What to do when nothing will do...Determining Frame Lines

[Agnitio]

You all know the scenairio, the px either walks out of the optoms room or in from another optom with a script in hand looking to buy a new set of specs.

While discusing frame and lens optioins it is observed that price is not an issue.

The main issue that evolves is the frame selection. The px has a specific style in mind due to previous specs or current trends but no frames in your store meet their needs.

Now if they are a px of our store we have no problem ordering in frames on approval but what if they are from another store?

Do you order in 5 frames? Even if not on approval? A high end lens can more than make up the difference.

Or is it worthwhile to specialise in certain frame lines such as Rodenstock, Ralph Lauren etc and stock all lines of those brands to avoid such situations.

At my current place I'm so frequently encountering this situation and would appreciate your advice on ways to offer the Px a wide variety of styles coupled with choices.

Can a few brands cover all trends?

Personally I can only think of how much easier it would make things. ie Choosing a frame yet wanting it in a different colour instead of choosing a frame style and calling every dist. looking for a similar style in a different colour.

5-10 lines max is all im looking at. All feedback greatly appreciated

[cocoisland58]

This happens. You can't make everyone happy. I don't order frames on approval for walk-ins without a deposit and only occasionally for our own patients other than size difference or color option. We don't specialize with a "brand". We do specialize in fit and color. I make sure that we have frames for large heads (XXL A&A), petite women (JNY Petite Rem), high bridge guys (Adidas rimless Silhouette), etc. They may come in with a pre-conceived idea of what they want but after a little education and advice on style they generally change their mind. Our best sales are walk-ins and quite often we hear "you have a great frame selection". We only deal with five or six vendors and we choose carefully. Sometimes we may only carry one or two styles from a line but they are unique in some way.

[For-Life]

If I feel I can trust them I will bring it in, however, I try to stick with my main vendors and the ones I see, because then I can exchange them (I do not want to return them, because I do not think it is fair to the supplier).

Now, if this is happening to you a lot then maybe you need to look at your inventory again.

[drk]

I don't think you can do it with five lines, no matter how deep.

I look at it a few ways:
Styles: a lot like your wardrobe
1. dressy (wear to work, funeral, wedding)
2. casual (wear on weekends, home at night)
3. hip/trendy (wear going out for fun)

Now, people tend to dress in some combination of those basics. I'm a 1, and a 2, but my social life does not permit a 3.

I would say 50% casual, 40% trendy, 10% dressy?


Also, look at what's "available" in frames, these days:

1. Minimalistic: Rimless or semi-rimless. Also, thin eyewire metals.

2. Maximalistic:
a. Zyl, with a heavy profile. Color is critical with this, so I'd consider the muted palette blacks, browns, and creams and I'd also consider the multicolorful, patterned, bright colors.
b. Flat metal that for all purposes looks like zyl. Same color distinction.

3. Moderate

4. Those that don't work, now: preppy, double bar industrial strength.


Also, look at shapes:
Masculine: square, rectangle, softened rectangle. (Minimize double bar, round, and oval)

Feminine: Many more shapes to get: classic upsweep, various geometric, rectangular, some square, diamond/almond, butterfly?.


Also, look at style per country of origin:
Northern european (Scandanavian, German, Austrian) angular, colorful, technical, avant-garde
French: a little like above, but usually softer, more sophisticated, and more artistic
Italian: more sleek and sexy, less whimsy, more bold and powerful
Japanese: (anyone doing Japanese any more?) Detailed, angular, quality
American: whatever sells :)
Chinese: copies! :)

I have ten lines of 36 that I sell, and I think that's enough for me.

People looking for a style have either seen it around and it's hot, or want something that is 15 years out of style.

[Chris Ryser]

The main issue that evolves is the frame selection. The px has a specific style in mind due to previous specs or current trends but no frames in your store meet their needs.


I am wondering what has become of the opticians that knew which style fitted whom on the first shot.

Learning my optics in Europe we used to go to seminars given by frame manufacturers who hired sales psychologist's and frame designers that handled the courses.

We learned which shape face would be better for frame A than for frame B as well as for the different bifocals. We went through the mill until we could pick the right and the best frame for the patient as the first choice. We learned to explain how any of the other frames had negative effects on look or vision. Usually we always ended up selling the first frame tried, because it was the best choice.

We used to be in charge, had learned how to do it and had mostly happy customers that bought what we wanted them to buy. http://www.optiboard.com/forums/images/icons/icon14.gif

[For-Life]

I am wondering what has become of the opticians that knew which style fitted whom on the first shot.

Learning my optics in Europe we used to go to seminars given by frame manufacturers who hired sales psychologist's and frame designers that handled the courses.

We learned which shape face would be better for frame A than for frame B as well as for the different bifocals. We went through the mill until we could pick the right and the best frame for the patient as the first choice. We learned to explain how any of the other frames had negative effects on look or vision. Usually we always ended up selling the first frame tried, because it was the best choice.

