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Thread: An open letter to Cindy Sheehan

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    Master OptiBoarder rbaker's Avatar
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    An open letter to Cindy Sheehan

    Passing this along for your consideration.

    Great letter from a father in Tennessee . . .
    By your actions over the past two weeks it is clear that you missed an important aspect of Civics 101: With rights come responsibilities. You certainly have the right to voice your opinion against the war in Iraq and the President's policies. You even have the right to camp outside the President's home in Crawford and demand he meet with you. Your status as a mother who has lost a child in the war also gives your words and actions a credibility and a larger audience than otherwise would be the case. Now that your supporters have given you a broad forum from which to be heard, making you a national figure, its time you considered your responsibilities to all of us. I have a daughter set to deploy to Fallujah in two weeks and I have a serious concern with how your irresponsible and short sighted actions might impact on her. She is, after all, a volunteer, like your son, and she is going in harm's way because she believes it is her responsibility to protect your rights and freedoms.

    Well meaning people like you always seem to forget the law of unintended consequences and in your vanity and arrogant self-righteousness never bother to think through what it is you are trying to do versus what you may actually accomplish. I am here to inform you, Ma'am, that you will not change the policy of our government by sitting outside Crawford making a spectacle of yourself in the name of your rights to free speech; what you will do is provide more propaganda for our enemies and cost the lives of even more brave and selfless American warriors. How long do you think it will be before you become a star on Al Jazeera? For all I know, it may have already happened. One thing is certain, though, and that is that your actions and words will further embolden a ruthless and evil enemy and more American blood will be shed and some of it will be on your hands. I pray that my daughter will not be one of them. If she is, then I will hold you and those like you partly responsible. Yes, my daughter's fate will depend mostly on her own courageous decision to serve, but only the most naīve among us can deny the impact our own words and actions here in America have in a world grown smaller by the revolution in communications technology. I am sure you believe that you are serving some great cause by putting our servicemen and women in more danger and that you can, by your irresponsible exercise of free speech, help end a policy you disagree with. Your emotion may be compelling but the reality is that you will not set in motion any process that will change or undo what has been done. The war will go on because to end it now would dishonor the sacrifice of all of our fellow countrymen who have died in the cause of fighting terrorism. Rational Americans will not allow that. Too much is at stake. Unfortunately, shallow and irrational ones, such as yourself, will continue to put the lives of our sons and daughters in danger by aiding and abetting an enemy who sees propagandizing in the mass media as its main weapon in a war it could otherwise not win standing on its own wretched and evil justification of radical Islam, or by force of arms. You, Ma'am, have joined forces with an evil you neither understand nor apparently have tried to comprehend. You direct your anger toward our country while the enemy plots to kill and maim the innocent. You make a mockery of responsible free speech while thousands of young men and women fight desperately to preserve your safety. Instead of honoring your son's sacrifice you are inspired to comfort an evil enemy. you clearly do not understand the challenge we face as a nation and have not tried to put it in historical perspective. It is a sad fact that it is those of your thinking that have led us to where we are today. Decades of appeasement to these haters of everything we hold dear has cost thousands of American lives from Beirut to New York and in dozens of other forgotten places. Remember Lockerbie? The Achille Lauro? The USS Cole? We as a people were dragged into this war, much like December 7th, 1941, and we must fight and win it wherever the enemy hides and against whomever would support him. Make no mistake about Iraq. It is both a legitimate and crucial campaign in this much larger, global war of radical Islam's making. These people hate us for who we are, not what we have done. We did not bring this on ourselves, as many would have us believe, by our policies and actions abroad. We brought this on ourselves in 1775 when the Founding Fathers embarked on a course of freedom, tolerance, and liberal democratic and social ideals.

    These haters of all we hold dear strive to destroy forever a government "of the people, by the people, and for the people" that Abraham Lincoln hoped would never "Perish from the earth". They would replace it with an oppressive world theocracy unlike anything modern history has ever seen for its ruthless disregard for personal freedom and liberty. If more appeasement is your answer for an alternative policy, spare us. We have suffered enough from cowardice and inaction.

