice optician in NJ mind you who got canned for taking practice lenses from a box marked NRV no retail value to make a pair of replacement lenses for himself. THis should not have resulted in termination.
THe assistant lab manager that fudged breakage was promoted instead of being written up partially because she was a NJ licensed optician

Welcome to the club of former LC employees

Ed

[drk]

Lions Clubs International has collected and recycled eyewear of any Rx for many years. We recognize that something is better than nothing. What a shame that no one thought to donate the "unuseable" eyewear to the local Lions Clubs.

The Lions Club is who brought the glasses in, in the first place, I believe. I don't know what they do currently, Judy. Do they take the lenses out and reuse the frames? Does someone donate the lab work and the dispensing?