We used to be in charge, had learned how to do it and had mostly happy customers that bought what we wanted them to buy. http://www.optiboard.com/forums/images/icons/icon14.gif

Oh, I am still pretty good at that. But remember, even in the last 10 years there has been an explosion of new frame designs and such. Much more complicated.

[Chris Ryser]

Oh, I am still pretty good at that. But remember, even in the last 10 years there has been an explosion of new frame designs and such. Much more complicated.


You chose the frames you carry in your store.

Frame purchasing should be done by all persons selling glasses. Learned that in the old days when the boss (my father) used to favor Marwitz frames and always ordered between 700 to 1000 frames from the Rep.

Then Rodenstock came with some new stuff and the Boss (my father) only ordered a small amount. All of us 5 opticians in the store just loved the new Rodenstock models which then had to be re-ordered while we were sitting on some Marwitz models for about 3 years.

That was when the sales reps had to face a democratic jury when selling frames.

Todays problems are the frame bars where people can choose from all stocked models and the art of real selling has been lost. The more you see the more complicated it gets, specially some women can spend an eternity choosing between 500 models. :hammer:

[EyeFitWell]

Chris-
I agree, opticians should know in their head what frame is best for that person from the moment they see the pt walk in. I frequently sell the first pair I show.
However, what about those customers who think they know better than you? It's not all that uncommon for someone to pick something up, try it on, and I explain it's too small for their head/presciption/etc. I explain why it's a concern and then I show them something different. Still, there are patients who insist that they want frame X even though I've told them it's not a good choice...

Plus, some people have very little understanding of what looks good and what doesn't. I'm amazed sometimes! For example, when a pretty older lady (light skin, grey hair) wants a thick, tortoise, harry-potter shaped frame! At the end of the day, it's their choice. I'm not going to insult a patient's fashion sense by telling them their taste is horrible! LOL

[Fezz]

the art of real selling has been lost.

What the heck is the art of selling? ;):D;)


We are not selling...we are dispensing!:cheers:

[cocoisland58]

What the heck is the art of selling? ;):D;)


We are not selling...we are dispensing!:cheers:

No really, we are selling. Dispensing is what we do when they pick them up. Embrace the retail.

[Barry Santini]

I am wondering what has become of the opticians that knew which style fitted whom on the first shot.

Learning my optics in Europe we used to go to seminars given by frame manufacturers who hired sales psychologist's and frame designers that handled the courses.

We learned which shape face would be better for frame A than for frame B as well as for the different bifocals. We went through the mill until we could pick the right and the best frame for the patient as the first choice. We learned to explain how any of the other frames had negative effects on look or vision. Usually we always ended up selling the first frame tried, because it was the best choice.

We used to be in charge, had learned how to do it and had mostly happy customers that bought what we wanted them to buy. http://www.optiboard.com/forums/images/icons/icon14.gif

Yeah, i agree with Chris on this one. There are *rules*, but:

1. They're NOT the ol' (useless, IMHO) *face-shape* guidelines that VICA (and the main fashion mags) *still* supports. THESE DO NOT WORK/RELATE FOR MOST CLIENTS!

2. Knowing when the *break* these rules is when something truly novel, interesting and comment-generating occurs.

We all know that the clients who say "....I get compliments wherever I go...(etc.)" are your most enthusiastic supporters.

My two cents, what's yours?

Barry

2.

[Barry Santini]

I'm amazed sometimes! For example, when a pretty older lady (light skin, grey hair) wants a thick, tortoise, harry-potter shaped frame!

Hey, that choice is a right-of passage for all older, lighter palettes. All the famous celebs do this as they get older.

I think that the "Sutton Place" area of Manhattan lives on it!

Barry

[EyeFitWell]

LOL...
My point was that you can have the perfect frame for everyone, but some people don't want that one. 98% of people want your imput and take it into consideration, but what do you do about the person who wants something hideously ugly? lol...

As far as S/O, I was doing this happily because that's how the boss liked it. But people really take advantage, wanting to order 5-6 at a time, and some people S/O some expensive things and never came back to get them. I thought we needed a deposit, boss didn't like it.
If you have someone that hard to fit, is it possible to invite them to join you when you next see that rep? I've done this a couple times and boy does it make your pt feel special!

[k12311997]

LOL...
If you have someone that hard to fit, is it possible to invite them to join you when you next see that rep? I've done this a couple times and boy does it make your pt feel special!


I did that once, and have had a few occasions of a rep being in the office while a pt is doing a frame selection, but never again if I can help it. As has been stated you try to find the perfect frame for the patient, but the rep just wants to make sure it is one of theirs.

[efsamuel]

Really the first thing to figure out is the type of look the patient wants. More and more I see patients that want a "unique" look and not the "trendy" look. Timeless if you will. That is where our "salesmanship" comes in. I usualy have picked out a more conservative and more bold style to show each person and let them choose. The great thing about this is I have already created a second pair scenario. I am in a pretty conservative yet affluent area so the look someone is wearing is very important. Whenever the look matters that much it does seem like time can be a big factor, if you keep ordering in frames for everyone make sure you are finding the right ones or you may start to cultivate the wrong message.