    An historical analogy screams to be let out here. It is one of two men, both named Chamberlain. Joshua Lawrence Chamberlain, a school teacher turned soldier in the American Civil War, found himself in the crosshairs of history on a warm July day in 1863 on a small hill in Pennsylvania. Commanding the 20th Maine Regiment on the extreme Union left at Gettysburg he was in a most perilous position. Should he fail to hold against a strong Confederate attack, the Union could be lost. You see, he was serving in an increasingly unpopular war at home against a resurgent enemy, and for a President fighting for his political life. Colonel Chamberlain, stoic but determined, refused to yield. His small regiment held against an onslaught of Confederate attacks, an action many historians believe turned the tide of the war. He was later awarded the Congressional Medal of Honor. The other half of this analogy focuses on Neville Chamberlain, Prime Minister of Great Britain in the years preceding World War II. His story is widely known.

    Through his policy of appeasement and a lack of moral courage, he handed Adolf Hitler much of Europe. Which side of history have you chosen, Ma'am? Your son died in the service of freedom and my daughter will go in harm's way to protect and preserve it. Honor their sacrifice, Ma'am, by exercising it responsibly.

    I will pray with you and I will grieve with you but I will not stand by silent while you needlessly and arrogantly endanger the life of my daughter and her comrades in arms. Please bless us with your silence and go home.

    Brantley Smith
    Proud father of a United States Marine
    Tullahoma, TN

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    Extremely well written, a great point this gentleman brings up and with class and understanding, I would love the opportunity to greet this man with a hug and handshake, handshake out of respect, hug out of love for him and his couragous daughter.

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    Master OptiBoarder karen's Avatar
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    OOOOH RAH and Semper Fi!
    Let the refining and improving of your own life keep you so busy that you have little time to criticize others. -H. Jackson Brown Jr.

    If the only tool you have is a hammer you will approach every problem as though it were a nail

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    Pomposity! Spexvet's Avatar
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    The author of this piece is WAY out of line.

    The blood of our military will be on the hands of those who made the faulty decision to invade Iraq, not on Ms. Sheehan.

    This man compares this war to our Civil War and WWII. There are times when a war is necessary, and this is not one of those times.

    I admire our military personnel who put their lives on the line, in fact I respect them so much that I would like them to stay alive. I recommend that all those who support the war put their words into action, join the military and go fight in Iraq.

    More deaths don't "honor" those who have already died.

    Opposing a war like this is responsible, patriotic action, like opposing slavery was.

    But I rant....
    ...Just ask me...

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    sub specie aeternitatis Pete Hanlin's Avatar
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    I think the gentleman may have stretched just a bit by stating that Cindy Sheehan could potentially "cost the lives of even more brave and selfless American warriors." First, I don't believe the terrorists over in Iraq give a second thought to how Americans feel about the war. Second, even if they did, I don't believe they can step up their destructive behavior any more than its current level.

    That said, I don't think he was "WAY out of line," either. Basically, Cindy Sheehan has set herself up as a spokesperson and as a public figure. Once you set yourself up as a public figurehead (she left behind her persona as "grieving mother" when she bought into the media claptrap that only too eagerly surrounded her to give her a louder voice), you are going to be open to criticism. You see, Free Speech works both ways (annoying, isn't it).

    Cindy Sheehan is over her head- as I would also be if I were given a microphone with the wattage and reach with which she has been supplied. I suspect that, as I got caught up in making statements, defending myself, etc., I would also begin to make increasingly inane comments.

    Likewise, the individuals on the opposing side who have set themselves up as spokespersons (interestingly enough, with less media coverage) are making some pretty undefendable statements (and this letter contains a few). This whole media experiment is some sort of sick test of "reality news" (meant as a pun in the worst sense). Sensing that the American public has become immune to the editorialising the media does while ostensibly supplying us with "the news," the media has figured out that putting a non-media face to their spin might get more traction. The results have been hideous.

    Also, the statement "there are times when war is necessary- this isn't one of those times" is interesting. After all, who gets to determine when a war is necessary? In our country, that responsibility falls upon the executive and legislative branches. There's been an election since we entered into armed conflict in Iraq, and the administration was re-elected. In 3 years, the American public will elect a new administration. At that time, I'm sure this war will be a (hopefully in the past sense) issue upon which the candidates will debate.

