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Ok I know there are several gun inthusiasts on the board so here it goes. I am getting an assault type rifle in the near future and wanted to know what others thoughts were on the age old question AK47 vs AR15. I have done some reasearch already and am leaning to the Ak for reliability and stopping power. Price range of about 1000.
If you really lives in de flatland, get a common ordinary 243 or 6mm. And you won't have the networks calling you a nut with an assault rifle, whatever that is. You can get one and a an '06 for a grand, they will probably throw in a .22 with it.
You can hit any target you can see and kill anything on this continent made of flesh and bone.
Chip
I live in flatland and it's awesome for guns. There is enough space to get out to 1000 no range necessary. I am really wanting something semi auto. I will mostly be plinking and shooting coyotes and prairie dogs (no offense intended to anyone they are actually horrible for the local dairymen and ranchers some even pay you per coyote). I also like the cheap ammo for the ak and that you can use steel cased ammo without damaging the system.
Those type of firearms are not my bag.
I have always been curious about the Ak's so that would be my vote! Good luck and happy lead slinging!
I'm kinda with Chip on this, get a good 30-06 and an equally good 22. Save the extra money for ample supplies of ammo, you may need it some day. Assault weapons are fun to shoot and cute to look at, but they are not accurate enough for hunting smaller varmints and really are not powerful enough for coyote. This is only my opinion.
If you want long range get a single shot. You sho ain't gonna hit no prarrie dog at 1000 yards on the second shot. If you will notice you almost never see anyone get a dove on the second shot and never on the third. I used to go out rabbit hunting (acutally we shot most everything then) almost every afternoon with friends, they all had semi-auto's, I had an old Remmington targetmaster (which I got in 1948 and still have). Guess who got all the rabbits and birds and other critters and who shot a lot of ammo with no game?
If you have ever been deer hunting, when you hear someone fire three or more shots, you know he didn't get a deer, when he shoots only once, he usually baggs a deer.
Only the first shot counts, unless you are clearing a mob out of an alley.
There's something about having that second shot waiting that makes you too eager to snap that first one off too soon. If there's no back-up, you gonna take you time and aim properly.
Chip
Chip has good advice. I own both an AR and an AK and I like to play with the AK more, for some reason.
Make sure the AR shoots 5.56 AND .223, not just the .223. AK74 here. Basically an updated AK47.
I have a chinese AK and I like it. You might also consider an AK-74 since the ammo and guns are fairly cheap. For longer ranges I have a Finish m39 and a 22. The m39 is a beast.
I have owned at one time or another a couple of SKSs, AK47, Thompsons, AR-15 and an M-14..........If you want to throw the most bullets on the target...and atually hit and stop it........nothing beats a Russian built AK-47....if you an do it with just one or two shots instead of a full magazine....M-14.
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Originally Posted by EyeManFla
The Thompson, by the way, is just plain fun !!!!!! :tongue:
As a military vet, I'm partial to the AR platform. It feels like an extension of my body. Parts and ammo are everywere.
Ok I did watch a video yesterday and it was showing the ak to be a lot less accurate out to 200 only 1 out of 5 shots hit center mass. Hmm Much to ponder. Maybe are 15 in a varmint setup 20inch bull perhaps.
