Board is slow...Must...post...poll.

[drk]

How often do you see sales reps?

[chip anderson]

Do you find that reps travel in batches. We seem to go 6 to 8 weeks without seeing any, then we may see 5 to 8 a day for a week. I suspect that they all travel together. Get group rates at motels and golf courses. Travel in a bus and get a deal of rental cars in batches.

Do we really need reps? Wouldn't a direct return program. Local trade shows twice a year where we could finger the product. And direct deals without minimums serve the industry better and a lot cheaper without those commissions and expenses?

Chip

[hcjilson]

by my father who was a second generation optician. He told me to always take the time to listen to a sales rep.He said I would learn from every encounter. That has proved to be true, and as a result,not only do I have a good finger on the pulse of the industry, I count some of my closest friends who are reps. Sales reps can be the life blood of your business.

The sales rep is our contact with the rest of the optical world, and often how we keep in touch with not only industry changes, but personel changes.The sales rep has taken time from his schedule to visit you...(not always to sell you something....but to keep in touch)The sales rep should always be treated with courtesy because his/her time is every bit as valuable as ours.I don't buy from every sales rep,(who can?) but I buy when I can and I always listen to them and thank them for coming out of their way to see me.

For a brief time during the early 90's I was a sales rep. I have a good handle on how good it can be and how bad it can be.I too, have waited 45 minutes after a scheduled appointment , only to be told by a receptionist that the client was too busy to see me, or in one case an optometrist had an "emergency" case! I have also walked into an office and had someone say " I don't care what you're selling Harry, I'm buying it!" So it works both ways.

In answer to the poll, most reps have 6-8 week swings.

[hcjilson]

Chip, most reps pay their expenses out of their commisions. You and I are old enough to remember the old days when there WERE expense accounts.Unfortunately for today's reps, that is no longer the case. hj

[chip anderson]

HC:
No matter how the mfg. finagles things to avoid paying benefits and SS and withholding taxes, etc. The cost of the rep., his travel, income, etc. is in the cost of that frame. If he weren't there either frames could be of better quality or lower cost or both. We don't really need him to come by and pick out what hasn't sold, return goods or tell us what is about to be discontinued. This could all be handled by E. Mail bulletin, or mail. Returns likewise.

Don't get me wrong I like some of my reps. even partially trust some of them and have learned some valuable tips on occasion.

But I think regional trade shows could handle the product display and the rep could be considered superfluous. Especially in the copious amounts that we often see them, some weeks it seems that I have spend 4 days seeing reps that mostly visit. In shops where they have more help than they need this may give the designated buyer something to do and feel important about. But I am a one man show with 18 hours of work to be fit into 12 hour days.

I don't think we need 5 reps for any given manufacturer.

I really don't think we need reps. I do appreciate their help and when I need a frame that can't be found I appreciate it when the can find one. But as I said this could be handled with a little higher quality help at the distributor and more liberal policies (God, I used the word liberal!) from the distributor.

Chip

[karen]

Do you find that reps travel in batches. We seem to go 6 to 8 weeks without seeing any, then we may see 5 to 8 a day for a week. I suspect that they all travel together. Get group rates at motels and golf courses. Travel in a bus and get a deal of rental cars in batches.

Do we really need reps? Wouldn't a direct return program. Local trade shows twice a year where we could finger the product. And direct deals without minimums serve the industry better and a lot cheaper without those commissions and expenses?

Chip

Just when I was getting ready to buy you dinner! ( see the convention thread) Of COURSE you need reps-but just the good ones. Some people need us more than others. I always try to figure out when the account wants to see me and not to drive them too crazy. I am on a 6 week call cycle which ususlly gets me in front of them just enough to tell them about anything new but not wear out my welcome.

[For-Life]

We see our reps either semi-monthly or quarterly. I only like seeing a rep 4 to 5 times a year. Anything more is annoying because by the time you receive the frames and put them on the board you see the rep again. Anything less is tedious since you need to replace your stock and have no one to deal with.

[chip anderson]

Today before noon, I was called upon by five (5) reps. None of which saw fit to call for an appointment.


Nuf said.

By the by, is anyone selling or buying all that stuff with rhinestones in it?

[Johns]

Chip,

You were VERY close but...