    Opposing war is patriotic? Well, its certainly a right afforded under our Constitution. Whether or not it is patriotic, well I suppose patriotism can have different meanings for different people. If one feels they are expressing "love or devotion for their country" (definition of patriotism) by opposing an armed conflict in which their army is currently engaged, then that is- by definition- patriotic. I personally don't feel that is an apt expression of devotion to my country, but I believe there are some who do (i.e., I don't think opposers to the war are unpatriotic- they just have a different view of patriotism than I do).

    In summation, I have to wonder if Cindy Sheehan is still in this whole media circus out of devotion to her son's memory. It seems to me that was left behind a few weeks back- but grief leads people to actions that are hard to understand by people who are not experiencing the same grief.

    PS- There were plenty of individuals living in the colonies who opposed the Revolutionary War... were they patriotic? If they felt that life under British rule was best for the colonies, I suppose they were.
    Pete Hanlin, ABOM
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    Terroists do care what Americans feel about the war, they know we do not have the stomach to see our young people come home in body bags week after week. In fact that was the whole point of 9/11, the London bombings, the Madrid bombings.

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    sub specie aeternitatis Pete Hanlin's Avatar
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    I would think our responses to the 9/11 attacks should be some indication to terrorists regarding what kind of reaction and resolve the American people have to this kind of atrocity.
    Pete Hanlin, ABOM
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    Pomposity! Spexvet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Hanlin
    ...
    Also, the statement "there are times when war is necessary- this isn't one of those times" is interesting. After all, who gets to determine when a war is necessary? In our country, that responsibility falls upon the executive and legislative branches.
    That may be true, but I should be the one to determine when a war is necessary. ;)

    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Hanlin
    There's been an election since we entered into armed conflict in Iraq, and the administration was re-elected. In 3 years, the American public will elect a new administration. At that time, I'm sure this war will be a (hopefully in the past sense) issue upon which the candidates will debate.
    Bush may have been re-elected for other reasons, though I can't imagine what they might be. Let's look at a poll that measures the war, not all the other issues that one should consider when electing a president:

    "Nearly three-quarters of Americans say the number of casualties in Iraq is unacceptable, while two-thirds say the U.S. military there is bogged down and nearly six in 10 say the war was not worth fighting"

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...060700296.html


    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Hanlin
    Opposing war is patriotic? Well, its certainly a right afforded under our Constitution. Whether or not it is patriotic, well I suppose patriotism can have different meanings for different people. If one feels they are expressing "love or devotion for their country" (definition of patriotism) by opposing an armed conflict in which their army is currently engaged, then that is- by definition- patriotic. I personally don't feel that is an apt expression of devotion to my country, but I believe there are some who do (i.e., I don't think opposers to the war are unpatriotic- they just have a different view of patriotism than I do).
    So, to be a patriot, you must support EVERYTHING that your country does? That means, at certain times in our country's history, you would have supported slavery, Japanese internment camps, dropping the atomic bomb on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, Jim Crow laws, slavery, stripping Native Americans of their land, freedom, and dignity, the Viet Nam War, assassinating foreign leaders, withholding the vote from women, making it unlawful to marry between different races and religions, and slavery (to name a few)? Hopefully, at the next republican convention, you won't be invited to drink the Koolaid!;) The Nazis had the same mindset.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Hanlin
    PS- There were plenty of individuals living in the colonies who opposed the Revolutionary War... were they patriotic? If they felt that life under British rule was best for the colonies, I suppose they were.
    Were they opposed to the war because they supported British rule, or because, as children, they were told not hit, to use their words?
    ...Just ask me...

  9. #9
    Master OptiBoarder chm2023's Avatar
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    I am in the ridiculous position of quoting myself, but I will point out this letter illustrates what I see as the emerging doctrine of the RWPM and noted in the "Iraqi Constitution" thread: the war in Iraq (if/when lost, meaning the end game is civil war and eventually a fundamentalist Islamic state) will be positioned as the fault of the people who opposed it. Note this puts war supporters in the enviable position of heads I win, tails you lose.

    The letter itself is fairly rife with foolishness, my favorite being the implied comparison between W and Lincoln. And why is it whenever their sort of discussion comes up, someone plays the Hitler card? Give it a rest already.

