Lenscrafters new return policy

**hcjilson** · 07-01-2005, 05:41 PM

and he burned his. I tried to gently remind this person to edit the post. To censor a post is something we try to avoid at all costs because it rubs us all the wrong way. Its much easier for the individual to do it after having vented.
I don't have anything for or against lenscrafters. I do have something against an idiot who wastes my time and energy.I issued a temporary suspension but will recomend it be permanent. Steve will make the final call.

PS Wasting my time is not hysterical to me.Thats about the only thing I'm sensitive about.
hj

**Chris Ryser** · 07-02-2005, 03:42 AM

Originally Posted by Aarlan

.
I very well may have to advertise a policy such as this. Most independents, though, pride ourselves on dispensing a pair of eyewear that is correct the first time.

As we all know, there are NO freebies in this world. Every for less offer is calulated into the selling price, unless you have a very limited time special

In a forever freeby offer the next frame is already calculated into the retail price. LC belongs to Lux who makes and supplies the frames, therefore they (Lux as owner) gross a total of about 80% from top to bottom. On lenses I am sure they also have a heck of a better deal than the single independent.

Therefore the eyeware you dispense better be dead on the first time, otherwise you will have to bite into the sour apple unless your selling prices will allow you to do it.

**optighost** · 07-02-2005, 08:28 AM

I have an idea.....why don't all the moderators just kick everybody off and then they can just post their opinions so that they never have to hear an opinion they don't like.....

You can't keep me off of the site....no matter how hard you try....why don't you just try listening to what I say and accepting the fact that I have a different opinion than you......it might help you on and off the site....

Optighost out......

Originally Posted by hcjilson

and he burned his. I tried to gently remind this person to edit the post. To censor a post is something we try to avoid at all costs because it rubs us all the wrong way. Its much easier for the individual to do it after having vented.
I don't have anything for or against lenscrafters. I do have something against an idiot who wastes my time and energy.I issued a temporary suspension but will recomend it be permanent. Steve will make the final call.

PS Wasting my time is not hysterical to me.Thats about the only thing I'm sensitive about.
hj

**Joann Raytar** · 07-02-2005, 08:59 AM

The moderators, myself included, responded to complaints from a variety of members when we acted to edit your posts and eventually ban you. Normally, some of those members would have agreed with your opinions but were put off by what you wrote. A couple of members were also bothered by the posts you made in response to a charitable organization's request - that crossed the line.

The moderators, and I think I speak for the majority of OptiBoarders, also don't want this kind of exchange to happen here ... thedispensingoptician.com

**Aarlan** · 07-02-2005, 09:25 AM

Originally Posted by hcjilson

.

PS Wasting my time is not hysterical to me.Thats about the only thing I'm sensitive about.
hj

No disrespect intended...Just making light of the situation.

AA

PS after seeing his most recent post as ghost, he doesn't seem to get it...Just as he really didn't seem to get it in many threads when he was out of line

**rep** · 07-02-2005, 09:32 AM

Originally Posted by Chris Ryser

LC belongs to Lux who makes and supplies the frames, therefore they (Lux as owner) gross a total of about 80% from top to bottom.

Therefore the eyeware you dispense better be dead on the first time, otherwise you will have to bite into the sour apple unless your selling prices will allow you to do it.

Come on Chris,

Everybody knows where you stand regarding Luxottica, but kindly explain what you mean by grossing 80%.(Gross would be 100%, if you are implying they net 80% you are just trying to inflame the private practioner with untrue outrageous statements) Your flames are making less and less sense and since they come from a wholesaler who has never owned a retail optical location, to my knowledge, why should anyone pay one bit of attention to your obvious bias against one company.

Your previous post seem to indicate you think Moulin, the third largest frame maker, is fine to take over ECPA, as long as it isn't Luxottica. In fact you prefer them.

Please explain how the other retail market segments, clothing and so forth, which have much lower margins, than optical, can offer the same return policies for customers who change their mind.

It's called customer satisfaction and companies big and small have been offering it long before Lenscrafters. This policy has been in place before Luxottica purchased Lenscrafters or Cole.

Rep ( Luxottica)

**Jason Carruthers** · 07-02-2005, 10:37 AM

Originally Posted by rep

explain what you mean by grossing 80%.(Gross would be 100%, if you are implying they net 80% you are just trying to inflame the private practioner
Rep ( Luxottica)

Rep: To "gross 80%" is a common way of saying a product has a gross profit margin of 80%, with a cost of 20%.

I don't know how Chris feels about Luxottica but I admire them, as I do many market leaders. Chris is saying that because Lux manufactures and retails their own frames, their cost of goods sold is much lower than the independents. The independent pays $XXX for an Armani frame and retails it for, say $225. If you offer your clients the ability to "change your mind, change your glasses," you're going to pay dearly on that transaction.