Lux bought up all the companies, and consolidated your territory into one rep that actually is a master of disguises. There is only one rep, he/she is extrmemely talented at repping, and you can only buy from one company!!



Those crafty Italians !!

[For-Life]

Today before noon, I was called upon by five (5) reps. None of which saw fit to call for an appointment.


Nuf said.

By the by, is anyone selling or buying all that stuff with rhinestones in it?

I have a couple. Via Spega ones and Bellaza (sp) ones.

[drk]

"Bling-bling" doesn't cut it in central Ohio, right now.

My take is that the more often you see reps, the more often you buy, therefore inflating your inventory (or is it that I'm a softie?).

I like to see reps 2x/yr, so I can have a serious plan and do serious business. Just my opinion.

[Johns]

In NE Ohio, bling is the thing! Minor bling (Escada & Norma Kamali) has been doing well, and some of the suns with rhinestones (Nina R)have been selling pretty good also. The best thing about bling bling is that you know that's not going to be the only sale because most rhinestoners are going to have casual and serious frames as well.

I call the reps when I need to order, and many times, I'll have them pick what they think I'll like over the phone. If they don't know me by now, there's a chance I'm not buying from them anyway. Telling them to send me a certain number saves us both a ton of time and money, and we've both got better things to do.

[Joann Raytar]

By the by, is anyone selling or buying all that stuff with rhinestones in it?

We have one line with rhinestones, they do allright. Twenty somethings seem to be the age group buying it, complete with fashion tints. (I thought we were done with pink years ago.)

[karen]

"I like to see reps 2x/yr, so I can have a serious plan and do serious business. Just my opinion.

drk, just curious-do you feel the same about lab/lens manufacturer reps??

[hcjilson]

that the sales rep's value to an individual business is unrecognised.I think this comes from an overestimation of the value of our time, and consequently looking at a sales call as a distraction rather than an opportunity to learn. I am not speaking from on high because I am guilty of the same thing at times. Lets face it, after seeing 4 reps during the day, I am sure Chip wasn't getting HIS job done so that 5th rep probably got blistered, and we've all been in that situation, so he's not alone.

I know of a current regional sales manager who, when she was my Terri Brogan rep, never spent more than 10 minutes per call in my office.She was a delight. She only brought in new product, never the 2 cases you see some of the rookies start out with, and Hi, how are you?, this is new and your doing so well with xyz why not try abc. Thanks, and good bye!

When I went on the road, I patterned my sales calls on hers, and no one felt too put out. Admittedly I was not selling frames, but my message got delivered and the company who paid me was brought to the forefront.I used to try to set a record with sales calls, but gave it up after hitting 23 in one day.7:45 AM to 8:30 PM....the last call was my brother, but he gave me an order so I counted it!!!!:)

hj

[drk]

drk, just curious-do you feel the same about lab/lens manufacturer reps??

Yes.

[hcjilson]

how do you stay on the "cutting edge"? New products, technology, etc?
Question is not meant as a put down.Great subject!
hj

[karen]

Yes.

Ok, How do you feel about them coming in and talking to the staff about the new stuff and them relaying it to you. In all honesty, I talk to the staff much more frequently than the Dr-with a few exceptions. Let me set up 2 hypothetical situations and if you wouldn't mind answering...

1) We are you lab of choice and most if not all of your work goes to us. How often do you want to see me? How often do you want the staff to see me?

2) You use another lab but no one comes in to tell you what's new. Do you mind my coming in a few times a year to say hello and see what's up?

[hcjilson]

Thats funny you should post that Karen. My go to lab has never made one sales call in all the years we've done business.They do keep me abreast of new product and new services they provide, but not one visit.I really never thought about it much until I read your post! The president of the lab and I used to work together at another company he was inside and I was on the road so I guess he figures I'll stay on top of things without him! The lab directs factory reps out when new product is released but they rarely go out themselves.....Strange now that I think about it!

[chip anderson]

Much better the last two days. Only 2 reps that showed and one no-show. Now as to staying on "the cutting edge."

Can you read? Do you read?