    Ms Sheehan has been dealt one of life's worst, possibly the worst, blows--a child preceeding her in death. If this crusade gives her comfort and purpose, good for her. I do agree the press treating her like the Delphic Oracle is really over the top.

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    Pomposity! Spexvet's Avatar
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    Do you think the escalation of attacks this summer has been in a sort of "we'll show him" response to Dick Cheney's assertion that the Iraq insurgency was "in the last throes"?
    ...Just ask me...

  11. #11
    sub specie aeternitatis Pete Hanlin's Avatar
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    I will point out this letter illustrates what I see as the emerging doctrine of the RWPM and noted in the "Iraqi Constitution" thread: the war in Iraq (if/when lost, meaning the end game is civil war and eventually a fundamentalist Islamic state) will be positioned as the fault of the people who opposed it. Note this puts war supporters in the enviable position of heads I win, tails you lose.
    First, I don't think we will "lose" the war in Iraq. As long as the eventual government is one that exists with the consent of the Iraqis- and chooses to recognize all the rights of all citizens (a poll of Iraqis showed 66% in favor of granting women civil rights- what a concept)- the Iraqi people will have "won." As long as the resultant government participates in global relations with anything short of the contempt shown by its former regime, the US (and our allies and, well, others) will have "won." Also, I don't see the administration demonizing opposers of the war. Of course one isn't going to embrace people who call you a murderer, war-mongerer, etc.- but I've yet to see the President attempt to place any blame for the difficulties we are facing in Iraq on protesters.

    Bush may have been re-elected for other reasons, though I can't imagine what they might be.
    This reminds me of a quote given by a Californian the day after the election ("I don't understand how he could have won- I don't know anyone who voted for him!") Of COURSE the war was a huge issue during the election (not the only one, but one of the main issues indicated by exit polling).

    Let's look at a poll that measures the war, not all the other issues that one should consider when electing a president:

    "Nearly three-quarters of Americans say the number of casualties in Iraq is unacceptable, while two-thirds say the U.S. military there is bogged down and nearly six in 10 say the war was not worth fighting"
    If we lived in a pure democracy, this might hold more water- but we live in a representative republic. Meaning, we elect politicians to make decisions without having to take a public referendum every couple days. Our public referendum is every 2, 6, or 4 years- depending upon the office. Most of the American population opposed US entry into WWI and WWII (until the Lusitania sinking and Pearl Harbor attack, respectively). A pretty solid case could be made that the US should have entered those conflicts earlier.

    So, to be a patriot, you must support EVERYTHING that your country does?
    Actually, I was arguing the exact opposite. Being patriotic means loving your country. If that means protesting a war that you feel endangers (or is generally not in the best interest of) your country, then you can oppose a war and still be perfectly patriotic. A lot of the rhetoric I hear from protesters doesn't appear to spring from a love of one's country, however. Many protesters seem bent on describing our country as "evil oppressors." Also, I fail to see how protesting outside a veteran's hospital, or meeting returning soldiers with jeers is expressing love for one's country (I'm not saying all protesters engage in this type of behavior, but I visited Times Square during our initial invasion and certainly saw a lot of loathing for our country among those participating). In short, protesting this war isn't something I would consider patriotic based on my views of the war and our actions. I'm not saying someone with a view different than mine couldn't protest our actions out of patriotic fervor, however.
    Pete Hanlin, ABOM
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    Master OptiBoarder rinselberg's Avatar
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    Bad address email on file Lynne's Avatar
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    Wave

    Well, as the wife of a retired USAF SMSgt, the mother of a USAF SSgt, and the daughter of a (deceased) British Royal Army CSM, I can only say that the open letter was well done, and Amen to it!!

    We all grieve when we lose our loved ones, and Cindy is coping in the way that works for her, I guess. However, perhaps she should spend her time celebrating her son's life, and doing what she can to help other servicemen and women, in her son's name. But that's easy for me to say, I'm not in her shoes...

    (And yes, my son did serve in Iraq.)

  14. #14
    sub specie aeternitatis Pete Hanlin's Avatar
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    I watched a snippet of Cindy Sheehan yesterday where she was expressing that she cannot understand how some of the parents of soldiers KIA could still support the President and/or the war. She went as far to say that she "almost fails to feel any sympathy for their loss," since they are basically condoning additional murder.