My advice is just as glasses you dont need just one. I have many rifles, and each serves a purpose just as our mutifocal friends need different len's for different task. I will address the questions as i would a customer looking for answers on frame and lens options. Here we go, the AK-47 has more confirmed kills that any other rifle in history, lets look at why. They were developed in 1947 and are still being made today - making it one of most manufactured guns in history so the sheer amount of rifles gives it the advantage of being in almost every battle since its inception in 1947, so time+ reliability+ alot of bad people having them= most kills of any rifle. The real AK-47 made in Russia was full auto and most of them today are semi-auto just like the ones your looking at (parts are made in various country's and assembled in the USA with at least nine USA parts to comply with laws) but the full auto version is consider a suppressive fire weapon, meaning it lays down a ****-ton of ammo with marginal accuracy. the round that AK-47 shoots is a 7.62x39 a deadly round do to size/weight/and velocity, but is not know for its out of the box accuracy. the ammo is plentiful but not the best choice for hunting or plinking (Favorite hunting round is .308, favorite plinking round .22 or 5.45x39 this is cheapest center fire round available right now). the rifle has gained its RELIABILITY badge do to fact that the guns tolerances are low and lose ( it was designed this way). watch an AK-47 shoot in slow motion and you will see what im talking about. it shakes and shivers when unleashing its pain. Now lets look at the AR-15. Designed from the M-16 this variate has been updated several times over the years and its most common version is where the gas goes down a tube and blows the bolt back, unlike the AK which is piston driven where gas hits a piston and blows the bolt back. The truth of the matter is that an AK and AR can not be truly compared unless you take an AR chambered 5.56 that has the Adams arms piston kit on it, and then Have an AK-74 (this is not a typo) chambered in 5.45x39 and then you can have a show down on who's best in the all around department. AR wins in accuracy and ergonomic and given this TRUE comparison between the round and action plus ergonomic the AR wins everyday trust me I have many of both. Here's my breakdown based off you needs I would if I was YOU and was looking at getting my first rifle i would go with the AR-15 there are so many choices out and so many company's making them that the price is being drove down daily, AK are getting harder to find it seems -at least at a good price, I watched my local gun stores prices go up $130 in one month on the most basic ****ty AK which is the Century Arms Warsa- To around $550. one could buy these for 350 bucks not to long ago. A "good" AK will fetch 650 bucks now the best will cost the same an pretty good AR. I will go into this further if you want just reply. A "Really Good" AR with the piston driven system (most similar to the AK) that comes stock with the rifle such as the" Ruger 556 " is around $1200. dont be a cheap ***- think about it- you have probably had sale on glasses that was at least that price or more so........ But if you want a good plinker, and really this is what i would suggest for your first rifle- is get the S&W AR-22, it shoots the very cheap very fun .22 and you will get lots of practice and really figure out what you want once you get to the range and start talking and shooting with other folks. I love my .22's and use them for training purposes and long days of plinking. you can shoot all day for under $25.00. when i pull out any of my AK's or AR's or bolt action long range rifles I expect anywhere from 50-200 dollars to restock the ammo shot. shoot me a message if you need anymore details as to my favorite brands and models country of origin on the AK's or AR's. If your looking a world with out law gun I would think about a shotgun with slugs this is the most bang for your buck. hope this helps and before anyone asks it takes me about 20 mins to finish with my customers/patients :)
Nice post icarepro
Many years ago I worked gun shows in Virginia, Pennsylvania and Maryland. I was working a show in Leesburg in I believe 1986....I had two young boneheads with DC licenses come up to our table wanting to buy Tec-9's for "deer hunting".........
Very nice post icarepro!! I am not sure where the idea that this is my first rifle came into play. I already have a shotgun alarm system and german shepherd for the bad guys so I am covered there. I did watch a video done by discovery on the ak vs m16 and just as you said the ak was not nearly as accurate. I have to agree with you on the 308 as I did have a remington 700p chambered in it. Great round but the gun was too heavy to hunt with and it was just collecting dust. I also agree there is no 1 rifle to do it all. After doing a little more research on the accuracy issue I am now more leaning to ar platform. Choices choices.
http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/edu143.htm
Semi-auto Rifle>shotgun>pistol
In California we can only legally have the SKS as opposed to the AK but thats ok I love the SK. Easy to scope with just the sight. The only issue I've had with them is they get really hot if you are really letting go and the kick can be a mother if you are shooting all day. The AR is like butter hardly any kick, doesn't get to hot and is equally easy to shoot. But for some reason the SK is just sooooo much fun. Here you can get an SK for $400 or $500 and have an AR built for around $600. Have fun and be safe which ever one you choose.