[hcjilson]

of course we read! That tells us whats happen'in now. The Reps are telling us whats going to be happen'in 6 months from now! Regardless of how much you read, you are not going to be able to read everything....thats why most of our inserts wind up in the basket! If you don't think Reps are important, why see them at all?

hj

[chip anderson]

Do you remember how many reps told you for three years that cateyes were coming back? They didn't. I have had ex-reps tell me in lectures that they pushed overstocks and dead items to make the regional managers. Don't trust salesmen!


The only thing that is important to "your friends" the salesmen are quotas, winning that trip and commissions. The illusional theory that we work on is: "The salesperson won't push things that don't sell. It's not good for him."

You never know when sales people are about to change allegance and employers and may be trying to make a killing before they leave.

You don't know when a product is about to be discontinued or "improved" and present mfg. stocks must be depleted. You don't even know now if the mfg. is trying to palm off the bad stuff so that the good stuff can be sold to the factory owned retail outlets.

Watch your own market and read a lot.

Chip
Rule #1 of the optical business: "Don't trust anyone!"


Harry: My point was that if the industry were set up differently, we don't need to see them. Right now it's the only way we can see new product and do returns.

[karen]

Don't trust salesmen!

The only thing that is important to "your friends" the salesmen are quotas, winning that trip and commissions. The illusional theory that we work on is: "The salesperson won't push things that don't sell. It's not good for him."

You never know when sales people are about to change allegance and employers and may be trying to make a killing before they leave.

You don't know when a product is about to be discontinued or "improved" and present mfg. stocks must be depleted. You don't even know now if the mfg. is trying to palm off the bad stuff so that the good stuff can be sold to the factory owned retail outlets.
.

Chip, don't make me revoke my dinner offer!!!

I agree that some salesreps are unethical and only out for themselves but we are not all like that. Sometimes we change employers because our current situation becomes unbearable and you should like what you do and want to go to work everyday. In all honesty all we have to offer is our integrity (or lack thereof) Most frame companies offer similar products and most labs offer similar services/products. All that separates me from my competition is the way I take care of my accounts (unless its all about the $$ and then quite frankly I don't want your business) and I try to take care of them the way I wanted to be treated when I was an optician. When you work for a corporation (as opposed to independently owned like I do now) sometimes YOU are lied to and pass on that information to the account because someone stood right in front of you and told you it was true...C'mon Chip, don't you have at least one rep that is always there for you that you know you can count on???

[optiman2020]

When a rep comes in to our office I will tell them what we want.First thing they must do is take back old styles that have not sold,if the reps will not return old styles I will tell them Thank You I will call when we need your frames.We try to see the basic companys only 3 times a year(Safilo,Lux,Tura,Silh).Our smaller nitch companys 4 times a year.

As far as lab reps go I always want to see them to know what is new.I have a open door for them.The last time I had a contact lens rep in our office was 1 year ago.

[Pete Hanlin]

If you don't enjoy your encounters with your frame/lab consultants, maybe you just aren't managing them very well...

Of course frame consultants are going to put as much product in as they can- just like an optical shop is going to fill as many of their own prescriptions as possible! Your consultant doesn't get paid to drive around and just smile at you- s/he gets paid to put frames on your board (and the better ones realize quickly that the best way to do this long term is to help you go through their frames as quickly as possible).

The frame consultant can be a valuable resource. From what is going on in the area to helping find new employees, the consultant can often be a window out of the little box you call your office. If asked, they can also often point out the strengths / weaknesses of your office compared to others. The fact that many offices end up with more frames than they require is pretty much the office manager's / purchaser's fault. The first question I hear a lot of people asking their consultant is "what do you have that's new?" My first question was always "what do your records indicate we've been selling?"

In fact, the best way I've seen to manage a frame inventory is through a strictly controled form of "Frame Board Management." Basically, you're going to let each consultant know how much of your frame board they can fill, you're going to track their sales against your total sales, and the best performers are going to be rewarded accordingly.

As far as lab representatives go, I would certainly hope to receive regular visits. The laboratory is a vital partner for the average optical shop / medical office, and the lab representative plays a vital role in making sure that relationship remains healthy.

Sadly enough, the only thing some "consultants" do anymore is hand out spiff checks for the latest frame / lens promotion. If this is all that's being provided, there is a lot missing in the consultant / ECP relationship.