    As I mentioned earlier, this woman has been placed in depths over her head by the media. If the radical folks spurring her on have any common decency, they'll back off her a bit and allow her to get on with her life. It is hard enough to get over losing a loved one, but when you have a bunch of people spurring you on to make it the central and defining theme of your life, it can't be healthy.
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    Master OptiBoarder rinselberg's Avatar
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    As for this current Cindy Sheehan episode, I've already posted over seventy "OpEd"s, "connecting the dots" ... i.e., relating the Multi-National mission in Iraq to the GWOT (Global War On Terror). No need to repeat myself! A good way to explore "RinselWorld" with respect to this Cindy Sheehan thread is to go to the OptiBoard search page and search with keyword IRAQ, Search Entire Posts, User Name RINSELBERG, Find Posts by User and Show Results as Posts.

    "It's easy when you know how", as one of my supervisors was fond of saying.


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  16. #16
    Pomposity! Spexvet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Hanlin
    If the radical folks spurring her on have any common decency, they'll back off her a bit and allow her to get on with her life.
    If President Bush has any common decency, he'll meet with her again and allow her to get on with her life.
    ...Just ask me...

  17. #17
    Master OptiBoarder rbaker's Avatar
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    I think President Bush has other things on his mind these days. I know that the press has other things on its mind. Perhaps now that the cameras are gone poor Cindy can resume taking her meds and go back home and start working on her book and screenplay.

  18. #18
    sub specie aeternitatis Pete Hanlin's Avatar
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    The President of the United States has already met with this woman once (which, considering she lost her son is right, proper, and a good thing). Since that meeting, people have convinced her to protest the war and demand an additional meeting with the President.

    I'm sure Cindy Sheehan feels like she should have taken the opportunity to zing the President a few times during their initial meeting and would now like a "do-over." That isn't going to happen, and those around her should quit reinforcing her feeling like she has been put-out because of it.

    Coincidentally, I believe the President "heard the message" she wished to convey given that she and a bunch of obnoxious protestors basically invited themselves along on his personal vacation, so perhaps she should consider her mission to let the President know she's upset accomplished and get on with living her life.

    As for me, I'm desperately trying to go on with my life by avoiding the (thank heavens) now diminishing media circus surrounding Cindy Sheehan. As the camera lights are extinguished and the individuals who have taken advantage of her during her 15 minutes of fame lose interest and move on to exploit others, I wonder if Cindy Sheehan is left better- or worse- off after the events of the past few weeks...
    Pete Hanlin, ABOM
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    http://linkedin.com/in/pete-hanlin-72a3a74

  19. #19
    Pomposity! Spexvet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Hanlin
    The President of the United States has already met with this woman once (which, considering she lost her son is right, proper, and a good thing). Since that meeting, people have convinced her to protest the war and demand an additional meeting with the President.

    I'm sure Cindy Sheehan feels like she should have taken the opportunity to zing the President a few times during their initial meeting and would now like a "do-over." That isn't going to happen, and those around her should quit reinforcing her feeling like she has been put-out because of it.

    Coincidentally, I believe the President "heard the message" she wished to convey given that she and a bunch of obnoxious protestors basically invited themselves along on his personal vacation, so perhaps she should consider her mission to let the President know she's upset accomplished and get on with living her life.

    As for me, I'm desperately trying to go on with my life by avoiding the (thank heavens) now diminishing media circus surrounding Cindy Sheehan. As the camera lights are extinguished and the individuals who have taken advantage of her during her 15 minutes of fame lose interest and move on to exploit others, I wonder if Cindy Sheehan is left better- or worse- off after the events of the past few weeks...
    If he wanted it to go away, he sould have met with her a second time. She obviously had unresolved issues - you maintain she's being used and controlled, I don't know that to be true, and will give her the benefit of the doubt. Either way, though, it would have been less of a "story" had Bush met with her again, allowing her to vent (or whatever), taken it like a man, and it would have been all over. But, being the Dubya that he is, he doesn't want to listen to any opinion that contradicts his own, so here we are. Funny he didn't learn from listening to all the reasons to invade Iraq.