**Aarlan** · 07-02-2005, 11:12 AM

Originally Posted by Jason Carruthers

Rep: To "gross 80%" is a common way of saying a product has a gross profit margin of 80%, with a cost of 20%.

I don't know how Chris feels about Luxottica but I admire them, as I do many market leaders. Chris is saying that because Lux manufactures and retails their own frames, their cost of goods sold is much lower than the independents. The independent pays $XXX for an Armani frame and retails it for, say $225. If you offer your clients the ability to "change your mind, change your glasses," you're going to pay dearly on that transaction.

I know the guidelines say not to disclose wholesale prices, so if we're skirting that let me know.

To Gross 80% for a large chain with Vertical integration, such as LC, would be reasonable. I know the Lux people will holler in indignation, but I wouldn't be suprised if the number was truly higher. They will quote numbers that show that they pay more for their own product than they actually do, but much of it is probably inflated via accounting tricks (THIS IS NOT A KNOCK ON LUXOTTICA...I spent a great deal of time with my wife with her studies while she earned her MBA...It is scary what many large companies can do...Any successful company has to use every opportunity at their disposal to increase the bottom line and the appearance of profitability.)

AA

**sjthielen** · 07-02-2005, 11:45 AM

I have had this policy for over 10 years. I have had very few ever return and those i have, have given their business to us for keeps. The policy makes sense because it is our responsibility to make sure our Pt. leave with the best choice possible. I have failed them if they are not happy. I have many Pt's now that will tell me to pick what I think is best for them without looking on their own.

**Aarlan** · 07-02-2005, 12:41 PM

Originally Posted by sjthielen

I have had this policy for over 10 years. I have had very few ever return and those i have, have given their business to us for keeps. The policy makes sense because it is our responsibility to make sure our Pt. leave with the best choice possible. I have failed them if they are not happy. I have many Pt's now that will tell me to pick what I think is best for them without looking on their own.

Absolutely true, but to go on a multimillion dollar ad blitz is tantamount to inviting poor purchasing decisions. Is the first thing you discuss with the patient the fact that you will eat the lens cost, frame cost, time it took to make, etc? Or is that a last resort for the few people you needed to do it for? I think it is a good idea in some cases to keep patients, but a poor idea to put out the idea that 'so many of our customers don't like our glasses that we will exchange them if we allowed you to pick out a pair that is so hideous your friends ridicule you'.

AA

**Chris Ryser** · 07-02-2005, 01:40 PM

To all the remarks you have made in above postings I just would like to repeat myself again, as I have said before:

I admire Luxottica just about all the way, rich.......shrewd.......inventive.........smart............. ....and many more,

However that does not mean that I have to agree with what they are doing to their customers that have supported them for many years, and have actually contributed monetary wise to make it possibe for the corporation to now compete with them.

Originally Posted by Jason

I don't know how Chris feels about Luxottica but I admire them, as I do many market leaders. Chris is saying that because ux ......................

What I am saying is that a manufactucturer who makes frames, sell them to a distributor who makes some profit, by re-selling to a retailer...........then the retailer makes also a profit by selling the item. These were 3 different positions from start to end.

Now as they own retail stores, do their own distribution they actually make all the three different markups. No middle men. From manufacturing to retail. Of course they collect more even if they would sell for less at the retail end.

**35oldguy** · 07-02-2005, 01:51 PM

No, socks-- they will change! Expensive eyeglasses should not be changed unless the doctor made an error in the RX. They selected them and went they got home a family member said they did not like them. Happens a lot. It is not correct! They need to sign for them at the time of order saying they agree to order them. After the fact if they come back because of whatever reason you point out to them what they signed.

Originally Posted by Personalizedoptics

That is the most stupid policy that I know of.......but I can tell you that it is not a new policy at LC.....they have always had the 30 day money back gaurantee.....I don't understand the logic.....if you buy a new pair of socks, wear them for a week and then try to return them, the store would probably laugh at you.

**35oldguy** · 07-02-2005, 02:05 PM

Advertising!! Wow!! They Lenscrafters I wonder when they will go broke!! Happened to one of the largest retailers! K-Mart!!

Originally Posted by hcjilson

That's why Lenscrafters is where they are, and why you are where you are. That is not meant as a put down. Different strokes for different folks.

**hcjilson** · 07-02-2005, 09:17 PM

If memory serves, after filing for reorganization,KMart came back, and within 18 months purchased Sears Roebuck.It is curious to note, that the CEO gave credit to Martha Stewart brands for aiding the comeback.They also stood by her during her problems. Maybe LC should hire Ken Lay!.........