Love me my AR-15!!!! Ammo is plentiful and it's fun to shoot.
AK-47 is perhaps more of a reliable weapon but we're Americans G-Damn it!!!!!! Go NATO
Im also noticing that there are alot of Carolina boys in here so i know yall know what im talking about.
Sledzinator sorry about the assumption that it was your first auto rifle just figured i would approach as if was your first progressive, my bad. you know what they say about assuming things hope I didnt do that to both of us :) Drop most of your cash on the AR platform and get a slightly used AK from pawn shop or gun show- get it cheap and you will be happy. I have never paid over $500 for an Ak-47 and at one time was getting AK-74's with 1080 rounds for under $500. So the $1000 Arsenal is just a little out of touch for me. I got my weapons optics set for different tasks just like you, and it sounds like you hunt / optician, so I know you value good optics right :) anyway the back sights on AK's have a max of 1000 yard elevation adjustment. let me tell you that when designing that rifle I guess Kalashnikov thought it would be a good moral booster (AKA prank) to put that 1000 yard mark on it. Its a joke! that round wouldn't make there unless you match bullet + match barrel. so you going to way to save money for optics. I have most of my AK's set up with reflex sights and microdots Zeroed at 100 yards. Point and click and boom. I get the accuracy you can expect from a AK which 1 to 5 MOA at 100 yards depends on the receiver and optics. With the milled receiver you get better accuracy as it is milled from one solid block of steel vs the stamped that is stamp and bent to the box configuration that we know. Also AK purist look for the dimples on the mag-well this is really what you want if you go stamped, the cheaper AK's will usually have front sights that are canted so look for that. You can replace the back sight with Midwest industries mount that will accommodate all kind of red dots which i prefer. Or do a side mount and that works fine I've done both. The stock sights on any AR are way better than any AK any day if you ask me, but that just preference, One of my AR have the A2 sight( Iron sights) (carry handle some call it, I know people that got kicked in the nuts for carrying it that way) with 4x magnification Plus BDC on top of that for a little quicker shot acquisition and small prey and Coyotes, I do like my flat tops with monolithic rails FOR BATTLE RIFLES. Oh and "Yards"could BE meters on the AK's. Maybe thats why I shoot high iron sight on em. just thought about that.
Yeah the video I watched the shooter only got 1 shot on centermass at 200 yards! I just can't cant warrant dropping money on that given the choice to be much more accurate. I agree good optics are a MUST! I would be twice the hypocrite if I put bad optics on any weapon. Yeah I like the mono rails and will probably head that direction. I agree that I should spend the bulk on the platform if not all of it in my price range. I will probably wait on the optics because of $ and I also want to be good at using iron sights. Thanks for the great information!!
I picked up a slightly used Olympic Arms M-4 with a messed up paint job on it $450. some one traded cause i guess they thought it looked ugly, and to be honest I thought if he messed the paint that good what else did he FUBR. I thought that would look good with some walmart camo paint on it, $450 ill take it! I open it and inspected all the major stuff and beside the f-up paint dude tried to do, the rifle brand new 850-900 on the high side. but the point is I have $60 in optics (primary arm micro dot) $15 in a bad azz camo paint. that job took all of 30 minutes that everyone says im doing theres next, Yeah right mess up your $1600 rifle- yeah I do that for ya next week( nicer rifle deserve the Ceracoat or Duracoat if you can do it). anyway its 1 moa all day shooter with a little better with match ammo. this is all you need just find it. oh yeah I put magpul stock- grip and generic two piece rail and then painted it seriously guy said he be looking at getting one and offered me $800 on the spot due to character the gun. said it looked like it came back from Afghanistan, $50 in the stock&grip $50 in the rail so whats that total some where around $625. the deals are there if you know what your looking. now im just tooting my horn I will shut it up now. but will post a pic if you want ;)
Great explanations ICAREPRO. You sound like you really like to shoot.