    Quote Originally Posted by rbaker
    I think President Bush has other things on his mind these days.
    Like vacation...
    Quote Originally Posted by rbaker
    Perhaps now that the cameras are gone poor Cindy can resume taking her meds and go back home and start working on her book and screenplay.
    Interesting. Do you feel that everyone who disagrees with you is on meds?
    ...Just ask me...

  20. #20
    Master OptiBoarder chm2023's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Hanlin
    The President of the United States has already met with this woman once (which, considering she lost her son is right, proper, and a good thing). Since that meeting, people have convinced her to protest the war and demand an additional meeting with the President.

    I'm sure Cindy Sheehan feels like she should have taken the opportunity to zing the President a few times during their initial meeting and would now like a "do-over." That isn't going to happen, and those around her should quit reinforcing her feeling like she has been put-out because of it.

    Coincidentally, I believe the President "heard the message" she wished to convey given that she and a bunch of obnoxious protestors basically invited themselves along on his personal vacation, so perhaps she should consider her mission to let the President know she's upset accomplished and get on with living her life.

    As for me, I'm desperately trying to go on with my life by avoiding the (thank heavens) now diminishing media circus surrounding Cindy Sheehan. As the camera lights are extinguished and the individuals who have taken advantage of her during her 15 minutes of fame lose interest and move on to exploit others, I wonder if Cindy Sheehan is left better- or worse- off after the events of the past few weeks...
    Did Cindy S "deserve" a second mtg with Bush? No. Would he have been wise to give her one. Absolutely.

  21. #21
    Bad address email on file fvc2020's Avatar
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    Cindy Sheehan is a dork. there I said it. As a wife of a retired sailor, daughtre of a retiree sailor(who was in Vietnam), and a granddaughter of a sailor(Korean and Vietnam), I'm truly tired of her completely.

    I understand that she has lost her son, but good grief, the boy had just reenlisted and was going back to Iraq of his own free will. I can tell you that any family of a miltary person or persons know what they sign up for. you don't know when and if you will have to put your life on the line for your country, but you understand you might. If he didn't explain the importance of his choice to his mother, then sorry for them. I don't think the president did the wrong thing. You're right he was on vacation, so was the Congress, the Supreme Court and most of the rest of our elected bodies. He runs the largest most important country in the world, I think he needed a break.

    How many of you could do his job? We stress when stupid patients get on our one last nerve. Cindy Sheenan can't. All she can do is open her mouth and let sound come out.

    As to the war. I will stop my rant after this.Spevext(sorry if I spelled it wrong) The President was given information, he passed it to Congress and they voted to go to war. With the information he was given would any of our Dems on this board make a different discision? How much of it was wrong, its hard to say. I do know this. Weapons of Mass Destruction were there before he was in office. We know that the Iraqis tried to buy yellow cake. We know they were trying to regroup, and were getting other weapons from Russia and France. Tell me where did all the weapons go? Syria, Egypt, etc. Where are the records of the destructions of the chemical weapons from Gulf War.

    I hope that we make sure who is right and who is wrong. In the long run, like Pete says, if Iraq has a constitution, and peace is being restored in the Middle East, we all win.

    Just a thought
    Christina

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by fvc2020
    Cindy Sheehan is a dork. there I said it. As a wife of a retired sailor, daughtre of a retiree sailor(who was in Vietnam), and a granddaughter of a sailor(Korean and Vietnam), I'm truly tired of her completely.

    I understand that she has lost her son, but good grief, the boy had just reenlisted and was going back to Iraq of his own free will. I can tell you that any family of a miltary person or persons know what they sign up for. you don't know when and if you will have to put your life on the line for your country, but you understand you might. If he didn't explain the importance of his choice to his mother, then sorry for them. I don't think the president did the wrong thing. You're right he was on vacation, so was the Congress, the Supreme Court and most of the rest of our elected bodies. He runs the largest most important country in the world, I think he needed a break.

    How many of you could do his job? We stress when stupid patients get on our one last nerve. Cindy Sheenan can't. All she can do is open her mouth and let sound come out.

    As to the war. I will stop my rant after this.Spevext(sorry if I spelled it wrong) The President was given information, he passed it to Congress and they voted to go to war. With the information he was given would any of our Dems on this board make a different discision? How much of it was wrong, its hard to say. I do know this. Weapons of Mass Destruction were there before he was in office. We know that the Iraqis tried to buy yellow cake. We know they were trying to regroup, and were getting other weapons from Russia and France. Tell me where did all the weapons go? Syria, Egypt, etc. Where are the records of the destructions of the chemical weapons from Gulf War.

    I hope that we make sure who is right and who is wrong. In the long run, like Pete says, if Iraq has a constitution, and peace is being restored in the Middle East, we all win.

    Just a thought
    Christina





    I like you Christina.

  23. #23
    Master OptiBoarder chm2023's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fvc2020
    Cindy Sheehan is a dork. there I said it. As a wife of a retired sailor, daughtre of a retiree sailor(who was in Vietnam), and a granddaughter of a sailor(Korean and Vietnam), I'm truly tired of her completely.

    I understand that she has lost her son, but good grief, the boy had just reenlisted and was going back to Iraq of his own free will. I can tell you that any family of a miltary person or persons know what they sign up for. you don't know when and if you will have to put your life on the line for your country, but you understand you might. If he didn't explain the importance of his choice to his mother, then sorry for them. I don't think the president did the wrong thing. You're right he was on vacation, so was the Congress, the Supreme Court and most of the rest of our elected bodies. He runs the largest most important country in the world, I think he needed a break.

    How many of you could do his job? We stress when stupid patients get on our one last nerve. Cindy Sheenan can't. All she can do is open her mouth and let sound come out.

    As to the war. I will stop my rant after this.Spevext(sorry if I spelled it wrong) The President was given information, he passed it to Congress and they voted to go to war. With the information he was given would any of our Dems on this board make a different discision? How much of it was wrong, its hard to say. I do know this. Weapons of Mass Destruction were there before he was in office. We know that the Iraqis tried to buy yellow cake. We know they were trying to regroup, and were getting other weapons from Russia and France. Tell me where did all the weapons go? Syria, Egypt, etc. Where are the records of the destructions of the chemical weapons from Gulf War.

    I hope that we make sure who is right and who is wrong. In the long run, like Pete says, if Iraq has a constitution, and peace is being restored in the Middle East, we all win.

    Just a thought
    Christina

    I find it interesting that you see W's job as being given information and passing it along to Congress. Sounds like the job of a low level functionary to me. I thought this guy was leader of the free world, a title that implies a less passive role. And btw, what if peace isn't restored to the Middle East, do we all lose? (Also, Congress voted to give W the power to declare war--with the proviso he allow the weapons inspection to be completed prior to declaration--he elected to not honor that agreement--you'll remember how the Bushies mocked the UN inspectors, they don't look quite so inept in hindsight though---and declare war straight away.)

  24. #24
    Pomposity! Spexvet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fvc2020
    Cindy Sheehan is a dork. there I said it. As a wife of a retired sailor, daughtre of a retiree sailor(who was in Vietnam), and a granddaughter of a sailor(Korean and Vietnam), I'm truly tired of her completely.

    Just a thought
    Christina
    Perhaps you'd be a dork, too, if your grandfather, father, or husband had died in military action. You got lucky.
    ...Just ask me...

  25. #25
    Just An Optician jediron1's Avatar
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    Spexvet
    The author of this piece is WAY out of line.

    The blood of our military will be on the hands of those who made the faulty decision to invade Iraq, not on Ms. Sheehan.

    This man compares this war to our Civil War and WWII. There are times when a war is necessary, and this is not one of those times.

    I admire our military personnel who put their lives on the line, in fact I respect them so much that I would like them to stay alive. I recommend that all those who support the war put their words into action, join the military and go fight in Iraq.

    More deaths don't "honor" those who have already died.

    Opposing a war like this is responsible, patriotic action, like opposing slavery was.

    But I rant....[/QUOTE]


    Leave it to the Spec man to oppose a letter like this and again throw in the race issue as he always does with his last blast. I would go over and fight but they won't take a 54 year old even though I want to. My brother is over there so I don't want to see your bull crap about our men fighting over there!
    It's people like you who used to call the Vietnam vets baby killers and then run home to your suburban house and family. Give me break! Spec go home
    your making me sick!:finger:

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